Florida Rocks... I will rather to live in Miami for good reason.

[ScraperDude]

I will disagree

[nimbyhater]

then leave

[miamicanes]

It's not really accurate to describe Hialeah as "ghetto". It would be more accurate to say that Hialeah's building and zoning department took a 20 year lunch break and allowed a situation to develop with illegal (and just plain bad) construction that it will NEVER be able to rectify because it would be political suicide.

I read somewhere that a conservative estimate is that something like 89% of the Hialeah's single-family homes have at least one MAJOR zoning/building code violation, and dozens of lesser ones. If their building or zoning department even TRIED to crack down on existing violations, public outrage would get the whole department fired within a matter of days. Their only hope is to someday meticulously document and grandfather all but the worst existing violations (and maybe even a few of THOSE), then try to enforce the building codes and zoning from that point forward.

Hialeah's main problem is the fact that pre-Cubans, it was basically white trash urban-fringe semi-rural outback, with lots of trailer parks and mediocre, poorly-maintained buildings. Stuff got done half-ass because nobody really cared, or really thought it would ever be anything BESIDES white-trash urban-fringe semi-rural outback. So they let people build buildings 20 feet from the (then 4-lane) Palmetto expressway, and as the rest of Miami grew, allowed developers to build low-rise condominiums with inadequate parking right next to industrial warehouses, off of roads a half step above gravel that weren't even up to the task of handling the traffic BACK THEN.

That said, if someone wanted to know the best place for someone without a lot of money to invest in real estate TODAY, I'd probably tell them to buy stuff in downtown Hialeah... thanks to all the road improvements in the area, it's become accessible to the rest of Dade County for the first time in history (as opposed to being a virtual peninsula, isolated by a hostile City of Miami Springs and canal to the south, generally dangerous hardcore-ghetto Liberty City to the east, and absolute road disaster along its western edge south of 103 st). South Beach is a 15 minute drive (or less). Brickell is 20. MIA is 10 minutes south, and best of all, most of Hialeah isn't even in a direct flight path. Hell, there's even a metrorail station in a fairly central location.

Downtown Hialeah is SO ripe for redevelopment it's scary. For developers, it's a dream come true, like working-class white ethnic neighborhoods in cities like Chicago and Pittsburgh -- depressed property values and not terribly pretty, but generally safe and stable, with existing residents that wealthier new arrivals don't automatically fear. And, in fact, far from being antagonistic towards the new arrivals, generally welcome the new residents because they own their own homes and don't have to worry about getting priced out of the neighborhood anyway, and it means they don't have to worry about their neighborhood going in the other (*nudge nudge*) direction (tu sabes... los moros)...

I don't have any problems with Hialeah, Its suicide to drive down 103 av lol. but its cool though, I love cuban food so its soo worth it to go down there.

[nimbyhater]

nicely put canes, i think hialeah is gonna b the next neighborhood that were gonna start seeing projects come out of

[streetscapeer]

Where is Downtown Hialeah?

and why is driving down 103rd suicide? Traffic? cause traffic was a HUGE BITCH when I last passed through there!

[nimbyhater]

ya, traffic is a huge bitch on 103rd, although that new onramp is a godsend, we need that in alot more places along the palmetto

i too am baffled, where is downtown hialeah, i didnt even no there was one

any new develelopment here is gonna b middle class, this will never b a high class neighborhood, but i do see a great many middle income nice midrise condominiums in the future for hialeah

[miamicanes]

Heading north on LeJeune, turn left onto Okeechobee and go to Curtiss Parkway and turn right at Palm Avenue.

There are a few places where you can actually envision it looking like downtown Coral Gables someday. Which isn't entirely a coincidence... Hialeah, Opa-Locka, and Coral Gables were all Merrick communities. When the real estate boom crashed in the 20s, Merrick abandoned Hialeah and Opa-Locka to save Coral Gables. But traces of his handiwork are everywhere, with the race track probably being the crown jewel.

From what I vaguely remember from a lecture by a Coral Gables historian back when I was at UM, Hialeah was originally supposed to have deep-water canals leading to the river (direct access to the bay!) and be an inland version of Coral Gables, complete with mansions and yachts.

It's obvious why downtown Hialeah 's there... back in the 20s, the part that most people NOW think of as Hialeah (by Westland Mall) was hardcore everglades, just like everything south of US-1 and the railroad tracks that used to be where Metrorail is now was. Miami's western development was almost entirely along US-41 (Tamiami Trail/SW 8 street) and US-27 (Okeechobee Road). Coral Gables' northern boundary is 8 street, Hialeah's southern boundary is Okeechobee rd. It's also fairly obvious why hardly anyone who doesn't live in Hialeah has ever been there... until VERY recently, all of the roads leading there from elsewhere in Miami were gridlocked disasters. The only reason I actually know about it is because last January (when I first started looking at condos) I considered buying a condo in Los Portales (a new development there where some builder bought a few dozen square blocks, demolished almost everything in sight, and built some fairly nice townhomes in their place.

I haven't been there in a while, but I think there is enough room between Hialeah Station and the racetrack to squeeze a strip of Downtown Dadeland-type condos and retail in there. In 3 or 4 years (when MIC is mostly done), Le Jeune road is going to be a clear shot all the way south to 836, and 74th street (aka "The Hialeah Expressway"), which happens to run straight west from the station, will be rebuilt and be an easy trek all the way to the Palmetto and Palmetto Station (another obvious candidate for Dadeland-style development). Okeechobee Station is probably a lost cause for urbanization, though... from what I remember, it's surrounded by hardcore industrial-type stuff and a big (most likely permanent) active rail yard that's probably fundamentally incompatible with even middle-class highrises and retail, let alone upscale ones.

Originally Posted by streetscapeer

Where is Downtown Hialeah?

and why is driving down 103rd suicide? Traffic? cause traffic was a HUGE BITCH when I last passed through there!

Traffic is terrible on 103 av, Okeechobee, le jeune. but again traffic is terrible all over South Florida I mean when I first moved to Pembroke Pines I used to take I 75 to go to work in Miami and it wasn't that bad, but now I 75 it's just like I 95 at rush hour terrible.

[jzquince69]

I've been to downtown Hialeah at nite. It's not that bad. Didn't they widen or improve Okeechobee a couple of years ago coming in from 826? I agree, getting in and out of Hialeah in the past was like that Bill Murray movie "Quick Change" when they got off the expressway somewhere in NYC and couldn't find their way back.

[streetscapeer]

Cool...thanks for all the info guys..I might have to make a trek out there when I go back to Miami for Christmas!

[ScraperDude]

Originally Posted by nimbyhater

then leave

No way I love Lauderdale. I just avoid Miami..........

[streetscapeer]

Originally Posted by ScraperDude

No way I love Lauderdale. I just avoid Miami..........

aww...why do you hate your big brother to the south?...p.s.I'm not trying to turn this into some malicious, mud-slinging battle (I'm sure uptown-mitown and nimbyhater will handle that for me), I just wanna know what you dislike about Miami that, conversely, Ft Lauderdale does better!

[ScraperDude]

Honestly I think Miami is very kewl. I like Lauderdale because the pace is slower its like a big small town. Im not a Miami hater I just stated I do not agree with someones earlier comment about what the city offers. If I did like Miami and it had what appeals to me I would be living there. Theres a lot of things that do not appeal to me but thats on a negative side and I don't want to turn this into that, so I simply stated "I disagree" and nimbyhaters response is "then leave"
I'm not there to begin with. I poped in here to find out more about Miami and why people talk it up and maybe find out more about areas I hav'nt seen and reshape my opinion.

[streetscapeer]

cool beans!

[nimbyhater]

lol, scraperdude, south florida would b a lesser place witout, that was my bad, lol

and street, me and uptown just jump on people's asses cause were passionate people, lol, its a cuban thing *wink, at least for me, i got no idea wat uptown is

[Aessotariq]

Originally Posted by jzquince69

I've been to downtown Hialeah at nite. It's not that bad. Didn't they widen or improve Okeechobee a couple of years ago coming in from 826? I agree, getting in and out of Hialeah in the past was like that Bill Murray movie "Quick Change" when they got off the expressway somewhere in NYC and couldn't find their way back.

Okeechobee Rd (US 27) has been widened to six lanes with median from Le Jeune Rd all the way to the Turnpike, except at the Palmetto interchange which is under construction... The newest segment, probably completed about 2 years ago, is from Le Jeune to NW 74th St, which has landscaped sidewalks and a palm tree-lined median.

In Hialeah Gardens (west of the Palmetto) a new intersection was built to provide a connection across the Miami Canal between S. River Drive and Okeechobee Rd... connecting Hialeah and Hialeah Gardens with Medley.

And right now, the biggest upgrade yet to open is the new flyover from northbound Le Jeune to north(west)bound Okeechobee... This is at the crossroads of NW 36th St, Okeechobee, Le Jeune Rd (NW 42nd Ave/E 8th Ave), and State Road 112. It's gonna be great once it finally opens.

Originally Posted by miamicanes

I haven't been there in a while, but I think there is enough room between Hialeah Station and the racetrack to squeeze a strip of Downtown Dadeland-type condos and retail in there. In 3 or 4 years (when MIC is mostly done), Le Jeune road is going to be a clear shot all the way south to 836, and 74th street (aka "The Hialeah Expressway"), which happens to run straight west from the station, will be rebuilt and be an easy trek all the way to the Palmetto and Palmetto Station (another obvious candidate for Dadeland-style development). Okeechobee Station is probably a lost cause for urbanization, though... from what I remember, it's surrounded by hardcore industrial-type stuff and a big (most likely permanent) active rail yard that's probably fundamentally incompatible with even middle-class highrises and retail, let alone upscale ones.

The Palmetto Station is ideal, however, it's a long shot since the station is in Medley, which tends to zone industrial almost exclusively.

I think there might also be potential for commercial development at the Tri-Rail transfer station (plus the Amtrak station is right there too) ... Interconnect the three terminals, build a retail complex, a few restaurants, build some condos... voilà! A whole new way to think about Ja-ya-lía...

[ChuckScraperMiami#1]

TIVO, Good INFO, But there still is a Part of Okeechobee Road thats still a Four-lane from the 74th street Connector to the Palmetto Expressway, If you drive it , like I do at least once a week, That part still has to be Done.

[miamicanes]

Originally Posted by tivo

The Palmetto Station is ideal, however, it's a long shot since the station is in Medley, which tends to zone industrial almost exclusively.

Methinks it's only a matter of time before Medley relaunches itself as "North Doral". When it comes to sheer tax value, you can beat luxury condos and upscale retail. Miami-Dade county (and to a lesser extent, the City of Miami) might fret about the loss of jobs due to escalating property values causing luxury condos to displace employment centers and send the jobs to Broward, but Medley has basically no residents to speak of anyway, and I suspect it could give a flying f**k about the consequences of encouraging unrestrained residential development there upon the rest of the county. Just imagine the Mayor of Medley's office, as s/he sits in front of an Excel spreadsheet, jaw dropped, upon seeing just how much cash is going to come rolling in from ONE 30 story luxury condo with a hundred half-million dollar units sitting across the street from Palmetto metrorail station alone...

Plus, it's not like most of Miami's "industry" is the dirty, noisy, unpleasant kind like they have in places like New York and the northeast. Let's face it... in Miami, buying a condo next door to an "industrial" area usually means something like a FedEx depot or electronics import company. Hell, the "industrial" park where I work (one of the hundreds in Beacon Center off 87th ave in Doral) WOULD actually be a pretty nice place to live ;-)

I give the industrial users within a quarter mile of Palmetto Station 10 years max before the last one is gone and the area makes Dadeland North look rural by comparison. Easy access to metrorail, Doral, and Hialeah. Big, brand new roads. A few hundred thousand upscale residents in Medley... who'd have ever thought it could happen just 10 years ago, when that area didn't even have a ZIP CODE, Doral was still under a sewage moratorium, and the next exit north after 836 was Okeechobee road?

[Aessotariq]

Originally Posted by miamicanes

Methinks it's only a matter of time before Medley relaunches itself as "North Doral". When it comes to sheer tax value, you can beat luxury condos and upscale retail. Miami-Dade county (and to a lesser extent, the City of Miami) might fret about the loss of jobs due to escalating property values causing luxury condos to displace employment centers and send the jobs to Broward, but Medley has basically no residents to speak of anyway, and I suspect it could give a flying f**k about the consequences of encouraging unrestrained residential development there upon the rest of the county.

Interesting thought... it would definitely be a paradigm shift for them... Doral developed and already had a good residential base before the County let them incorporate... The County was providing their services when it was part of UMSA (and almost basically still does now).. It would be the opposite for Medley -- already incorporated and used to providing MINIMAL residential municipal services.

I can't see very many places in Broward that could house all of those industries, or anyone who would want to take the "dirtier"/"dustier" ones. The clean warehouse bays would probably go to Miramar... But I don't see Miramar taking in Rinker and the cinder block plants.

I wonder what would happen to Miami International Airport and the Port of Miami cargo operations... Increased truck traffic traveling longer distances, etc., and a shift to using Fort Lauderdale and Port Everglades. Hmmm... so as all of this transit-oriented development is being built, and all the jobs going someplace where the transit network is decades behind. hmmm....

who'd have ever thought it could happen just 10 years ago, when that area didn't even have a ZIP CODE, Doral was still under a sewage moratorium, and the next exit north after 836 was Okeechobee road?

oh, yes... believe you me... I travel that stretch almost everyday and have seen the area explode.. I'm waiting for a 70-something'th Street exit as well as full speed Sunpass lanes à la 836 at the Okeechobee toll plaza...