daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old August 8th, 2011, 12:35 AM   #1
Uppsala
Registered User
 
Uppsala's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Uppsala, S, Europe
Posts: 654
Likes (Received): 53

A motorway from Berlin to Moscow

I think a motorway from Berlin to Moscow is an old dream for many. Specially for Russia and the EU. That means it is possible to go from London (via Eurotunnel trains) and Paris to Moscow and maybe more east in the future. I think this is something many polititians in Russia and the EU want to have like a symbol.

But we are not there yet. There are quite a lot of missing links now.

There is not any motorway from Berlin to Warsaw yet.

Is this something realistic with a motorway from Berlin to Moscow? Or is this just dreams?
Uppsala no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old August 8th, 2011, 12:39 AM   #2
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,525
Likes (Received): 21227

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uppsala View Post
Is this something realistic with a motorway from Berlin to Moscow? Or is this just dreams?
I guess the worse problems would be in Belarus, where, I imagine, no good roads exist whatsoever.
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 12:57 AM   #3
Alex Von Königsberg
Registered User
 
Alex Von Königsberg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Portland
Posts: 1,053
Likes (Received): 11

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I guess the worse problems would be in Belarus, where, I imagine, no good roads exist whatsoever.
Would you believe me if I said that Belarus roads are better than Russian and Ukrainian roads? Belarus does not have a developed road infrastructure (motels, restaurants, etc), but the road quality itself is very decent.
__________________
Go Cougs!
Alex Von Königsberg no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 01:51 AM   #4
Poul_
薄利多銷寵大企業。
 
Poul_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: KRAKÓW
Posts: 1,339
Likes (Received): 839

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uppsala View Post

But we are not there yet. There are quite a lot of missing links now.

There is not any motorway from Berlin to Warsaw yet.
A2 highway from German border to Warsaw will be ready in 2012 , the worse thing is that in the near future there are no plans to build highway from Warsaw to Belarusian border , as I know :/
__________________
Poul_ no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 01:55 AM   #5
DanielFigFoz
Registered User
 
DanielFigFoz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: No fixed abode
Posts: 4,428
Likes (Received): 890

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I guess the worse problems would be in Belarus, where, I imagine, no good roads exist whatsoever.
Visas and the not so sympathetic government of Belarus would be much more of an issue than their roads. I've seen photos of their main route to Russia and it was certaionly in good condition
DanielFigFoz no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 03:48 AM   #6
MrAkumana
Registered User
 
MrAkumana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: I'm a Nomad...?
Posts: 200
Likes (Received): 100

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz View Post
Visas and the not so sympathetic government of Belarus would be much more of an issue than their roads. I've seen photos of their main route to Russia and it was certaionly in good condition
Yes, even nowdays a Berlin-Moscow trip would be much easier through Poland, Lithuania and Latvia (all schengen members) and then to Moscow rather than via Poland and Belarus. It's a bit longer but you save time with one border check less (with unpredictable waiting time) and save money with one less visa.
__________________
"First things first, but not necessarily in that order" - The Doctor (Doctor Who)
MrAkumana no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 09:07 AM   #7
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I guess the worse problems would be in Belarus, where, I imagine, no good roads exist whatsoever.
Huuuuge misconception Belarus has the best roads in the former USSR (well, maybe apart from the Baltics), in fact, nearly all of the route from the Polish to the Russian border is a motorway. I even think Belarus has more motorways than Russia.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 09:07 AM   #8
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

M1 in Russia is also a 4-lane highway, the only two-lane sections are in Poland.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 09:15 AM   #9
LtBk
Registered User
 
LtBk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Greater Baltimore
Posts: 3,102
Likes (Received): 3705

How many km of motorways does Russia have?
LtBk no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 09:34 AM   #10
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

About 600 kilometers. Russia has many 4-lane routes, but most of them are not continuously grade-separated, they often have U-turns in the median. Belarus has almost 1000 km of motorways, and M1 accounts for approximately 60% of that.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 10:30 AM   #11
NordikNerd
Rail & Road traveller
 
NordikNerd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Linköping
Posts: 2,745
Likes (Received): 1407

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz View Post
Visas and the not so sympathetic government of Belarus would be much more of an issue than their roads. I've seen photos of their main route to Russia and it was certaionly in good condition
I don't think visas will be an issue. As far as I know citizens of Belorus do not need a visa for Poland and citizens of Belorus only need passport to enter Russia.

The motorway would certainly be used between those countries.
NordikNerd no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 10:58 AM   #12
fredis
Žalgiris Kaunas 4ever
 
fredis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Kaunas
Posts: 93
Likes (Received): 3

Will you be satisfied to wait on Belarus border for 4-6 hours? That’s how long takes for Lithuanians to enter Belarus and for Belarusians to enter Lithuania.
fredis no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 11:12 AM   #13
NordikNerd
Rail & Road traveller
 
NordikNerd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Linköping
Posts: 2,745
Likes (Received): 1407

Quote:
Originally Posted by fredis View Post
Will you be satisfied to wait on Belarus border for 4-6 hours? That’s how long takes for Lithuanians to enter Belarus and for Belarusians to enter Lithuania.
what's the waiting time Lithuania-Poland ? if you decide to visit Berlin this future motorway would be useful for all the baltic states.

Now I see estonian trucks on the swedish E4 driving south. I think many of them choose the ferry Tallinn-Stockholm on their route to Germany and other countries because of worn out roads and lengthy custom procedures in the Baltics and Poland.
NordikNerd no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 11:14 AM   #14
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

Quote:
Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post
what's the waiting time Lithuania-Poland ?
0 minutes since 2007...
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 11:55 AM   #15
Szatek
hurrapesymista
 
Szatek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Galicja ☠
Posts: 469
Likes (Received): 496

Motorway A2 from German border to Warsaw should be ready around December 2012. There was a problem with Chinese contractor on some sections but eventually COVEC withdrew from the investment and the contract with a new company has been signed. Question of second phase of A2 is still unsolved. The government is going to announce a contest for Private Public Partnership in development of 152km-long Motorway A2 to Belorussian border in November 2011. For me it's debatable if they'll manage to find a reliable partner in crisis time but let's hope so...

Last edited by Szatek; August 8th, 2011 at 12:00 PM.
Szatek no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 12:03 PM   #16
Fuzzy Llama
Puszysty samiec lamy.
 
Fuzzy Llama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Skierniewice/Warszawa
Posts: 741
Likes (Received): 8

Quote:
Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post
I don't think visas will be an issue. As far as I know citizens of Belorus do not need a visa for Poland
Yeah, right.

Belorussians need a visa to enter Schengen territory. Those Schengen-wide short stay visas cost about 60€, which is A LOT in the country where average monthly wage is about 200€. They also can obtain free Poland-only visas, but they only applies for long-term stays.

On the other side, getting a Belorussian visa for a Pole is a real nightmare. I've considered a trip East some time ago and I resigned - the visas are expensive and getting one requires dealing with so much paperwork that I've decided that it's not worth the expense.
Fuzzy Llama no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 12:13 PM   #17
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Before they even think about a motorway between Germany and Russia, step one would be to ease visa restrictions. I used to have a Russian girlfriend in St Petersburg, and you wouldn't believe how difficult it is to get a visa for Russia. For her it's easier to come to Schengen. Being so close to Finland, the Finnish consulate seems to supply Schengen-visa's like hot-dogs in New York City. I sometimes take her with me cruising around Europe in my van doing express deliveries, but once I have to go to England, she has to end up at a hotel in Calais, as GB isn't a Schengen-country, and she needs a separate visa.
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 04:04 PM   #18
ilyan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Minsk
Posts: 512
Likes (Received): 861

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Huuuuge misconception Belarus has the best roads in the former USSR (well, maybe apart from the Baltics), in fact, nearly all of the route from the Polish to the Russian border is a motorway. I even think Belarus has more motorways than Russia.
Indeed Section between Polish and Russian border not motorway. It's 4 lane expressway without crash barriers with pedestrain crossing in one level with highway in some places and intersection in one level in some places. In Russia they have only 4-lane highway almost all intersecion in one level with highway and only some stretchs with crash-barriers. They need much more resources to upgrade this section to motorway standarts then Belarus.
ilyan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 05:20 PM   #19
void0
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: St.Petersburg, Espoo
Posts: 2,098
Likes (Received): 2869

Somewhere between Moscow and Minsk
void0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2011, 05:52 PM   #20
Мартин
Registered User
 
Мартин's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Macedonia
Posts: 87
Likes (Received): 4

How come it isn't night already at 21:35?
Мартин no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium