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Old November 3rd, 2011, 03:27 PM   #101
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Please keep the photos coming
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 03:43 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 600West218
"Considering that close proximity - few people in Britain have actually ever visited many of their own cities - other than London. "

Yes, that is really stunning, especially considering how goof and convenient their rail network is. You could actually make a day trip out of traveling to most cities if you wanted to - certainly a very nice weekend trip. If I lived there I'd be pissing away a fortune on train tickets :-)
I think people do visit other cities actually quite often, I think most people have probably been to many of them at some point by the time they have a few years under their belt.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 03:44 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoldemortBlack
So upsetting that your first view of Manchester was depressing, I guess the weather didn't help! Looking forward to more
That stretch from Piccadilly Station to Piccadilly Gardens and the Arndale isn't the best introduction....
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 04:05 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz View Post
Great photos!

Many many places in Europe have loads of 1950s and 60s buildings in the town centres for a fairly obvious reason I think, and major cities in the UK are no exception
The difference is though, that whereas across most of Europe it was mostly always due to bomb damage from the war, in post war UK they just tore down stucturally sound old buildings for the sake of it, often in the name of "progress". And I'm not just talking about slum clearances (which in my view were wrong but were a necessary evil) which saw dense urban metropolises like this:



turn into this in the space of 30 years:



...but also fine buildings like the Imperial hotel being replaced with something that can only be described as grotesque:

image hosted on flickr


[img]http://t0.************/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTnrsSY0ym2ZkRQfoVso-R_wo8KCJstAtSdRvIIiZMVyVOkzaFBzQ[/img]

You really do have to question the sanity of some of Britain's post war planners and architects. What the hell were they thinking?

Last edited by Pennypacker; November 3rd, 2011 at 04:13 PM.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 04:10 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by 600West218 View Post
"The United Kingdom is 4 countries don't forget"

I guess I understand that it is four different peoples all with their own histories have they always been considered different countries legally? For example, isn't their having their own parliments rather new?

Seeing people there think of themselves as "English", or "Scottich", or "Welch" rather than British was definitely an eye opener for me.


England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland (later the Republic of Ireland - yet the Northern territories chose to remain in the Union, becoming Northern Ireland) were all different countries to start with... different laws, religions, cultures etc etc...

The Union you see today (in terms of how long the countries have existed) .. is only a reasonably recent event... some 300 odd years ago. That is when we were all tied together and the Union Flag came into being... however, it was always a complex beast.. each country retained many of its own laws.

Wales I believe was annexed to England first politically in 1535, followed by the crown of Ireland act which the Irish parliament proclaimed that the English king and his successors would also be king of Ireland in 1542...

Then the English monarchy and the Scottish monarchy were joined in 1603 (Union of the Crowns).. yet both countries remained sovereign states until 1707 when the treaty of Union came in affect, linking Wales (part of England at the time) England and Scotland into one nation.

In 1801, Ireland came into the fold fully (after other various links that were unpopular) creating The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.

Bearing in mind this is a VERY quick and vague explanation of things...

In 1920, however, Ireland passed an act which gave them freedom from Westminster and established their own home rule.. however, the Northern Irish states wished to remain British.. and so the country of Northern Ireland was created and the island of Ireland was partitioned with a new border.

Short of the long... we were all separate countries first... the Union flag is very new compared to the flags of England, Scotland.. etc etc..

"Britishness", is as old as the Union Flag, and was a necessity for being the engine for Empire. As the British Empire ended and was succeeded by the Commonwealth of Nations as it is today... the 'Home Nations' England, Scotland, Wales, N.I... began to re recognise their own roots again... and so came the re introduction of devolved governments for each country to deal with their own local affairs again, Westminster however, remains the 'Master Government'.

Last edited by LondonFox; November 3rd, 2011 at 04:21 PM.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 04:20 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PortoNuts View Post
Tons of towns could be added to this trip but time is limited.

Derby, for example, screams Industrial Revolution.
Indeed.

But to miss out the most important city of the industrial revolution is a bit strange if that's what he visited for.

There is a reason why it holds tags as ... "Workshop of the World", "Worlds First Industrial Town", "City Of A Thousand Trades".

It's the reason so many canals were built (Ala the old chesnut, more than Venice)

And the reason why Benjamin Franklin was a member of the Lunar Society that frequently met in Birmingham.

Birmingham and its surroudnign area even to this day still hosts more then half of all UK patents.

Just think it's a little weird that's all.

Last edited by Ecological; November 3rd, 2011 at 04:27 PM.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 04:22 PM   #107
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Define "most important".
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 04:26 PM   #108
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Interesting to see the Manchester cathedral connected with St. John the Devine (St. John the Unfinished) in New York. St. John the Devine tries to quarrel with Liverpool on being the biggest cathedral.

By the way, regarding the store with sewing machines in window, I think we have the same store in Boston on Newbury Street. Is it the same store? Is it a UK company? Forgive me for posting Boston pics, but just for point of reference. This is the Boston store:
image hosted on flickr

Last edited by Expat; November 3rd, 2011 at 06:04 PM.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 05:06 PM   #109
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Yes it's an All Saints store Not sure if it's British or not. There's another store in Manchester full of sewing machines in the window too
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 05:13 PM   #110
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He could have also visited Glasgow, which was once another manufacturing powerhouse and still is thanks to shipbuilding. Like I said, we don't know how his schedule was.

If he came through Manchester Airport and time was tight, it makes sense he preferred to stay in that corridor around the Northeast.

Birmingham and its surroundings would probably require a trip on its own, especially with Coventry on its door step.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecological View Post
Indeed.

But to miss out the most important city of the industrial revolution is a bit strange if that's what he visited for.

There is a reason why it holds tags as ... "Workshop of the World", "Worlds First Industrial Town", "City Of A Thousand Trades".

It's the reason so many canals were built (Ala the old chesnut, more than Venice)

And the reason why Benjamin Franklin was a member of the Lunar Society that frequently met in Birmingham.

Birmingham and its surroudnign area even to this day still hosts more then half of all UK patents.

Just think it's a little weird that's all.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 05:16 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennypacker View Post
Define "most important".
Where would you like me to start? With the Steam Engine? Petrol Driven Car? Where do you think the term Watt came from? Horsepower? Crank Engine? Letter Copying Machine even the Ink to go with it? Gears? Coinage Coppier? Leather? The Stove? Gas Lighting? Even the first ever transatlantic telegraph cable some 16,000 miles long was made in Birmingham? The Whistle? What you see on Skateboards and Roller Skates was thanks to a Birmingham inventor with a unique axel. Used in many automobiles and machinery today also. X Rays?

Quote:
The Industrial Revolution was powered by Birmingham's ingenuity and has been described by The Daily Telegraph newspaper as a city which created the Industrial Revolution.

In the year 2000, of the 4,000 inventions copyrighted in the UK, 2,800 came from within a 35-mile radius of Birmingham. Peter Colegate of the Patent Office stated that "Every year, Birmingham amazes us by coming up with thousands of inventions. It is impossible to explain but people in the area seem to have a remarkable ability to come up with, and have the dedication to produce, ideas."
Anyway. Back on topic. Great pictures. One day do come visit Birmingham and it's quarters.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 05:38 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Expat View Post
By the way, I think we have the same store in Boston on Newbury Street. Is it the same store? Is it a UK company? Forgive me for posting Boston pics, but just for point of reference. This is the Boston store:
image hosted on flickr


AllSaints Spitalfields Clothing is a British company yes. Spitalfields is a parish in London.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 05:41 PM   #113
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Brilliant pictures.

Really looking forward to Leeds ASAP!!
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 07:04 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Expat View Post
By the way, regarding the store with sewing machines in window, I think we have the same store in Boston on Newbury Street.
Sad to hear of the demise of Filenes. Did you know that the term, "Bargain basement" originated at Filenes?
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 07:08 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PortoNuts View Post
Birmingham and its surroundings would probably require a trip on its own, especially with Coventry on its door step.
True, very true.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 07:14 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
I think people do visit other cities actually quite often, I think most people have probably been to many of them at some point by the time they have a few years under their belt.
Don't agree with you there at all. When I lived in Buckinghamshire, for example - it really was true that people almost, did think the north of england was a foreign country.

Most people, anywhere in the world, tend not to venture too far from their own back yard. Many British people know more about Spain or the Canary Islands, for example, than they do about other parts of Britain.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 08:01 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LondonFox View Post
England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland (later the Republic of Ireland - yet the Northern territories chose to remain in the Union, becoming Northern Ireland) were all different countries to start with... different laws, religions, cultures etc etc...

The Union you see today (in terms of how long the countries have existed) .. is only a reasonably recent event... some 300 odd years ago. That is when we were all tied together and the Union Flag came into being... however, it was always a complex beast.. each country retained many of its own laws.

Wales I believe was annexed to England first politically in 1535, followed by the crown of Ireland act which the Irish parliament proclaimed that the English king and his successors would also be king of Ireland in 1542...

Then the English monarchy and the Scottish monarchy were joined in 1603 (Union of the Crowns).. yet both countries remained sovereign states until 1707 when the treaty of Union came in affect, linking Wales (part of England at the time) England and Scotland into one nation.

In 1801, Ireland came into the fold fully (after other various links that were unpopular) creating The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.

Bearing in mind this is a VERY quick and vague explanation of things...

In 1920, however, Ireland passed an act which gave them freedom from Westminster and established their own home rule.. however, the Northern Irish states wished to remain British.. and so the country of Northern Ireland was created and the island of Ireland was partitioned with a new border.

Short of the long... we were all separate countries first... the Union flag is very new compared to the flags of England, Scotland.. etc etc..

"Britishness", is as old as the Union Flag, and was a necessity for being the engine for Empire. As the British Empire ended and was succeeded by the Commonwealth of Nations as it is today... the 'Home Nations' England, Scotland, Wales, N.I... began to re recognise their own roots again... and so came the re introduction of devolved governments for each country to deal with their own local affairs again, Westminster however, remains the 'Master Government'.
Thanks for the explanation! It may have been brief but it is actually very helpful to me.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 08:09 PM   #118
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On the Birmingham issue I actually did have it on my itinerary at one point.

I spent a lot of time planning this and got LOTS of invaluable help from the people in the UK skybar in this thread:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1436915

I ultimately decided that trying to cover Birmingham in this one two week trip would be too much and I am glad I made that decision. But the last several days of this trip I was quite worn down and tired and really burned out of seeing museums.

For instance, I was in York my second to last day and went to the rail museum there. It is a phenomenal world class museum. But I just didn't have the energy to do it justice and only spent a couple hours there when the museum really merritted the greater part of a day.

I really want to go to Birmingham. I must see the "iron" town outside it where the first iron bridge was built and I have heard Birmingham has more canals than everywhere else - and as you'll see soon in this thread I LOVE canals. But Birmingham needs to be the first 4 or 5 days on a separate trip to do it justice so I am glad I didn't try to squeeze it in on this one.

The UK has so much to see it will be 4 or 5 two weeks trips even to cover the basics of what I want to see. And each time I go I will add to the list. Now I want to do a trip hiking accross England by following the canals. Also, people in Liverpool told me that if I liked Liverpool and old industrial cities I should definitely go to Belfast. So now Ireland is on my list of places to go.

No one can do it all at once... we just have to do what we can and keep plugging away.
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 08:32 PM   #119
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600West218, you cannot be blamed for not visiting every city! You have shown us much already. All the more reason to return!
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Old November 3rd, 2011, 11:53 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoldemortBlack View Post
Yes it's an All Saints store Not sure if it's British or not. There's another store in Manchester full of sewing machines in the window too
Also one in Newcastle.
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