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Old November 4th, 2011, 09:59 PM   #161
Steel City Suburb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennypacker View Post
Hang on, in the paragraph before you just said the only city in the North you've been to is Edinburgh.

Nice to see you're basing your opinions on experience...
Agree with this.

The north is rich, no bias southerner can claim otherwise.
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:09 PM   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz

Down here in London I disagree with you, I've never been to Manchester, Liverpool or Birmingham. (I've seen Birmingham and Manchester though but never stopped, a few times) I think that most people here have probably been to one but not all. In fact the only other major places I've been to in the UK are Edinburgh and Belfast. I've been to a few mid-size places like Portsmouth and Leicester. Then again I've only had a few years thus far, I'm only in 6th form.

Unfortunately I have to agree with other posters that for me, north of Hemel Hampstead is like another country, and I do say this with shame
Maybe those living close to London don't get around the country as much. Some people there tend to think there's no point going anywhere else because London has everything I find. Maybe living in a smallish town in between lots of bigger cities we tend to get about more.

To be fair I don't think I'd been to lots of places at 17/18 either, now though I've had twice that time!
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:12 PM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennypacker View Post
Hang on, in the paragraph before you just said the only city in the North you've been to is Edinburgh.

Nice to see you're basing your opinions on experience...
I'm not saying that I'm glad or anything or that it is another country, but If I said that it didn't seem like that I'd be lying

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel City Suburb View Post
Agree with this.

The north is rich, no bias southerner can claim otherwise.
I'm not saying its not, I'm not saying the South is any better or anything like that, I don't know, but it does seem so far away.
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:32 PM   #164
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I think you could just be comparing metropolitan england with rural england if you haven't been to any other core cities in the country.
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:37 PM   #165
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Not really no, I've been to the country side, and its not even a comparison, but I don't know that much about the North in a way. I would really like to visit the other major cities in the UK
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:40 PM   #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz View Post
Not really no, I've been to the country side, and its not even a comparison, but I don't know that much about the North in a way. I would really like to visit the other major cities in the UK
Good on you, Daniel!

Can't wait for photo updates.
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:47 PM   #167
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I grew up in and live in london, and while i wouldn't consider myself typical.... i've been to the following cities in britain:
glasgow
edinburgh
newcastle
york
leeds
sheffield
manchester
nottingham
exeter
plymouth
bristol
brighton
preston
carlisle
berwick
helensburgh
belfast
newquay
winchester
cheltenham
i can go on forever

i think its not necessarily true at all that everyone or even most people in britain know nothing about their country, and its stupid to make assumptions based on yourself/friends or your anecdotal evidence.

ps no intention to derail a great thread! i love the way the pictures and texts builds a narrative and a perspective.. you had me hooked all the way through and i'm looking forward to leeds, a city i'm quite familiar with
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:51 PM   #168
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So why not Liverpool? It seems a curious omission, considering you have visited every other major city.

Lots of us have been to university interviews in different cities, or to a work meeting for a day - but saw no more than the train station and a few streets
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Old November 4th, 2011, 10:54 PM   #169
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This has been a really interesting read so far - looking forward to the rest. As a Northener (growing up around Sheffield and Leeds) I think we're spoilt in terms of rich city diversity.

Now I live down south there's not so much choice, sure London has a lot, but around the northern side of it, until you hit Birmingham/Nottingham there's nothing to call a proper city (though Cambridge/Oxford do have their perks).

I have family from Surrey, and now working down south - there are a lot of people who view the North as completely foreign to them ("...anything north of Watford is not worth visiting") when it is such a vast, diverse place with a lot of wealth (in areas). It's a hideous attitude that I'm not a fan of.
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Old November 4th, 2011, 11:01 PM   #170
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In the US, northerners and southerners are always quarreling.

Apparently, we learned it from the mother country! North vs. South!
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Old November 4th, 2011, 11:35 PM   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 600West218 View Post
Now, this is a strange picture:

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The reason I say it is strange is that in this picture this warehouse looks small for some reason whereas in reality it is HUGE. Not Tobacco Warehouse size but certainly very big. I don’t know what its history is but it impressed me and I would go in it a couple times later.
It was the goods depot of the adjacent Central Station (now a convention centre).

Here's an image from the 1930s showing it in use (also shows the wonderful churches and Georgian terraces that have since been demolished, mainly in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, sniff..).



The remaining viaducts were demolished just a few years ago to make way for the entertainment complex and the Beetham/Hilton Tower

Last edited by AnIco; November 4th, 2011 at 11:38 PM. Reason: fix image
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Old November 5th, 2011, 12:19 AM   #172
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Very interesting walk around Manchester. The Victorians were truly exceptional people but I'm also very fond of the modern developments, cities need a fresh face as well.
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Old November 5th, 2011, 12:21 AM   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnIco View Post
It was the goods depot of the adjacent Central Station (now a convention centre).

Here's an image from the 1930s showing it in use (also shows the wonderful churches and Georgian terraces that have since been demolished, mainly in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, sniff..).



The remaining viaducts were demolished just a few years ago to make way for the entertainment complex and the Beetham/Hilton Tower
Fascinating picture. I assume the block of residential houses to the left of Deansgate there is now the St John St/Liverpool St area? In fact you can see the railway warehouse that is now used by MOSI to the far left of the picture.
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Old November 5th, 2011, 01:03 AM   #174
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That 1930's photos quite interesting, its like a railway line coming out of a normal building

Quote:
Originally Posted by PadArch View Post
i think its not necessarily true at all that everyone or even most people in britain know nothing about their country, and its stupid to make assumptions based on yourself/friends or your anecdotal evidence.
I didn't even provide evidence, nor should my word be taken for granted, as I said, what do I know, its just how I have seen it
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Old November 5th, 2011, 01:43 AM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by openlyJane View Post
So why not Liverpool? It seems a curious omission, considering you have visited every other major city.

Lots of us have been to university interviews in different cities, or to a work meeting for a day - but saw no more than the train station and a few streets
well I'm still relatively young, it takes time to visit everywhere

Got nothing against liverpool at all (except the accent )
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Old November 5th, 2011, 03:05 AM   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoldemortBlack

Fascinating picture. I assume the block of residential houses to the left of Deansgate there is now the St John St/Liverpool St area? In fact you can see the railway warehouse that is now used by MOSI to the far left of the picture.
Yep and the buildings you mention as making up mosi is actually the camp field markets section, the warehouses are further down, the church at the bottom is St Mathews here's a link that tells you a bit about the area, the guys documented and researched photos etc of whole swathes of Manchester ( http://manchesterhistory.net/manches...neforever.html) so the buildings on left and right of St Mathews makes up lower and upper campsfield market which were moved from St Anne's square sometime in 18something.mthe church above fit is St Johns ( http://manchesterhistory.net/manches...neforever.html ) making it the focal point for Byron street. All in all it's just two of thirteen/fourteen churches demolished from 1900-1980s last one being St Paul's on great ancoats street.

Also from the photo alnco posted, the long row of buildings on the left of the railways was built to screen it screening a long line of shops.

Ok il shut up now :p I've given enough info.

Last edited by chase_me; November 5th, 2011 at 04:15 AM.
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Old November 5th, 2011, 03:50 AM   #177
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That Manchesterhistory.net site is fantastic. Before I return I will be using that site alot to plan walks.

Thanks for sharing and there is no need for you to "shut up". The site is improved when people like you talk alot :-)
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Old November 5th, 2011, 04:35 AM   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 600West218
That Manchesterhistory.net site is fantastic. Before I return I will be using that site alot to plan walks.

Thanks for sharing and there is no need for you to "shut up". The site is improved when people like you talk alot :-)
Ha, thanks :p I've done a fair bit of research concerning old buildings etc in manchester. One of the more spectacular warehouses you might have come across would've been along whitworth street where the mill owners had to house their stock and each building out doing the next to show who was richer by building elaborate warehouses. One is actually a hotel, the britania, it looks tacky since they've put those fairy like lights around the windows etc but it's still got its original elaborate staircases etc also the warehouses in the northern quater which mixes with a few 18c weavers townhouses.

Oh and those black and white pubs you saw when you were going to the cathedral? Here's a pic of then in their original position ( http://images.manchester.gov.uk/web/...e&refirn=68035 ) a lot more crooked and less, artificial looking than they are now. You can tell that this pic was taken after the war as the pic is taken quite far away where there would've been buildings ( notice the kind of dirt space in front the road. The original position is kindamofmwheremthe corner of. M&S is now, the tower you see in the photo is the royal exchange. And this is the buildings in 1946 http://images.manchester.gov.uk/web/...e&refirn=67501 ) as you can see there's quite a lot of buildings gone due to bomb damage around here it's lucky they survived.

If you want to look at more pics of old manchester etc were lucky that there's plenty of photos around, especially since just before the war and afterwards when a society took pictures to remind us of what it looked like before the war and what survived the war but not the planners. This is the website where Manchester council has collected them http://images.manchester.gov.uk/index.php?session=pass . Just type in the name of a building, area or street Or theme and it should Have something ( though not everything will have had a photo, ie castlefield, though it might be under a different name as there was only one pic when I checked.) So for those pubs i put in "shambles" in the search box and every photo or drawing to do with them came up, think there's a drawing of them going back to 1600s?

There's also a Flickr page but I can give it later when I'm on my pc. But an interesting book (no pictures or not much) about buildings in the Manchester region (greater Manchester and south lancashire) is called "lancashire: Manchester and the south east" by Nikolaus Pevsner. It details the buildings , what style they are and short history etc who built it and stuff. Quite excellent if you're into architecture. He travelled all over the UK so he has separate books for each city/region so since you like liverpoolmso much you cold look him up, and it'll give you a wealth of information about the buildings you saw.

Ok, essay over. I think I've given you much to ponder and look at...for now :p

p.s I've just realized that I forgot to mention that most councils will have a photographic archive of their city and it's surrounds, so check the Liverpool website/ type liverpool photograph archive in google and something sold turn up (council or private collections or libraries)

Last edited by chase_me; November 5th, 2011 at 04:47 AM.
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Old November 5th, 2011, 06:51 AM   #179
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Thursday morning I woke up in southern Manchester, in some garden apartments that looked amazingly similar to where I grew up. What a coincidence!

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This housing didn’t seem to be typical of that area, but it was nice. Also very nice was the fact that some really nice restaraunts were within very easy walking distance. In fact, Wednesday night I had an absolutely delicious Persian dinner. South Asian food seems to really be taking over in England, and who knows maybe that is for the better.

To get into the city center, the Museum of Science and Industry was my destination, I took one of the double decker busses. I road on the top in the very first row and felt like I had my own tour bus!! The following are some pictures from that great vantage point:

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I really like Kebabs so I could get used to Manchester’s food quickly I think.

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About to enter the “Curry Mile” which I had been told was an interesting site.

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Interesting, I guess that is the Hilton in the center, straight ahead. I didn’t notice it when I was actually on the bus.

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Saw a fair amount of woman in Burhkas as you see in this picture. It was clear there is a large Muslim population in England.

Further along we passed some university buildings and also an NHS. My interest was too great so even though it wasn’t in my plans I decided to get off the bus and explore the medical center.

I had to walk back to where the hospital was and when by this strange looking thing:

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100_2283 by 600West218, on Flickr

Then I came to the hospital buildings which I had seen. Of course they were old and very ornate so that was interesting. But what made me even more curious was the question of whether or not these were really what British hospitals looked like. If so maybe the image the US media portrays of European health care systems - that they are old and decrepid - was right.

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A very old building with lots of character but is this really what NHS hospitals are like? Yikes!

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The next picture was not part of the hospital but rather some sort of Museum:

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Back to the medical center:


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Finally I get to the end of the block and run into some modern student housing.

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Then I see there is more up this side street so I start walking in that direction

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Apparently they are building some new medical facilities and homes for patients with cancer.

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I get a full block in and it seems as if I’m in a different city - some very modern buildings:

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Turns out this is part of the same medical center and this is the Childrens Hospital. What a difference one block makes. THIS looks like a very nice hospital.

Being a bit brazen I decide to go inside and see what happens. I only really attempt this because I have come so far and I am very curious to see what it is like inside. But I expect it will be like an American hospital and I won’t make it past the security guards. Yet when I get inside much to my surprise there don’t seem to be any security guards. Only one person sort of working as a greeter.

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100_2304 by 600West218, on Flickr

The inside seems very nice and modern and the atrium is a very nice touch.

As I was a bit nervous about even being in the building, where I really had no legitimate reason to be, much less taking photos are only took a few photos with my Iphone.

This is looking back towards the entrance from the stairs to the next level:

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IMG_6260 by 600West218, on Flickr

This is up on the second floor walk way through the atrium:

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Looking from that walk way down into the waiting area of a Pediatric Ambulatory Care waiting area. Certainly looked VERY nice and they had a play area for the children:

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Looking back into the waiting area from the first floor. Everything seems shiny and new.


I went back outside to continue exploring the medical center:


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What a radical change of impressions. From small and decrepid to new, sleek and huge.

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An Eye Hospital. Where I work there is an eye hospital too (called the Eye Institute) so I decided I should try to sneak in here too.

Once again there seemed to be no security at all, just an empty desk for me to walk past.

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Inside it was another large atrium.

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Typical hospital message, even if no one ever does it.

These facilites were clearly very nice. Of course, that doesn’t tell you much about the quality of the care but clearly significant amounts of money are being invested and this hospital was as good or better, facility wise, as anything you’d see in the US.

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100_2315 by 600West218, on Flickr

Never did figure out what those zig zagging lines on the pavement were for.

With that I got back on the bus and got went to the Museum of Science and Industry (MOSI) as quickly as possible as I had already lost a significant part of the day due to my curiousity.

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100_2317 by 600West218, on Flickr

This first exhibit facing me was supposed to be one of the very first electronic computers in the world. It was built in Manchester in 1948 and used vacuum tubes (transistors were only invented that year) and it had a cathode ray tube that supposedly served as its memory. Never did grasp how that worked.

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Then I walked into the next exhibit which was on electricity. It had a sign which first pointed to something I was going to notice in a big way in all the museums I would see on this trip and that is that what historical explanation you are given depends on where you are, who is writing the history, and who is their intended audience.

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100_2320 by 600West218, on Flickr

In this sign they talk about alternating current electricity and make it sound as if it was developed by someone named Sebastian Ziani de Ferranti who apparently lived in Manchester.

Funny , but in Niagara Falls New York they explain that alternating current electricity was first developed by Nicholas Tesla and it was done in Niagara Falls with no mention of de Ferranti just as the exhibit in MOSI never mentioned Tesla.

They can’t both be right can they? Clearly there is some civic boosterism going on here. I would also notice this in many of the war museums where England’s role in the roles would be emphasized while the roles of others such as the US is downplayed - and of course in the US the exact same thing is done, simply in reverse. One generally thinks of museums as fairly objective perveyers of facts yet in reality they often over emphasize the role their own community or country played. Don’t know if that is because they think that is what their visitors will want to hear or if the curators themselves have those biases.

Behind this they had the big exhibit on textiles and cotton processing machinery.

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These photos are actually a bit out of order as the one above should be among the first as that is one of the first steps in the process.

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These things always blow my mind. That is an automated loom with the punch card a primative computer that tells which warps to engage and so puts a pattern in what is being made. I’ve never been able to understand how it works (mechanically, not theoretically).

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100_2331 by 600West218, on Flickr

There you can see a pattern of the type made by the punched hole cards.

While this was a reasonably comprehensive exhibit that could give you a basic background on cotton processing and textile fabrication it had two very big drawbacks:

1) it was completely static. At least while I was there none of the machinery actually ran. Plenty of other places get this old stuff to run - Lowell in the United States and the Leeds Industrial Museum in England - so I don’t understand why Cottonapolis wouldn’t get its looms running too.

2) there were no explainers or guides around so there was no one you could ask quetsions of.

Outside there were some interesting old trains being moved around. In fact, the rail station in MOSI is supposed to be one of the very first train stations in the world and the oldest that remains at its original site.

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I believe this is the old station

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Next came a major downer. The Power Hall, where all the steam engines are located, was closed that week for renovations. Totally sucked. Little did I know I would have the good fortune to get inside it when I returned to Manchester at the very end of my trip.

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There was one hall that gave a very good history of industry in Manchester and its effects on the population and their living conditions.

After that I headed over to the aviation hall which turned out to be surprisingly good.

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When I first saw this from a different angle I got all excited as I thought I was looking at a Lancaster Bomber. Turned out it was a primitive AWACs type plane based on the fuesalage of the Lancaster and with different engines too.

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Very strange window on the front with the wind shield wiper. Totally un aerodynamic!!

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A Japanese WWII Kamikaze plane.

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Finally I left MOSI and was back out on the streets of Manchester.

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100_2380 by 600West218, on Flickr

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Of course, I was immediately drawn back to the spectacular viaducts and canals of the Castle Field area.

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100_2389 by 600West218, on Flickr

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On the left is the Manchester YHA youth hostel where I spent my last night in England. Can’t recommend it.

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The person on the left gives some scale.

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One thing I noticed in England is that it seemed to be over run by Canadian tourists.

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They were way to friendly. Obviously people feed them alot.

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In England I learned a very interesting fact - any town or city ending in “chester” was originally a Roman settlement. Thus, Manchester was originally a Roman settlement and there are some ruins right by the Castlefield area which I visited.

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An old Roman defensive trench.

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I believe this may have been rebuilt, not original.

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Back on Deansgate road I had to take a picture of this building which was amazingly long

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This was a stunning old hotel:

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Note all the exterior piping. If someone knows what that is and why it is like that maybe they can explain it. Certainly looks interesting.

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In this one the piping really stands out:

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Another look at the piping:

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This is another library mainly hidden because it is undergoing renovations.

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Along the canals in the center:

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And finally back to the bus staion by the ugly towers around Piccadilly Gardens. With that the sight seeing of my first full day in Manchester concluded and I headed back south on the 111 bus.

Last edited by 600West218; November 5th, 2011 at 06:56 AM.
600West218 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 5th, 2011, 12:04 PM   #180
openlyJane
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Liverpool
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PadArch View Post
well I'm still relatively young, it takes time to visit everywhere

Got nothing against liverpool at all (except the accent )
Perhaps when you visit you will realise there all manner of shades and variety of Liverpool accent - and like in London - quite a few people have a 'neutral' accent too. Not everybody in London speaks in a broad cockney twang do they?
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