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Old March 29th, 2008, 06:48 PM   #681
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I think the customer service culture of the TTC has died in the last few years, and that's the crux of the problem for me. When they don't seem to deserve what the are getting now, it's hard to accept that they would want more money for compensation or safety reasons.

They're threatening work-to-rule, well to be honest the only thing that sounds different is that they wont be wearing their uglyass uniforms.
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Old March 30th, 2008, 03:03 AM   #682
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sumisu View Post
I think the customer service culture of the TTC has died in the last few years, and that's the crux of the problem for me. When they don't seem to deserve what the are getting now, it's hard to accept that they would want more money for compensation or safety reasons.

They're threatening work-to-rule, well to be honest the only thing that sounds different is that they wont be wearing their uglyass uniforms.
Actually, in the past two or so years I've been seeing more and more drivers that are much kinder and have much better customer service skills. While there are obviously still *******s, the nice drivers seem to outnumber them now.

On a side note, easily the nicest driver I've ever seen drives the 2 Milken bus every now and then. He always has a smile on, greets and chats with customers, and is just so damn happy you'd think he was high on anti-depressants
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Old March 30th, 2008, 02:01 PM   #683
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Originally Posted by Electrify View Post
Actually, in the past two or so years I've been seeing more and more drivers that are much kinder and have much better customer service skills. While there are obviously still *******s, the nice drivers seem to outnumber them now.

On a side note, easily the nicest driver I've ever seen drives the 2 Milken bus every now and then. He always has a smile on, greets and chats with customers, and is just so damn happy you'd think he was high on anti-depressants
Nothing... and I mean NOTHING... tops the subway driver that sang each stop announcement. Been on his train more than once, I am convinced he uses a recording, but the whole train bursts out giggling on that train, it's quite a priceless sight.
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Old March 30th, 2008, 05:21 PM   #684
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not anymore with the automated announcement, and the woman mispronouncing stations like Eglinton she says EglinGton and York Mill instead of York Mills.
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Old March 30th, 2008, 06:41 PM   #685
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not anymore with the automated announcement, and the woman mispronouncing stations like Eglinton she says EglinGton and York Mill instead of York Mills.
You're clearly not a native of Toronto, it IS pronounced EglinGton, in fact, some people do mis-spell it EglinGton because of the very fact that that is the local pronounciation of that name, and people understand how one could make the mistake usually.

I read that the TTC researched the local neighborhood pronounciation of all the names in the system when doing the recording project for the automated system. A lot of the names are not pronounced the same way they are spelled. Frankly, that's one of the more convenient things about Japanese - there's only one way to read hiragana.
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Old March 31st, 2008, 01:40 PM   #686
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It is true that some place names are not pronounced the way they are spelled. Spadina, Yonge, and Toronto are perfect examples of this. Many other place names are simply pronounced wrong. They are not said correctly due to poor English or a large immigrant population that aren't native English speakers.

People who say EglinGton are people who have poor language skills. Immigrants come here and regurgitate what they hear not knowing that they are imitating uneducated people. It doesn't make it correct.

In an immigrant rich city like Toronto, it is important that TTC staff and intercom messages use proper English. How are newcomers going to learn how to speak the language when they keep hearing conflicting messages? There is a big difference between Eglinton and EglinGton. A non-English speaker is not going to pick up on that. If I was trying to learn English, I'd assume the a city institution like the TTC knew how to speak English. We are making the transition very difficult when we accept sub-standard English. It will also come back to bite us in the ass. It already is.

Try explaining to most people these days that cinema and theatre are not interchangeable words.
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Old March 31st, 2008, 02:53 PM   #687
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It is true that some place names are not pronounced the way they are spelled. Spadina, Yonge, and Toronto are perfect examples of this. Many other place names are simply pronounced wrong. They are not said correctly due to poor English or a large immigrant population that aren't native English speakers.

People who say EglinGton are people who have poor language skills. Immigrants come here and regurgitate what they hear not knowing that they are imitating uneducated people. It doesn't make it correct.
You contradict yourself in that statement.

Like I told sumisu, it IS pronounced EglinGton. You cannot say that I - or anyone in my family actually, have poor language skills, all of us are at least tri-lingual and lived in different countries that don't speak english, but as a Toronto native since childhood, I have ALWAYS known the pronounciation of it to be EglinGton, and most people would agree. This is not some immigrant bullshit like you try to proclaim, you were right at the start of your post: some names are not pronounced phonetically.

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In an immigrant rich city like Toronto, it is important that TTC staff and intercom messages use proper English. How are newcomers going to learn how to speak the language when they keep hearing conflicting messages? There is a big difference between Eglinton and EglinGton. A non-English speaker is not going to pick up on that. If I was trying to learn English, I'd assume the a city institution like the TTC knew how to speak English. We are making the transition very difficult when we accept sub-standard English. It will also come back to bite us in the ass. It already is.
No, it is just that your ass is backwards. This is not some sub-standard English horseshit. The TTC is being very smart (and avoiding ridicule by the locals) by making the effort to make sure they pronounce the name the same way as the locals in that area. The locals of each area would unquestionably know best, they've lived there, many must have grown up there, surely some have been there for a generation in most of these places. They know how to pronounce these names. These are not "immigrant retards" like you try to pass them off as. The TTC IS using the proper pronounciation. You need to realize that in every language, there are enough names that don't follow the rules to the letter. There is no conflicting message being sent by the TTC on this, the TTC has done their homework, and if anything, they will be helping set the record straight on the pronounciations because they got the proper pronounciations straight from the horse's mouth.

Frankly, it is the person that tries to pronounce it as EgliNton, phonetically, that looks like the foreigner. The natives pronounce it EglinGton.

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Try explaining to most people these days that cinema and theatre are not interchangeable words.
That's a completely different topic (not the same thing at all, completely unrelated to pronounciation) and you are being absurd.
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Old March 31st, 2008, 06:31 PM   #688
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cinema and theatre are two different things. A cinema and a Movie theatre on the the other hand are the same thing.

and I know a crap load of people who say EgliNton. Born-here's and immigrants, only a few that inject a G into it...
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Old March 31st, 2008, 07:24 PM   #689
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But I still think mean customers are just a fact of life

...so are unions.

Please stop discussing the issue as if they were supposed to give up any of the rights or options afforded to them as part of the bargaining process according to "your" whims. Doesn't work that way.

The vast majority spouting opinions about the issue here, have no clue what they are talking about anyway....go apply...get accepted...do the training...do the job for a while. And then pass judgement on what the job is like.




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Old April 12th, 2008, 03:52 AM   #690
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According to the civil servant pay release... 3 ticket collectors made over $100,000 last year.

A TTC ticket collector busy at work. Worth A Million indeed.




-----------------------------
TTC talks will continue next week, union says
Head of main transit workers' union says talks progressing slowly

JEFF GRAY

Globe and Mail Update

April 10, 2008 at 3:05 PM EDT


The head of the Toronto's main transit workers union says talks with management will continue at least until early next week without a strike.

But Bob Kinnear, president of Local 113 of the Amalgamated Transit Union, told a news conference Thursday that the talk were progressing slowly and that the TTC was demanding too many concessions from its work force, a contention the TTC denies.

Mr. Kinnear said TTC chairman Adam Giambrone — a left-leaning ally of Mayor David Miller — needed to be personally involved in the talks, and the union leader accused TTC management of trying to provoke a strike.

"They may yet get their wish, but not yet," Mr. Kinnear said. "We want a deal. But it has to be fair."

A spokseman for Mr. Giambrone, the TTC chairman, said that he would not be coming to the bargaining table as requested by the union. But the nine-member TTC commission made up of city counsellors, was giving direction to the TTC's bargaining team.

The latest statements from the union came after a warning Wednesday by Mr. Miller to city workers not to expect "overly generous" wage hikes.

"We do not have a vast amount of money to be overly generous, but we do need to pay people properly and fairly," Mr. Miller told a business audience at a Scarborough hotel ballroom. "... Our union partners have to accept that this is not a year for generosity, it's a year for fairness."

After more than a week of negotiations past an April 1 strike deadline, Thursday's press conference was meant to signal to management that more progress was needed. Mr. Kinnear has committed to giving commuters at least 48 hours notice before any strike or work-to-rule campaign.

Mr. Miller, scheduled to leave for China on April 12 on a controversial trade mission that has been met with protests from pro-Tibet activists, told reporters Wednesday he would cut his trip short if Toronto Transit Commission workers walked off the job.

Saying he was concerned that the talks were "reaching a difficult stage," Mr. Miller told reporters it was important both sides remained at the bargaining table.

"They need to keep talking and reach a negotiated settlement. ... I think that's what Torontonians expect," he said.

He later added that he had no plans to intervene personally in the talks, saying it was important for the transit agency and its union to come up with a deal on their own: "If I intervened it would create all sorts of problems."

The mayor also pointed to transit union contracts with Mississauga Transit (a three-year deal signed in 2005) and, more recently, with GO Transit, as likely to "set the pattern" for what TTC workers would get. Both deals provided raises in the neighbourhood of 3 per cent a year, as does a recent deal signed by Brampton Transit.


Mr. Kinnear, whose union was blamed in a labour board ruling for a one-day illegal strike in May, 2006, was to spend the next few days in talks at a hotel north of the city. He said the union was to keep negotiating without warning a strike until at least Monday.

The union voted down a first offer from the TTC last month that included four years of 2-per-cent annual wage hikes. On March 25, Mr. Kinnear walked away from talks, demanding that the TTC top up workers compensation benefits for injured staff. With the help of a provincial mediator, he returned to talks March 27, claiming victory on that issue.

source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home
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Old April 13th, 2008, 07:18 AM   #691
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You don't need to post everything in two different places. I noticed you're doing this a lot, it is getting old (I'll think there's something new when in fact it's something I've seen before).
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Old April 13th, 2008, 05:30 PM   #692
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You don't need to post everything in two different places. I noticed you're doing this a lot, it is getting old (I'll think there's something new when in fact it's something I've seen before).
I wonder which thread is useful then, since there are two or more threads on the same topic. Why don't you decide to check one and not the other? I'm sure clicking to view this thread was alot of effort on your part.
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Old April 13th, 2008, 06:12 PM   #693
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Strike threats at the TTC? Not something special or extraordinary anymore. Doesn't it happen at least once a year these days, much like people get birthdays once a year.

If the TTC were a private company, the salaries would probably drop by at least a third and there'll be no strike threats even then.
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Old April 13th, 2008, 06:53 PM   #694
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I wonder which thread is useful then, since there are two or more threads on the same topic. Why don't you decide to check one and not the other? I'm sure clicking to view this thread was alot of effort on your part.
Strikes and unions are not really about the physical subway, it is a service issue that is more local in nature, so in the case of that subject matter, it serves little purpose outside the Toronto forum. Just think about which is more relevant and pick one - doesn't really matter which. Many people frequent multiple subforums anyway - you and I are both examples.
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Old April 13th, 2008, 06:56 PM   #695
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Strike threats at the TTC? Not something special or extraordinary anymore. Doesn't it happen at least once a year these days, much like people get birthdays once a year.

If the TTC were a private company, the salaries would probably drop by at least a third and there'll be no strike threats even then.
Amazing how so many people have no clue that the TTC has a hard time finding enough staff to run the system. If you don't know, don't guess, ask instead, you'll like less of a pompous ignoramus.
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Old April 13th, 2008, 08:06 PM   #696
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Amazing how so many people have no clue that the TTC has a hard time finding enough staff to run the system. If you don't know, don't guess, ask instead, you'll like less of a pompous ignoramus.
So it takes a lot of skills to find ticket collectors to the point where some have to be paid 100k? You'd think they really want the world to know that lie so they have more bargaining power come strike time.

Yet at the same time 100k can buy a very decent manager who can manage a couple billion in portfolio money, and bring back a handsome return every year. Perhaps the TTC isn't getting value for its money.

By the way, finding people to do jobs is a problem everywhere ... surprise surprise. Plenty of rather menial jobs such as garbage collection isn't exactly high on the priority list for most of the working class. Does that mean we should start paying 100k or even 200k a year for that? Would that be money wisely spent out of the public purse?

So what exactly makes these ticket collectors so special that they ought to be paid at that amount an still not be satisfied? Are they bringing in so much more revenue growth to justify these rates?
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Old April 13th, 2008, 10:09 PM   #697
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Strikes and unions are not really about the physical subway, it is a service issue that is more local in nature, so in the case of that subject matter, it serves little purpose outside the Toronto forum. Just think about which is more relevant and pick one - doesn't really matter which. Many people frequent multiple subforums anyway - you and I are both examples.
If you have been reading previous articles posted about the strike issue in this thread, you would see that there is significant discussion on this issue. If there is intelligent discussion on the articles I post in this thread, I see no reason why a duplicated article can't be posted here. Other city transit threads in this section also have similar service related articles posted as well, so I don't see why something like this is not valid.
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Old April 14th, 2008, 06:30 AM   #698
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So it takes a lot of skills to find ticket collectors to the point where some have to be paid 100k? You'd think they really want the world to know that lie so they have more bargaining power come strike time.
Well, first off, you have no clue what these ticket collectors USUALLY make. You're citation of 100k is for workers who have clocked up so much overtime that their annual pay doubled. That is a huge amount of overtime work. If they don't work overtime, they'd be much closer to 50k. Is 50k too much per year?

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Yet at the same time 100k can buy a very decent manager who can manage a couple billion in portfolio money, and bring back a handsome return every year. Perhaps the TTC isn't getting value for its money.
Managers don't get paid for overtime, don't forget. However, the TTC definately does have big problems at the managerial level in certain departments, and these managers are screwing the TTC over in more ways than just finances. What you fail to realize is that these people have nothing to do with the ticket collectors and vehicle operators that you so vehemently hate because of a small handful who clocked up so much overtime they doubled their annual income.

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By the way, finding people to do jobs is a problem everywhere ... surprise surprise.
Right. So, because we are having a hard time attracting COMPETENT people to work for the agency, let's lower the pay rate to make the situation worse! That'll solve everything! Just follow hkskyline's advice and the problem will go away
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Plenty of rather menial jobs such as garbage collection isn't exactly high on the priority list for most of the working class. Does that mean we should start paying 100k or even 200k a year for that? Would that be money wisely spent out of the public purse?
Garbage collectors and TTC operators make similar amounts AFAIK.

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So what exactly makes these ticket collectors so special that they ought to be paid at that amount an still not be satisfied? Are they bringing in so much more revenue growth to justify these rates?
Maybe you should read the article before running off on a tyrade and make an ass of yourself. It's called overtime. The TTC does not pay all of their ticket collectors 100k/year like you are so convinced is going on. Take a pill and welcome back to reality, you can simmer down now.
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Old April 14th, 2008, 08:39 AM   #699
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If they TTC is bitching and moaning about more money, how bout they stop paying ticket collecters 100k, thats totally unecessary
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Old April 14th, 2008, 09:42 AM   #700
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If they TTC is bitching and moaning about more money, how bout they stop paying ticket collecters 100k, thats totally unecessary
Forgive me for calling you ignorant but you are ignorant. Simple math.

If you're a ticket collector who made $35000 a year when you got the job, with a 3% annual salary increase, your pay check will be $100,000 a year if you work 35 years. The only way for the TTC to avoid these kinds of salaries is to either fire the person, or deny nominal inflationary pay increase. Both of which would result in a strike.

Also, many times when the media reports salaries, they also add in benefit pays such as medical insurance and TTC staff discounts. You take those away, the salaries effectively become around 85,000. Which would take someone with a starting salary of $35000 thirty work years to achieve.

People fall for that, you gotta watch out what these newpapers tell you.
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