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Old November 9th, 2013, 01:03 AM   #181
LastConformist
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Originally Posted by unmentioned View Post
A developer pays no taxes on this huge project for 35 years all while collecting rents and enjoying a killer location minutes from Manhattan; what, exactly, does Jersey City get in return?
The catch is that this isn't a killer location at all. Journal Square is really dumpy and has very little going on. The transit to Manhattan is great, and so's the local Indian food, but that's pretty much it. The goal of this project is to help revitalize Journal Square.

Also, no guarantee that there are any supertalls out of this project. The initial discussions had an 84-story (IIRC) tower that was shortened to 70 stories. That might be a supertall, but it's not guaranteed like an 84-story tower was.
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Old November 9th, 2013, 06:48 AM   #182
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Journal Square was once the city center, and redevelopment of the Square is a major priority for the new Fulop Administration. It's not very sexy now certainly, but like what you say this is meant to jumpstart the Square. It would be great if we can get a couple of suprtalls in the project down the line but the most important thing is at least this seems to really be getting going after all the crap regarding the two tower project that was supposed to spearhead development several years back. That project has gone nowhere and despite recent promises it should finally have received the added funding needed,who knows if anything will come out of it.
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Old November 9th, 2013, 11:43 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by LastConformist View Post
The catch is that this isn't a killer location at all. Journal Square is really dumpy and has very little going on. The transit to Manhattan is great, and so's the local Indian food, but that's pretty much it. The goal of this project is to help revitalize Journal Square.

Also, no guarantee that there are any supertalls out of this project. The initial discussions had an 84-story (IIRC) tower that was shortened to 70 stories. That might be a supertall, but it's not guaranteed like an 84-story tower was.
Yeah, I don't think this will end up as a supertall either. Not even the 84-story version was guaranteed as a supertall, with 84 stories and 3,5 meters/11.5 ft per floor (a pretty good height) it would be 294 meters, short for supertall.
In the renders I posted, I count about 75 apparent floors (as in the case of 432 park, counting the apparent floors is more useful than the actual floors) It's been said that this could be the tallest tower in NJ, although I think I haven't seen that officially announced, it is more speculation due the floor count. To be the tallest tower, it has to be taller than the 238 m./ 781ft. Goldman Sachs Tower. For comparison the Trump Plaza, another high end building in Jersey City, is 162 m./532 ft. tall with 55 floors, an average of 2,95m./9.7 ft. per floor,
To be taller than the Goldman Sachs and with a floor count of 75, each floor must be at least 3.2m./10.5 ft. to bring the tower to 240 meters tall. So let's suppose that this building will effecively be the tallest in JC, I predict the height could be between 240 meters, with 3,2 high ceilings to 277 meters, with 3,7 feet high ceilings. But I guess it would be in the lower numbers (about 250 meters)
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Old November 10th, 2013, 06:46 PM   #184
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I just wish they didn't scale it down from 82-84 stories to 70. Still will look impressive in the skyline, especially coming from being a mid sized city. The three towers as a whole will look awesome... it is kinda like a mini 432 Park Place with meat on its bones plus some setbacks in the lower parts. Now if they just could get the two tower project in front going finally, and eventually get rid of the stone cold, ugly PATH building(god, WTF were they thinking????????????????!!) we'll have a soaring and revitalized heart of Journal Square to be excited about!
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Old November 14th, 2013, 05:15 PM   #185
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This one is the definitive vote, so it is passed, the last vote was a tentative OK. The tax break was pretty controversial, as expected, it seems they lowered them a bit from the 35 years initially proposed to 30 years, if you look at the readers comments at the article, most are angered because the tax abatments. Also most residents at the hearing spoke against the development.
The article also says that the first tower will be completed in about three yeras and that they expect to complete all the complex by 2029, I don't know why it will take them so much time.

Jersey City council awards 30-year tax break for Journal Square towers

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2...re_towers.html

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A proposed $666 million, three tower residential development near the Journal Square PATH station will receive a 30-year tax break, as well as $10 million in bonds floated by a city agency, thanks to three nearly unanimous votes by the City Council tonight.

The votes came four hours into the council’s regular meeting, and after a nearly three hour public hearing dominated by residents opposed to the tax break. The council voted on a separate tax break for each of the three towers.

Each vote was 6-1-1, with Ward D Councilman Michael Yun voting no and Councilwoman at large Joyce Watterman abstaining. Ward E Councilwoman Candice Osborne was absent.

City officials say the project, which will include 1,840 units and ground-floor retail space, will bring an economic jolt to Journal Square, which hasn’t seen a significant construction project in decades.

“This project is necessary and vital to Jersey City,” said Councilman at large Rolando Lavarro.

The proposed development, to be located at the top of Magnolia Avenue, just east of the Port Authority transportation hub, will include a 54-story tower with 540 units; a 70-story tower with 700 units; and a 60-story tower with 600 units. The developer is KRE Group, headed by Murray Kushner.

Construction on the first tower is expected to begin later this year and take three years to complete. The final tower is expected to be complete in 2029.

The tax break amounts to 30 years for the entire project, not 30 years for each tower.
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The tax break differs for each tower. For the first, KRE will pay a base annual service charge of $1,200 per unit for the first five years, with that amount increasing incrementally until the 26th year, when it hits $2,300 per unit.

The average Jersey City tax bill is about $6,500.

KRE will also pay $515,000 to the city annually to pay off the $10 million bonds in 25 years, and Fulop said they’ll fork over $2.5 million to help refurbish the Landmark Loew’s Jersey Theatre. The bonds will pay for infrastructure improvements in the area.

KRE estimates a total of $11.1 million in net income once the three towers are complete and fully rented, according to financial documents provided by the city.
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Old November 14th, 2013, 05:48 PM   #186
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While I'm very happy with the final vote, and despite the neighborhood NIMBYs the 30 year abatement is fully justified, as the area is truly in need of a developmental jolt so that doesn't bother me in the least... but the last one will be completed by 2029? I'm hoping that was just a mistake, because that just seems too long a wait. I'm thinking if the first one rents fast, and other developers start getting in filling out that area, no way it will be more than another decade before groundbreaking on the third tower. Hoping the second( currently supposedly listed at 70 stories and possibly will be at least for awhile the tallest residential tower in New Jersey when complete)will be groundbroken by 2016, 2017 the latest. Nevertheless it will be a historic jolt for the area and help bring it to a revitalized importance after so many years of neglect, then false starts and broken promises of renewal.
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Old November 14th, 2013, 11:29 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by citybooster View Post
Being from Jersey City I love them, and in the Journal Square development plan it's conceivable the area around the towers gets up to 12 large towers in total... maybe a couple of genuine supertalls. But the first one is 54 stories, at best 600 ft... the second is 70 stories, maybe stretches to around 800 ft, and the third is 60 stories, we get maybe 650-700 ft out of that....very impressive skyscrapers for a mid sized city, and great for the overall Hudson River skyline. But no supertall qualifications yet... this should be moved to skyscrapers soon.
If any tower hits 300m it'll be a squeaker. Given the implied 'value' to these units due to the location and the incentives needed to get the project started, I would indeed expect these to be skyscrapers.
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Old December 1st, 2013, 09:36 PM   #188
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Maybe this one already broke ground? at least according to the president of Kushner Real Estate Group, the developer on an interview on the NYT.
And with respect to the timeline, he said that they expect to build the other two in three and five years, so it seems it is not the 2029 date. and more like 2019-20.
The article is from november 26th.

The 30-Minute Interview
Jonathan C. Kushner


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/27/re...yapl86WY4RlvOQ

Quote:
Mr. Kushner, 35, is the president of the Kushner Real Estate Group, which owns and manages more than 12 million square feet of commercial property in the New York area. It is involved in several projects in northern New Jersey.

The company, based in Bridgewater, N.J., is the successor to SK Properties, which his father, Murray Kushner, helped found in 1979.
Quote:
Q. How is business?

A. It’s great — it’s better than it’s ever been since I started working full time in 1999.

We made a shift in the early 2000s to go from being suburban builders in New Jersey and Pennsylvania to being also urban builders. We’ve built an urban brand and we have about 12 projects in different stages — from Bayonne, Jersey City, West New York, Hoboken and Fort Lee — along the Gold Coast of New Jersey. All of our locations are transit-oriented, where you can walk to mass transit and be in Manhattan.

Q. Most of what you’re doing now is residential.

A. The lion’s share of what we’re doing is residential in focus and rental apartments. Our current holdings consist of about six million square feet of office, warehouse and retail space and roughly 10,000 apartments. In addition to that we have over 7,000 apartments in different phases of design and construction.

Q. Let’s talk about some of these developments.

A. We’re under construction on 18 Park in Jersey City; we’re about 75 percent complete. That’ll be opening in March or April. It’s 550,000 feet and it’s 422 apartments, all rentals, plus 30,000 feet of retail. And at the base of that building we’re building a new Boys and Girls Club.

We just broke ground on Journal Square, a three-phase, 2.4-million-square-foot project. The first phase is a 640,000-square-foot residential tower — 54 floors and 540 rental apartments, next to the train station. The other two phases are probably three and five years out; we’re going to build one rental tower at a time. The second tower is going to be 70 floors and 700 units, and the third tower will be 60 floors and 600 units.

And we’ve also just broken ground this summer in Fort Lee for the Hudson Lights, a one-million-square-foot mixed-use project we’re doing with Tucker Development. It’s 142,000 feet of retail, 276 rental apartments, 470,000 feet of office space, plus 2,000 parking spots. We’ll be delivering Phase 1 24 months from now. The office building will come in the second phase.

We’re in construction drawings on 235 Grand and 101 Grove — 688 rentals in two towers, a 45-story tower and a 10-story tower. That project will have stunning views. We will probably break ground the summer of ’14.

Q. Why the focus on Jersey City?

A. It’s all about transportation. If you live in Jersey City and work downtown or even Midtown South, you get to work quicker from our buildings than if you lived on the Upper East or West Sides and the rents are half.
BTW, Marc Kushner, one of the architects that designed these towers, as well as other projects of KRE Group, is the brother of this guy.
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Last edited by CCs77; December 2nd, 2013 at 01:23 AM.
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Old December 1st, 2013, 10:19 PM   #189
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2029 is probably the latest they're allowed to open the 3rd tower, and still be considered to be in compliance with the deal they just made with the city.
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Old January 16th, 2014, 03:06 AM   #190
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$666? some satanical priced towers


Demolition underway in Jersey City to make room for $666 million residential towers

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2...al_towers.html
Quote:




Major demolition is underway in Journal Square, where several buildings, including two large, five-story, brick buildings are being devoured by demolition machines to make way for a $666 million residential towers project.

The buildings being leveled will transform Pavonia Avenue’s south side from Summit Avenue to McLaughlin Funeral Home a swath of empty lots.
Traffic continues to flow in both directions on Pavonia and only the sidewalk on the south side of the street has been closed to pedestrian traffic.

At 2:50 p.m. buses and cars were passing some 15 feet from the five-story buildings that are partially torn down. Summit Avenue is functioning normally.

The project is to include a 54-story tower with 540 units; a 70-story tower with 700 units; and a 60-story tower with 600 units. The developer is KRE Group, headed by Murray Kushner. Construction of the first tower is to take three years to complete. The final tower is expected to be complete in 2029.
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Old January 16th, 2014, 08:11 AM   #191
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Is the 70fl one a potential supertall?
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Old February 21st, 2014, 11:58 PM   #192
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Well, it seems we have a number: 740 ft. / 225.5 m.

Jersey More
Two high-rise residential projects in Jersey City set to absorb New York City overflow around transit hubs

Quote:
Sited on the west bank of the Hudson River, Jersey City is connected to Manhattan by a web of transit lines that are making it an increasingly desirable location for new residents priced out of New York City. Developers have taken note of this trend, as evidenced by a pair of high-rise residential complexes that recently broke ground in the satellite city. When complete, the two projects—one designed by HWKN with Handel Architects, the other by Dutch firm Concrete—will be among the tallest buildings in New Jersey.

“As Brooklyn becomes more and more inconvenient due to affordability and transportation, people are warming up to New Jersey’s convenience,” said Matthias Hollwich, partner at HWKN. He noted that many of the amenities that draw people to Brooklyn already exist in Jersey City, from a vibrant dining scene to tech incubation hubs. “It’s really unknown to many people.” His firm is building a triad of towers at Journal Square, the tallest of which is 74 floors and 740 feet. “I was really amazed at the accessibility that’s completely underutilized,” he continued. “It’s only 10 minutes to the World Trade Center and 15 to Midtown Manhattan.”
http://archpaper.com/news/articles.asp?id=7102

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Old February 22nd, 2014, 12:39 AM   #193
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Hes probably just assuming a story is 10 feet I doubt thats accurate
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 12:58 AM   #194
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I had read the tallest was going for 70 stories, 740 ft. would look more accurate there.. I like higher floor plates though like they are doing with the New York towers... 69 stories and only 713 ft for URL at Harborside is kind of disappointing. Though there will be three of them and they'll look a lot better in the skyline together than many are saying. I love the Journal Square development the more I see of it.... like a more playful, mini 432 Park in triplicate!
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 01:05 AM   #195
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We'll go with the 740 ft. number. Journal Square is a high-beta area for real estate development. The double-height floors seen in Manhattan aren't in the bargain here...yet. It may still be taller in which case, the height can be updated.
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 01:13 AM   #196
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We'll go with the 740 ft. number. Journal Square is a high-beta area for real estate development. The double-height floors seen in Manhattan aren't in the bargain here...yet.
Probably not yet but hopefully we'll get a couple of those in the coming decade. The height we should go with, but the stories I'm not sure about... the one that will be undergoing construction soon is 54 stories, guessing around 560 ft. The second one to be built is the tallest and that had been designated at 70 stories... don't know if it's changed or the floor number is a typo. Sixty stories at approximately 620 ft. will be the third and last built in the complex.... going to be a magnificent addition to our city center soon!(yes, Jersey City resident here)
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 01:24 AM   #197
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Hes probably just assuming a story is 10 feet I doubt thats accurate
Not necessarily, if you read the article, the journalist was actually interviewing the architect, Matthias Hollwich, partner at HWKN, so he probably gave him the facts.
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 01:25 AM   #198
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It is not accurate. This will be taller than GS. I believe the figure is 800'.
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 06:02 PM   #199
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It is not accurate. This will be taller than GS. I believe the figure is 800'.
That would definitely make it the tallest tower in JC for at least the foreseeable future... seems to have received a raising from 70 to 74 stories then but what makes you certain of the 800 ft. being more of an accurate figure? Certainly hope it is true!
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Old February 22nd, 2014, 07:49 PM   #200
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Why is the title Journal Squared? What's up with the d?
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