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Old November 13th, 2012, 03:48 PM   #101
geogregor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolothos View Post
Not too sure, but quite large capacity. We have these newer ones too.. Also massive in length!
image hosted on flickr


Very large buses. And they are still being used to full capacity during the morning rush.

Glasgow does have a very strong bus fleet. Plenty of ex-London buses are used on various routes too. I'd have thought Liverpool would have such buses already in use?
It must take ages for passengers to embark/disembark via only one front door. Why so many British cities outside London opt for such configuration?
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Old November 14th, 2012, 05:10 PM   #102
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I really don't know, but I think in London, it's regulation to have a double door configuration, as bus operators run services to requirements by TfL. Wheras in all other cities, bus operators can do what they like, and having the single door prevents fare evasion.

You can easily tell an ex-London bus in Glasgow. The bus I took to Bridge Street Subway this morning clearly had it's second set of doors removed at some point, it had the side sections, and dodgy sized windows in place, and the stairs to the upper deck were placed further down the bus. It was used as an extra standing/pram area.
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Old November 14th, 2012, 05:59 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by Kolothos View Post
I really don't know, but I think in London, it's regulation to have a double door configuration, as bus operators run services to requirements by TfL. Wheras in all other cities, bus operators can do what they like, and having the single door prevents fare evasion.
I can't imagine that fare evasion would be such a problem. Somehow two door configuration works in London where drivers clearly see if someone enters through the back door. So why not in other cities?

I have suspicion that it is yet another example of the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" nonsense. The one door policy was used for years so no one can't be bothered to change it. Even when it could shorten the passenger exchange times and overall journey times, especially on busy routes with many stops.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 01:47 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
I have suspicion that it is yet another example of the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" nonsense. The one door policy was used for years so no one can't be bothered to change it. Even when it could shorten the passenger exchange times and overall journey times, especially on busy routes with many stops.
I think you may be right there. That attitude is very strong in terms of public transport in Glasgow.

The only buses that do have an exit door in Glasgow are the few bendy buses that operate in the city. They have a button and a gate to exit, to stop people jumping in.image hosted on flickr


The new Fastlink bus network should hopefully include buses with double doors. It's unclear at the moment as to what sort of bus we will get. Initially we were meant to get these:


But recent news seems to suggest otherwise. SPT will develop a brand for the new rapid bus network in line with the Subway, so it's a first step towards a more London way of running the buses in Glasgow.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 11:05 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
It must take ages for passengers to embark/disembark via only one front door. Why so many British cities outside London opt for such configuration?
It doesn't really take that long.

In my city Brighton, the doors are like this. Only at a few stops in the city centre is there a significant delay - and its not caused only by the single door. Most of the delay is people buying tickets from the driver- seriously one old granny can take as long to buy a ticket as it would take the entire bus to disembark. Thankfully they don't need to buy tickets any more but you can see my point. Well over half the travellers in my city use advance-purchase tickets, but you still buy from the driver in cash and this is the primary cause of any waiting at the bus stops.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 07:01 PM   #106
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Some routes in Glasgow could definitely do with them. The 44 route is especially brimmed in the rush hours. On many occasions, I've found myself having to push through a big pack of people who are all standing at the front of the bus (nobody ever moves up to the back to stand), and it's often hard to differentiate between the queue of people waiting to get off, and the people who are standing, which leaves you running down the bus to catch the doors before the driver shuts them!

I'm not sure how busy the buses are in Brighton, but certain routes in Glasgow can get very busy, often beyond capacity in the mornings, and the inclusion of a second set of doors would help things a lot. Glasgow should be announcing a smart card for public transport soon, so that will help the cause for double door buses.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 07:34 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makita09 View Post
It doesn't really take that long.

In my city Brighton, the doors are like this. Only at a few stops in the city centre is there a significant delay - and its not caused only by the single door. Most of the delay is people buying tickets from the driver- seriously one old granny can take as long to buy a ticket as it would take the entire bus to disembark. Thankfully they don't need to buy tickets any more but you can see my point. Well over half the travellers in my city use advance-purchase tickets, but you still buy from the driver in cash and this is the primary cause of any waiting at the bus stops.
I have used buses in Edinburgh once or twice and even when they were shorter than the triple axis one form the picture above there were still significant delays caused by the mess at the busy stops. Embarking and disembarking caused clashes of two opposite queues of passengers.
Such buses on the busy city routes are pure madness.
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Old November 17th, 2012, 10:58 PM   #108
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I totally agree with that. I use the buses enough to know this! I take the 45 or the 57 every morning, and even getting off at Bridge Street Subway during the rush hour, where nobody tends to board a northbound bus, is annoying, having to push through the standing passengers to get to the front.

Even worse on that one day a week where I transfer to Central Low Level to get a westbound train to Exhibition Centre. Madness!

And it's no better on the trains! On my line - the South Western Line - we're still using these awful Sprinters which are configured for more long distance journeys (like the West Highland Line), and as such don't have the door configuration to deal with high density urban movements. These trains are packed well beyond capacity in the mornings. You'll seldom find a place to stand let alone a place to sit in these things.

image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dwbphotos/7379581204/

The line is to be electrified before 2020, but hopefully in the mean time, we get some of these cascaded down for when the Edinburgh-Glasgow line is electrified:

Last edited by Kolothos; November 17th, 2012 at 11:04 PM.
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Old November 17th, 2012, 11:22 PM   #109
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Glasgow Central Station

The larger of Glasgow's two terminal stations, Glasgow Central is the busiest railway station in the UK outside of London. 25 million passengers used the station last year, slightly more than Birmingham New Street.

It's locally known as simply 'Central' (If you want a return ticket from Mount Florida, you'd say ''Ah'l huv a return tae Central fae Mount Florida please'' to the ticky), and in the context of urban rail travel within Greater Glasgow and West Central Scotland, it is the main terminus for electric and diesel services to the south, but it also has platforms on the east/west orientated underground Argyle Line, with electric services to the east and west of Greater Glasgow.

It is also the northern terminus of the WCML among other things. All in all, the station has 16 platforms, with a short walk to the Subway station at St. Enoch Square.

With HS2 services coming in the next few decades, and a future high speed rail link to Edinburgh in the pipeline, Glasgow Central may be expanded to serve high speed rail, but the more favoured location at the moment is a new east facing station at High Street.



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Old November 21st, 2012, 11:50 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolothos View Post

image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dwbphotos/7379581204/

The line is to be electrified before 2020, but hopefully in the mean time, we get some of these cascaded down for when the Edinburgh-Glasgow line is electrified:
Great thread. Worth mentioning that there are 4 Edinburgh-Glasgow lines, 2 of which are already electrified.
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Old November 22nd, 2012, 04:14 AM   #111
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Thanks mate, good to see some more GMA presence in the thread, I've been quietly updating this for a while now.

By 'Edinburgh-Glasgow line', I mean the main express route via Falkirk.

But yes, it is worth mentioning that there are three other lines!
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Old November 22nd, 2012, 09:12 PM   #112
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Rolling stock - Class 314

The Glasgow variant of British Rail's then third generation of standard suburban rolling stock. They were originally brought in to work the reopened underground line between Partick and Newton via Central (the Argyle Line), and now operate predominantly on the Cathcart Circle Line, the Inverclyde Line, and as of December of this year, the Paisley Canal Line.

The original 'Trans-Clyde' branded livery, electric trains in Glasgow were traditionally blue before the SPT orange came into force across all transport modes.
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http://www.flickriver.com/photos/emdjt42/7028825053/

314 in the 'Strathclyde Transport' livery of the 90s.
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/dwbphotos/6679552215/

In the 'SPT rail' livery of the 00s. Currently being replainted as part of a refurb project. Many 314s still carry this livery though.


Refurbished Scotrail liveried 314. After Transport Scotland took up the SPT franchise, they have applied a uniform brand identity to all of Scotland's railway lines, even Glasgow's metro-like inner-suburban lines.

pre-refurb interior:


The 314s natural successor is the 380. The 380 is designed not as a train for inner-suburban movements like the 314, but for longer journeys, and as such lacks the metro/tube-style seating arrangement.
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dwbphotos/8006792148/
image hosted on flickr
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Old November 23rd, 2012, 11:10 AM   #113
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Rolling Stock - Class 334

Until the introduction of the 380s, the 334 was the newest EMU in the Strathclyde Transport area.


These are built by Alstom, and are found working the North Clyde Line between Helensburgh, in Argyll & Bute, and Edinburgh Waverley, via Queen Street LL and the Airdrie to Bathgate link.


They were the last trains to be introduced into the SPT area rail network before Transport Scotland took over the network, thus incorporating it into a new Scotland-wide railway network.
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Old November 26th, 2012, 04:36 AM   #114
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I remember when the 334s were rolled out. We had them on the Lanark/Milngavie line for the longest time, as direct replacements for the old 303s. What a step up.

The Lanark line has gone a step back, now primarily running with refurbed class 314s.
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Old November 26th, 2012, 04:03 PM   #115
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I prefer the 314s. Wider doorways and more standing room is a big plus during the rush hour, especially when compared to the 318s and 320s.

Transport Scotland really need to invest in lightweight ubran trains for Glasgow, it's just not good enough seeing a big ugly 318 take ages to slow to a stop in Central LL..

More bus stuff. The SPT in the past few years, have subsidised some bus routes, which would otherwise be in danger of being axed by private operators. So there are some SPT bus services in Glasgow. This particular bus is run by Henderson Travel on behalf of the SPT. Hopefully the introduction of quality bus contracts in the future will see all bus services running with this sort of livery.

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Henderson 261 nsf by Wigan Airways, on Flickr
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Old November 26th, 2012, 08:08 PM   #116
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Still one door by bus.
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Old November 27th, 2012, 01:03 AM   #117
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Yep, still single entry/exit.
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Old November 28th, 2012, 02:12 AM   #118
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Quote:
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I prefer the 314s. Wider doorways and more standing room is a big plus during the rush hour, especially when compared to the 318s and 320s.
Oh, hang on, I mean Lanark/Minlgavie inherited a bunch of 318s.

The Lanark commute is a long one, though. It requires lots of seats, which is what the 318s in their current configuration have I guess. I thought the 334s had the same 6/aisle/4 seat configuration, but perhaps I'm wrong. So the 318s presumably increase capacity without altering timetabling; the difference is that the 334s were new and more comfortable/reliable than the refurbed 318s.

Last edited by sds; November 28th, 2012 at 02:19 AM.
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Old November 28th, 2012, 08:48 PM   #119
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Kelvinbridge - Subway


The deepest station on the line, and the one with the widest island platform. That picture is now somewhat dated, as the station now carries the new SPT branding and font.

This station is very well used, as it provides close proximity to the eastern half of Glasgow Universities campus (the education and engineering schools are located close by), as well as the high density tenement area of the Woodlands and Woodside.
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Old November 30th, 2012, 02:04 AM   #120
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Argyle Street - Argyle Line (Underground)
North entrance
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Concourse
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Escalators to ticket gates and passenger tunnel
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Ticket gates

Escalators to platform level (Eastbound/Westbound)

Platform level
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