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Old September 29th, 2013, 11:03 AM   #221
patrykus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
Would those fins be considered the highest occupied floor??? I would classify those fins as being a type of crown or spire and they are not included in the height for dob filings. I'm sure the fins are not part of that 905 ft figure.
Seams like nobody read your question correctly I don't know how the dob define the "occupied floor" but to me it's quite obvious fins are not part of any floor (occupied or not), so I doubt dob would include them in the height.
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Old September 29th, 2013, 01:44 PM   #222
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Could someone point out where 432 park ave is compared to this building?
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Old September 29th, 2013, 04:54 PM   #223
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They won't wait for the East Midtown Rezoning approval in 1-2 months?
If the rezoning even occurs, it's still being negotiated. The latest thought was to exempt 425 Park and 1 Vanderbilt from the 2017 requirement. This especially makes sense with 425 since it's geared to hedge funds and PE firms that will pay $125-$200/sf. The firms going to the HY are large corporations that seek value.

If 425 gets rezoning, I see L&L adding 20 stories of mega-highend apartments to the top.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 06:14 AM   #224
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As per my above-post from yesterday:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...DDLETopStories
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Old September 30th, 2013, 06:20 AM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
Thanks. I' know those fins are considered a structure but I was not sure how to classify it.

I'm just curious since there is no available filing for 1 WTC that I am aware of. At least publicly.

Let's say 1 WTC from the get go disclosed that the Radom would be installed on the spire thus it will be as part of structure.

What would the height be in the dob application for new building for 1 WTC? 1776 or 1368? I dunno.
it is a good question. If antenna is also part of architecture of the tower then it should be counted as part of the building. if it just an antenna then it is not counted. I am not entirely positive about WTC since simply speaking it is a mess there and no one so far was able to explain to me what is and what is not counted there. so I am still waiting for some sort of explanation and final count on the WTC #1 height.

Over here the question is way more clearer. Fins are part of the structure. No matter how useless or stupid they may look/serve it is part of the building. Plain and simple.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 08:58 AM   #226
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Quote:
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Could someone point out where 432 park ave is compared to this building?

Forgive the placement being a bit off.









Really hope 425 and 610 can benefit from rezoning.



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Old September 30th, 2013, 01:43 PM   #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
Over here the question is way more clearer. Fins are part of the structure. No matter how useless or stupid they may look/serve it is part of the building. Plain and simple.
And yet it would not be counted into the DOB height because they measure height only to the last occupied floor And that's what VG was asking for.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 06:47 PM   #228
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And yet it would not be counted into the DOB height because they measure height only to the last occupied floor And that's what VG was asking for.

Exactly that is what I'm trying to allude. I believe the fins would not be part of the DOB height (highest occupied floor) figure! Thanks Patrykus.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 06:54 PM   #229
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So you think thread will eventually move under the supertall thread??

I maybe in the minority here, but I'm really excited with the prospects of this towers design.

I hope Norman just stretches this out by adding 3-4 additional floors each to the low/mid and high-rise sections of this tower with the Fins possibly taking this 1,200 ft + in height.

I posted this before a while back but I thought I'll post it again for those have not seen Foster's 425 presentation from last year.


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Old September 30th, 2013, 06:55 PM   #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertWalpole View Post
As per my above-post from yesterday:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...DDLETopStories


Quote:
Two May Get Jump on Midtown Plan

image hosted on flickr

http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showth...=10981&page=19

The Bloomberg administration has agreed to make changes to a major rezoning proposal for the area near Grand Central Terminal that could help two prominent developers get moving on their projects sooner than some competitors.

The City Planning Commission is set to vote Monday on a proposal to rezone the area around Grand Central Terminal to allow developers to build bigger office towers than those allowed under current rules. Seen as Mayor Michael Bloomberg's real-estate swan song, the so-called Midtown East plan was designed to replace aging properties with modern towers that would help New York compete with other global business centers.

The late changes to the controversial plan address its key "sunrise" provision that blocks developers from taking advantage of the rezoning for four years. Planners think the delay is important to prevent the Midtown East projects from competing with office towers under way at Hudson Yards on Manhattan's West Side and the World Trade Center.

But the new wording would allow a couple of high-profile projects in Midtown East to move forward sooner.

SL Green Realty Corp. would be able to get a one-year jump start on its new office tower planned between 42nd and 43rd streets on the block just west of Grand Central. SL Green officials have told the planning commission they would benefit from an early start because they plan to make significant and time-consuming improvements to pedestrian access to Grand Central.

Also, the changes would help David Levinson of L&L Holding Co., who's planning to build a Norman Foster-designed office tower at 425 Park Ave. Mr. Levinson plans to break ground in the spring of 2015 regardless of whether the rezoning passes. Under the current zoning, he would have to leave the steel skeleton of the bottom 25% of the existing 1950s building in place to maximize the development's size. The proposed new rules would allow Mr. Levinson to fully raze the current building and build a structure that's roughly 15% larger.

Mr. Levinson has argued that buildings like his that sit on smaller sites should be able to move forward more quickly because they don't compete with the mega-towers planned for Hudson Yards. Compared with the huge projects on the West Side and downtown, the floors of his building will be "a half to a third of the size and double the rent," at about $160 a square foot, he said.

[...]
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Last edited by desertpunk; October 12th, 2013 at 10:39 AM.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 10:32 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
Exactly that is what I'm trying to allude. I believe the fins would not be part of the DOB height (highest occupied floor) figure! Thanks Patrykus.
Well it's only logical, fins are not floors. And I remember that dob doesn't even count whole floors if they are not occupied to the height.

And I'm with you here - we really are in the minority, but I too love the design. IMO it's very new york with all these setbacks and steel frames.
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Old September 30th, 2013, 10:56 PM   #232
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And fins don't bring in any money. Extra floors do.
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Old October 1st, 2013, 06:33 PM   #233
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I like this building very much. It isn't a landmark per se. But that is okay. The building doesn't shout "Hey look at me!" in an flamboyant, deconstructivist manner. It respects the surroundings, and the history of the skyscraper in New York. You can see the influence of the seagram building and the art deco buildings in this project.
It is designed for just this place and city and wouldn't fit in others that well.
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Old October 25th, 2013, 11:05 PM   #234
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Real Estate Industry Poised for Midtown East Rezoning Victory
http://commercialobserver.com/2013/1...oning-victory/

Quote:
final vote on the proposal scheduled for next month
Quote:
The average age of buildings in the district is 73 years old, with 80 percent of all buildings being older than 50 years old, according to REBNY. Over the past decade, only two new office properties have been developed in the district, making a modernization of the area imperative in order to compete globally.
Quote:
A key provision of the rezoning also states that developers would be able to buy extra air rights from the city, for $250 per square foot, through district improvement bonuses, which would foot the bill for improvements to public space in the area. Mr. Olsen said the DIB plan would raise as much as $750 million in funding.
Quote:
Under current zoning, David Levinson, a developer who plans to redevelop an aging office building at 425 Park Avenue, could only rebuild to the same size if he retains 25 percent of the existing structure.

“We think it’s better for both the city and for us that it passes,” he said. “We would have the ability to pay the city up to $35 million dollars (in DIB payments), the ability to tear down 100 percent of the building, and the ability to build the building marginally larger.”
Quote:
The current administration, however, which has put more than 120 rezonings through, is poised to pass the deal on its watch, emphasizing on Tuesday a $100 million program that would fund subway improvements in, around and under Grand Central, including a public plaza south of Grand Central and pedestrian walkways along the Grand Central viaduct.

Meanwhile, the council is slated to vote late next month, and the industry is confident in a favorable outcome.

“I expect it will go through,” Mr. Spinola said. “I still can’t figure out the negatives.”
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Old October 26th, 2013, 12:18 AM   #235
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Honestly this crown looks ridiculous. Why can't they make the building less artificial and build it really higher, instead of making stupid crown?
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Old October 26th, 2013, 12:35 AM   #236
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I take it chrysler and esbs spires are stupid and artificial too?
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Old October 26th, 2013, 12:48 AM   #237
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I personally have no problems with the fins. I really like the building but it may change (hope not) if the rezoning is approved. . Dunno.
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Old October 26th, 2013, 01:39 AM   #238
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Quote:
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Honestly this crown looks ridiculous. Why can't they make the building less artificial and build it really higher, instead of making stupid crown?
Because they are limited by stupidly conservative zoning? Same reason why no one has bothered to build anything in decades?
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Old October 26th, 2013, 03:54 PM   #239
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This tower has been exempted from the 2017 restriction, so it will be a lot taller.
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Old October 29th, 2013, 02:36 AM   #240
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good news! it looked lost there with that big, bold neighbor.
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