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Old November 3rd, 2014, 11:50 PM   #321
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Originally Posted by City-of-Platinum View Post
As much as the new tower is intriguing (although not my favorite design out of the options presented) I'm just exceedingly happy about the ugly building being torn down. What an eyesore. It's fantastic that one more 60's pile of rubbish is being deleted from the NY city-scape. That's a major victory in itself. Ny's office stock is looking a little long in the tooth compared to competitors elsewhere, and I'm sure the trend will continue as more offices age. Less ugly metal piles from the awful decades of the mid-late 20th century and more glassy bright inviting structures is what I want to see.
Just reeks of ignorance. You sound like all the previous generations who wanted the architecture of their immediate predecessors purged from history. People like you are the reason we lost the Prentice Hospital in Chicago.

It's not even from the 60s. It started in 1954, sixty years ago.
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Old November 3rd, 2014, 11:59 PM   #322
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Wow. That's a sweet pic. That must have looked so futuristic back then.
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Old November 4th, 2014, 01:41 PM   #323
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I think the current building's fantastic!

That is also the reason why I like the new design, as it basically plays around with the current buildings design, to me it's the best of both worlds
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Old November 4th, 2014, 04:24 PM   #324
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Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
Just reeks of ignorance. You sound like all the previous generations who wanted the architecture of their immediate predecessors purged from history. People like you are the reason we lost the Prentice Hospital in Chicago.

It's not even from the 60s. It started in 1954, sixty years ago.
How dare you launch into a stupid immature blatant attack against someone's opinion on a subjective subject such as design. This forum isn't about belittling other's views on design or those who you disagree with, but perhaps you didn't get the message. Why don't you just cease with your pontificating snobby holier-than-thou attitude for once and spare me the bother of writing this response. It is obvious You can't accept other people don't like these types of buildings, so you get all uber defensive about it with this pretentious crap you play about how we must 'value' these awful banal piles or that these towers are too sophisiticated to be understood by the average joe blow on the street. Of course, then anybody who doesn't like them are labeled 'ignorant', what a lark! Yes, sometimes people just don't like a style and that doesn't mean they are ignorant or dumber than you, mate.

Your whole attitude reeks of intolerance.You are like the elitist architect who refuses to accept that most people hate his designs because he believes they are too sophisticated for the average person to comprehend, but really they are the product of a megalomaniac ego who is deluded by visions of his own grandeur. You are not the king of architectural opinion. Even if you were the architectural columnist for the NY Times or Mr. Vinoly himself, I would give two craps about your opinion because it is worth about that much anyway. Elitists will never understand what the majority of people like in the built environment and they are happy that way. As far as I'm concerned, you are a dinosaur stuck in a horrible period of history. A time when big business and architecture colluded to produce endless sterile cold and uninviting streetscapes that are disliked by most today. A period that was a necessary step to better more human orientated designs that exist today, but one that is not worthy of the praise you and other fans give it.

Last edited by City-of-Platinum; November 4th, 2014 at 11:02 PM.
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Old November 5th, 2014, 12:28 AM   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by City-of-Platinum View Post
How dare you launch into a stupid immature blatant attack against someone's opinion on a subjective subject such as design. This forum isn't about belittling other's views on design or those who you disagree with, but perhaps you didn't get the message. Why don't you just cease with your pontificating snobby holier-than-thou attitude for once and spare me the bother of writing this response. It is obvious You can't accept other people don't like these types of buildings, so you get all uber defensive about it with this pretentious crap you play about how we must 'value' these awful banal piles or that these towers are too sophisiticated to be understood by the average joe blow on the street. Of course, then anybody who doesn't like them are labeled 'ignorant', what a lark! Yes, sometimes people just don't like a style and that doesn't mean they are ignorant or dumber than you, mate.

Your whole attitude reeks of intolerance.You are like the elitist architect who refuses to accept that most people hate his designs because he believes they are too sophisticated for the average person to comprehend, but really they are the product of a megalomaniac ego who is deluded by visions of his own grandeur. You are not the king of architectural opinion. Even if you were the architectural columnist for the NY Times or Mr. Vinoly himself, I would give two craps about your opinion because it is worth about that much anyway. Elitists will never understand what the majority of people like in the built environment and they are happy that way. As far as I'm concerned, you are a dinosaur stuck in a horrible period of history. A time when big business and architecture colluded to produce endless sterile cold and uninviting streetscapes that are disliked by most today. A period that was a necessary step to better more human orientated designs that exist today, but one that is not worthy of the praise you and other fans give it.
I wish there was a dislike button for posts so I could do that for yours. You cant start a post by saying
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How dare you launch into a stupid immature blatant attack against someone's opinion on a subjective subject such as design.
Then proceed to launch into a stupid immature blatant attack on someone yourself. By the time you got to your second paragraph, your argument wasn't even criticizing his opinions on architecture, the very thing you chastised ThatOneGuy for, you went deeper than that and insulted him as a person. I won't take sides here, but when you say things like
Quote:
Originally Posted by City-of-Platinum View Post
Your whole attitude reeks of intolerance.You are like the elitist architect who refuses to accept that most people hate his designs because he believes they are too sophisticated for the average person to comprehend, but really they are the product of a megalomaniac ego who is deluded by visions of his own grandeur.
and expect people to think too highly of posts like this. They're just childish.
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Old November 5th, 2014, 05:44 AM   #326
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Quote:
"Why don't you just cease with your pontificating snobby holier-than-thou attitude for once"
Quote:
"I wouldn't give two craps about your opinion because it is worth about that much anyway"
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Old November 6th, 2014, 05:36 AM   #327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NatFan9 View Post
I wish there was a dislike button for posts so I could do that for yours. You cant start a post by saying

Then proceed to launch into a stupid immature blatant attack on someone yourself. By the time you got to your second paragraph, your argument wasn't even criticizing his opinions on architecture, the very thing you chastised ThatOneGuy for, you went deeper than that and insulted him as a person. I won't take sides here, but when you say things like

and expect people to think too highly of posts like this. They're just childish.
I responded a bit over the top i suppose with that second paragraph.

But, you can't just label people's opinions as 'ignorant' just because you disagree and then proceed to use a childish generalization grouping me with people from the past who would erase all buildings of their forefathers. This is a dumb attack that is untrue as well because I take no such attitude at all (case by case basis for me). You don't even know me or what I would do with that building in Chicago. I looked it up and I think it's a building that 's worth keeping actually, so he's wrong ha. If I don't like this or that building though and others like it, so what? He actually group me in with people who demolish buildings that he likes because he is angry, haha . This person is just mad that not everyone agrees with his opinion and then he gets on the high horse and lays out the insults if people don't think the same way. He just made insulting conjectures and stupid leaps in order to vent his frustration.

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Old November 6th, 2014, 06:35 AM   #328
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I said it's ignorant to just dismiss an entire era of architecture as if it were worthless. Calling someone ignorant isn't an insult. It suggests you have to do some research. The ignorant previous generations thought that victorian buildings were tacky and overwrought and now many of those buildings are demolished. For example, Oscar Wilde called the Chicago Water Tower a castellated monstrosity covered in pepperboxes.

Quote:
"It's fantastic that one more 60's pile of rubbish is being deleted from the NY city-scape."
By the way, this comment sounds like elitism.
Such cynicism against early and mid-century modernism has resulted in some gems being lost that the future generations will never be able to see.
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Old November 6th, 2014, 06:38 AM   #329
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try calling someone ignorant on the street in NYC.

Perhaps in your culture it isn't, but it is definitely on the insulting side because it implies that someone is too stupid or lazy to have bothered to learn something. Also, you generalized me and grouped me with others.. So, umm, yeah. It's an insult there again because you group me with people who demolish towers which are nice. But i'll overlook it. I could be ignorant -- or I could have done the research already.. how do you know? Even after doing the research and learning a lot more about those towers, I may still despise them. So really, is it right to attack my ideas as ignorant when I could have already done the research and still hate it?

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Old November 6th, 2014, 06:44 AM   #330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
I said it's ignorant to just dismiss an entire era of architecture as if it were worthless. Calling someone ignorant isn't an insult. It suggests you have to do some research. The ignorant previous generations thought that victorian buildings were tacky and overwrought and now many of those buildings are demolished. For example, Oscar Wilde called the Chicago Water Tower a castellated monstrosity covered in pepperboxes.



By the way, this comment sounds like elitism.
Such cynicism against early and mid-century modernism has resulted in some gems being lost that the future generations will never be able to see.
Not really, I may just hate that style. Even if I read a thousand books and looked at a million examples, I might still hate it. So, no, research may not be the answer. Calling me ignorant is your opinion, I have no duty to appreciate the style although I don't hate all of it. The universal truth is not in your hands and you can't say that it is ignorant to dismiss an entire era of architecture. I never did though, you read between the lines and surmised that I did.

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Old November 6th, 2014, 06:50 AM   #331
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I used to hate 80s-early 00s postmodernism, and then I did research and got into the fine detailing and concepts behind it. Even though it's a dead and dated style, I like it now.

I said you sounded like those who wanted the architecture of their immediate predecessors erased. Because that's exactly what you said. You grouped all 60s architecture as just 'uninviting metal rubbish' when there's far, far more to it than that. That's where the research comes in.
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Old November 6th, 2014, 07:00 AM   #332
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That happened to me with some difficult music genres. However, Research may not be the answer though. Even if you understand it intellectually, you may not respond emotionally and hate it forever and feel it oppresses your city and have no qualms with dismissing it all. You can appreciate other's appreciation when you educate yourself, but may still hate it yourself. If you are in a position of power, the equation is different perhaps and you have a responsibility to be more sensitive about knocking down towers, but then it's up to the government and people to protect structures that are deemed important You can't expect a profit hungary construction firm to care about the intricacies of 60's design.

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Old November 6th, 2014, 07:04 AM   #333
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I never said i hated ALL examples of the era or to demolish all of these styles. Are you Reading between the lines here. There are several I like indeed, but I prefer the street experience of a light modern tower especially in a confined canyon city.


The solution is to keep the standouts and not the poorly aging mediocre examples that are numerous and dominate much of midtown. This one has aged poorly and isn't much to look at now. I happen to think that most of these towers are ugly and there are only a small amount of standouts that should be kept (although it depends on the replacement which could be even worse. You seem to differ and want to keep a lot more of them. Well, to each their own.

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Old November 13th, 2014, 04:23 PM   #334
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From YIMBY: http://newyorkyimby.com/2014/11/new-...rk-avenue.html

Nice vid showing 425 Park Avenue (and the skyline):

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Old November 13th, 2014, 08:05 PM   #335
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Very nice. I'm ecstatic about this tower.
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Old November 13th, 2014, 10:55 PM   #336
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If only it were taller... One Vanderbilt will immensely overshadow it. Dem horns on the music track though.
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Old November 14th, 2014, 12:02 AM   #337
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Yeah.. just seeing it dwarfed by 432 Park across the street is staggering in that in many skylines it would be a truly impressive presence of its own. But still even if not nearly as prominent with the supertalls going up in the area it's a gorgeous remake. Too bad they weren't able because of the current(and hopefully soon to be amended regulations) completely tear down and rebuild but this is an excellent alternative and thankfully it's going to start coming to fruition next year. That music track was great!!!!!!!!
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Old November 14th, 2014, 12:49 AM   #338
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Woooow. the lighting scheme on this tower is going to kick a$$
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Old November 14th, 2014, 12:56 AM   #339
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Yea the lighting will be awesome. I'm a big fan of Lord Norman Foster. I even like his rezzi tower in Chelsea. Looked really nice so far if you see it in person.
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Old November 14th, 2014, 01:46 AM   #340
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Yea its a great tower, but it desperately needs a height increase, especially since it will be in the shadow of 432 park.
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