daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Forums > Architecture > European Classic Architecture and Landscapes

European Classic Architecture and Landscapes All related to historical buildings and landscapes of the old world.



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old July 10th, 2013, 12:38 PM   #361
markfos
San Escobar
 
markfos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,492
Likes (Received): 4277

Well its kind of weird that 0,5 mln city, capital of one of the EU countries, has only bus and trolley system. Its a bit provincial.
__________________

smugler, Highcliff liked this post
markfos está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 10th, 2013, 12:51 PM   #362
Prosp
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 437
Likes (Received): 348

Quote:
Originally Posted by markfos View Post
Well its kind of weird that 0,5 mln city, capital of one of the EU countries, has only bus and trolley system. Its a bit provincial.
Maybe it looks like, but all in all, pubic transport system is based on the needs. If there were no reason in past to have a tram system and if bus/trolley system works fine for us, i see no reason why we must invest large sums of money to redevelop all system...As i have said, there are many new proposals. Trams are included, also metro. It is question of time.

Also, there are some problems with trams/metro. Vilnius landscape, geological type of land (many underground rivers), unesco regulation etc. It makes many problems.

Eco-buses will change all old bus network in two-five years.
We have more concerns about cycling, because it becomes more and more popular.Even in winters
Prosp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 12:58 PM   #363
markfos
San Escobar
 
markfos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,492
Likes (Received): 4277

Kraków is the UNESCO city as well and built underground fast city tram. Cities even smaller than Vilnius build new tramlines in Poland.
__________________

smugler, Highcliff liked this post
markfos está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 01:17 PM   #364
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Quote:
Originally Posted by markfos View Post
Kraków is the UNESCO city as well and built underground fast city tram. Cities even smaller than Vilnius build new tramlines in Poland.
Why do you care about trams so much? Is it really so important to go from one commie block district in Wroclaw, Szczecin, etc. to another by train? Actually, in my opinion cities like Szczecin or Bialystok are rather provincial when compared to cultural, historic sites in Vilnius/Wilno. Over 30 astonishing historic Catholic Churches with preserved rich interiors, beautiful palaces of Polish-Lithuanian nobility and tenements, huge Old Town, etc.

Last edited by RS_UK-PL; July 10th, 2013 at 01:25 PM.
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 01:20 PM   #365
markfos
San Escobar
 
markfos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,492
Likes (Received): 4277

Białystok has no tram system as well, but yeahh I kind of like trams, they provide a nice urban atmosphere, and Szczecin, is a great, beautiful city, with this big city feeling, I love it!.
__________________
markfos está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 01:37 PM   #366
Prosp
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 437
Likes (Received): 348

Quote:
Originally Posted by markfos View Post
Kraków is the UNESCO city as well and built underground fast city tram. Cities even smaller than Vilnius build new tramlines in Poland.
Even though Vilnius is planning to build tram/metro line, it is highly doubtful, that the lines will go somewhere in the Old Tow/Center. But we will see.
Big city feeling is not only about public transport system. As i have said few post previously, it is very personal attitude. I prefer ITC, design, start-ups cluster and position of Vilnius in those fields. or let's take, for instance, some urban, entertainment, cultural venues in Vilnius, like, let's say, Loftas at the moment.

Last edited by Prosp; July 10th, 2013 at 01:43 PM.
Prosp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 01:38 PM   #367
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Quote:
Originally Posted by markfos View Post
and Szczecin, is a great, beautiful city, with this big city feeling, I love it!.
Because bigger is better...

Last edited by RS_UK-PL; July 10th, 2013 at 03:56 PM.
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 02:00 PM   #368
Don Vito KurDeBalanz
zdradziecka morda
 
Don Vito KurDeBalanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kanaliopolis
Posts: 2,667
Likes (Received): 18939

Quote:
Originally Posted by RS_UK-PL View Post
... Actually, in my opinion cities like Szczecin are rather provincial ...
Don't go this way , it's one way road with a dead end
__________________

smugler liked this post
Don Vito KurDeBalanz no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 02:20 PM   #369
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Vito KurDeBalanz View Post
Don't go this way , it's one way road with a dead end
Ok, sorry about that. But to be honest, I'd rather live in a place like below, filled with small shops, bars, historic monuments, museums, etc., than in one of many blokowisko districts in today's Poland.











__________________

Highcliff liked this post

Last edited by RS_UK-PL; July 10th, 2013 at 03:29 PM.
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 03:38 PM   #370
Don Vito KurDeBalanz
zdradziecka morda
 
Don Vito KurDeBalanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kanaliopolis
Posts: 2,667
Likes (Received): 18939

You don't have to be sorry as no offence was taken . You know that I feel you. Vilnius/Wilno is a real gem but there are blokowisko districts like in every (post) soviet teritories cities. It's not only historical centre for turists that's there.
Still as a thread is about polish cities I'll find a moment to prove you wrong claiming that Szczecin is blokowisko only .
With regards to Szczecin being "provincial" - that's your "saint" right to claim and i'll never argue with that kind of opinion.
__________________

RS_UK-PL, Highcliff liked this post
Don Vito KurDeBalanz no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 10:38 PM   #371
Martin_W
Registered User
 
Martin_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,456
Likes (Received): 1733

TORUŃ

pic from: turystyka.torun.pl
__________________

Highcliff liked this post
Martin_W no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2013, 11:41 PM   #372
Urbanista1
Here and Now
 
Urbanista1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,426
Likes (Received): 5284

I've never been to Vilnius (should go my maternal grandmother's family is from there). I hear it's beautiful but also suffers from the same modernist blight that most cities in the west also suffer from, the so-called commie-blocks in Eastern Europe, Projects and massive ugly urban sprawl in the US and Canada, the UK suffers from hideous new towns as does France and all over Europe we have the ugly pre-fab apartment towers of the post war modernists. All cities have this problem, some worse than others. The one good thing about former commie europe is that there is no wasteful ugly suburban sprawl that devours farmland, the commie blocks promoted fairly dense development at least that spared farmland.

So it really is unfair to trash Poland for its ugly blokowsko (commie blocks) districts, there is plenty of it everywhere,

Now, as for the beautiful cities, it would be very unfair to exclude Gdansk, Wroclaw, Poznan, Torun and even Lodz, which will be spectacular once the pace of restoration quickens. You should see Wroclaw and Gdansk today, even if there are many vacant parcels where pre-war construction hasn't been rebuilt yet, these cities are becoming absolutely stunning with their mix of historic and modern, much of it quite good really. If we're comparing old towns, then yes porbably Vilnius, Lviv and Krakow and Prague are best, but a city is more than just the old town, just feel the energy in Wroclaw and Lodz these days
__________________
ten rząd wstrząsa podstawami naszej państwowości i funkcjonowania społeczeństwa. Natomiast większość społeczeństwa śpi, nie zwraca uwagi, co się dzieje i trzeba je z tego snu obudzić - Piotr S


Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

Highcliff liked this post
Urbanista1 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2013, 12:31 AM   #373
Prosp
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 437
Likes (Received): 348

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanista1 View Post
I've never been to Vilnius (should go my maternal grandmother's family is from there). I hear it's beautiful but also suffers from the same modernist blight that most cities in the west also suffer from, the so-called commie-blocks in Eastern Europe, Projects and massive ugly urban sprawl in the US and Canada, the UK suffers from hideous new towns as does France and all over Europe we have the ugly pre-fab apartment towers of the post war modernists. All cities have this problem, some worse than others. The one good thing about former commie europe is that there is no wasteful ugly suburban sprawl that devours farmland, the commie blocks promoted fairly dense development at least that spared farmland.

So it really is unfair to trash Poland for its ugly blokowsko (commie blocks) districts, there is plenty of it everywhere,

Now, as for the beautiful cities, it would be very unfair to exclude Gdansk, Wroclaw, Poznan, Torun and even Lodz, which will be spectacular once the pace of restoration quickens. You should see Wroclaw and Gdansk today, even if there are many vacant parcels where pre-war construction hasn't been rebuilt yet, these cities are becoming absolutely stunning with their mix of historic and modern, much of it quite good really. If we're comparing old towns, then yes porbably Vilnius, Lviv and Krakow and Prague are best, but a city is more than just the old town, just feel the energy in Wroclaw and Lodz these days
I do not want to agree with You. Maybe You will one day come to Vilnius and see for yourself, but in my opinion:
1. Vilnius NCC is not very high. Actually, the highest building is Europa Tower and there will not be more higher building. Why? Because if you look from some panoramic spots and from some OldTown places, highrises might drown with or put into the shade with Gediminas Tower/Upper Castle ruins. So, the X structure/project can not be heigher than Europa Tower, because it will contradict with Gediminas Tower and Old Town. It is a very strict rule, sometimes very expensive and cost us investments in NCC.
Copenhagen and many other Northern Europe cities also does not have highrises and concentrate on smaller highrises (at the moment in Vilniu - K29 project, DNB bank HQ, later - Vilniaus Vartų/gates of Vilnius expansion (Arches project) )
On the other hand, there are territories in Vilnius where higher building can be built. (Western City center);

2. Modern Architecture quality. Well, it is, you know, a subjective matter and our outlook depends on our taste.. But. Every project must be confirmed by Commision of Architects. They can agree with project, give some explanations, say some observations, comments, they pay attention even on details. Main thing - a building/project must fit into the environment and can not contradict with older building. For instance, this is a new modern (that glassy one) building in Gediminas avenue (New/Old Town):


© xxl

So you can not build whatever you want. Public interest uber alles

3. Soviet-era architecture. It was in very heigh level. For instance, National Art Gallery building, some buildings in Gedeminas avenue can stand in most developed cities which has a strict heritage protection. Reasons why in Vilnius soviet time architecture is very good are several: archtects continued interwar architecture and design tradition (arch. Šeibokas building in one corner in Gediminas prospect), they tried to implement less social realism connotations, we had very developed interior design school (Neringa, Lietuva Hotel, Sporto rūmai hall and others ). Sometimes architects cheated and said to Moscow: "we need more money, because constrcutors chrashed glass-windows" or smth like that. So, architects had good possibilities to develop their ideas and used expensive materials. For instance, Opera and Ballet Theater (here is a link with all rejeted/confirmed projects) - http://www.autc.lt/Public/HeritageOb...=3&oe=5&id=931

Plus, we had some Nordic influence (particularly from Finland).

Yes, there are some building in the OldTown, which are...not in the right place, like Salomėjos Nėries gymnasium or Contemprorary Art Musem. But. This is the only one drawback. Architecture of above-mentioned buildings looks great. Other buildings (former cinema" Lietuva" sooner or later will be demolished).

4. Suburb district (so called "sleeping district"). I terms of life quality, i think, they are great (i think the same is in Poland). Compare them with some London's districts. Or with some Italian districts. Not so bad, I think.
Architecture? Well, Lazdynų district is based on one Helsinki district example. More similarities than differences.
Actually, probably all commieblock districts were developed on the example of Lazdynai, this means, "a district in the forest". Nature is very noticeable in Vilnius.
---
See You in Vilnius.
__________________

Highcliff liked this post

Last edited by Prosp; July 11th, 2013 at 01:04 AM.
Prosp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2013, 01:03 AM   #374
Urbanista1
Here and Now
 
Urbanista1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,426
Likes (Received): 5284

I agree, modern architecture can be ok as long as it fits into the existing fabric of a city and doesn't stick out. I'm glad that Vilnius is not allowing for very tall buildings too close to the old town and that you are developing a separate district for that. And most architects during this era of skyscrapers forget that low or mid-rise buildings are not necessarily low density, you can get almost the same density from mid-rise as high rises in most cases without the environmental impact (overshadowing, winds etc).

I am very much looking forward to visiting Vilnius and finding some of my roots.
__________________
ten rząd wstrząsa podstawami naszej państwowości i funkcjonowania społeczeństwa. Natomiast większość społeczeństwa śpi, nie zwraca uwagi, co się dzieje i trzeba je z tego snu obudzić - Piotr S


Warsaw Post-War Reconstruction to Present

Highcliff liked this post
Urbanista1 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2013, 06:04 AM   #375
Marbur66
Registered User
 
Marbur66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,253
Likes (Received): 10022

Quote:
Originally Posted by markfos View Post
Kraków is the UNESCO city as well and built underground fast city tram. Cities even smaller than Vilnius build new tramlines in Poland.
Let it go bro, who gives a damn about trams.
__________________
"We rarely find that people have good sense unless they agree with us."
Marbur66 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2013, 12:58 PM   #376
AmoreUrbs
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 661
Likes (Received): 4322

I appreciate the work that has been done in Warsaw to rebuild the former beauty, it's been wonderful.. I'm not much informed about Polish cities, but once eliminated the commie blocks and other grim parts of the cities, you have lot of gems.. Krakow and Sczecin are also beautiful
AmoreUrbs no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 14th, 2013, 10:56 AM   #377
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Old Krakow

Kraków barbican and city walls


Market Square


City Hall


Trinity Church


__________________

smugler, Urbanista1, Highcliff liked this post
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 14th, 2013, 12:30 PM   #378
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Gothic High Castle in Lwow/Lviv (built in 1362 by the King of Poland Kazimierz Wielki)


Renaissance Town Hall in Przemysl (built in the 15th century)


Early Baroque Kazimierz Palace in Warsaw (erected in 1637-41 for King of Poland Władysław IV)
__________________

smugler, Highcliff liked this post
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 15th, 2013, 09:34 PM   #379
musiccity
Retired Mod
 
musiccity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 18,088
Likes (Received): 15099

I think Olsztyn is fairly gorgeous!

image hosted on flickr

Olsztyn, Old Town by Rapsak, on Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Olsztyn by punk17er, on Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Olsztyn by RAWF85, on Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Olsztyn by PolandMFA, on Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Olsztyn in May by wyrzykus, on Flickr
__________________
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”

-Mark Twain

smugler, Highcliff liked this post
musiccity no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 15th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #380
RS_UK-PL
Registered User
 
RS_UK-PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: R-L1029
Posts: 2,301
Likes (Received): 3392

Sometimes it's really hard to believe that so many buildings in Olsztyn have been built after the war, just historicist architecture beautifully integrated into the landscape.



image hosted on flickr


Rebuilt and re-Gothicised Old Town Hall is quite impressive as well.



__________________

smugler, rufix, Highcliff liked this post

Last edited by RS_UK-PL; July 15th, 2013 at 10:31 PM.
RS_UK-PL no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
breslau, bydgoszcz, gdańsk, kraków, lublin, podlaskie, poznań, poznan, przemyśl, stargard, toruń, warszawa, wrocław, zamość, zamosc

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu