Newcastle and the North East - RELIGIOUS BUILDINGS, Churches and other Religious Places

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by Newcastle Historian

There are a few photos of (old) Gloucester Street here . . .

http://www.flickr.com/search/?ss=2&w...+street&m=text

The photos there appear to include . . .

1 - A Christian Mission Hall
2 - A Catholic Apostolic Church
and
3 - A Baptist Church

. . . but nothing that says it is a former synagogue.

We may have discussed this previously on this forum, and the best place to start (if you have not already) is via the posts linked from (and those other posts 'around' where those links take you) the JEWISH RELIGIOUS PLACES IN NEWCASTLE section, on the 'Index Thread'.

You could also try under Gloucester Road, for mentions of 'Gloucester Street'.

This is a bit of a guess, but....

image hosted on flickr


shows the Catholic Apostolic Church. If you look at the windows you'll see three hexgram 'Star of David' in the circle above the central door. They are actually quite common in Christian churches, but if someone didn't know that, and didn't know the history of the building it would be easy to assume it was an old synagogue. The fact that it doesn't have a 'steeple' so doesn't look churchy might also point in that direction.

[Steve Ellwood]

Originally Posted by Newcastle Historian

.
This Project has been fully covered on THIS thread, mainly by 'Stamford', with some great photos throughout the carrying out of the works.

Below is an article about it from 'The Journal' of 10th May 2011. It (at the time I uploaded it) did not include a photo within its on-line version, so I have inserted one of Stamfords . . .

New attraction at Newcastle's St Nicholas Cathedral
by Tony Henderson, The Journal, May 10th 2011



A VENTURE which brings star quality to a key city centre site will be dedicated this week.

A £215,000 pocket park and new public square has been created in front of the north door of St Nicholas Cathedral in Newcastle.

The centrepiece of the project is a star burst picked out in granite against the Caithness stone of the square.

Tom Robinson, of Robinson Landscape Design, based at Cathedral Buildings in Dean Street in Newcastle, came up with the star idea.

He based the concept on the fact that St Nicholas is the patron saint of mariners and that the cathedral’s lantern tower echoes this.

“On high days and holidays they would have lit a lantern in the form of a brazier in the tower,” said Mr Robinson.

“The star burst of light is like a lighthouse or beacon.”

The square replaces a raised plinth which formed a barrier between Mosley Street and the cathedral.


Read More - http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-e...#ixzz1LvyMaH9q

The photograph in the Journal gives a good view of the new area from a slightly raised angle - looks good when you see it's championship to the Cathedral. Good piece of work from the stonemasons

[Newcastle Historian]

Originally Posted by Steve Ellwood

The photograph in the Journal gives a good view of the new area from a slightly raised angle - looks good when you see it's championship to the Cathedral. Good piece of work from the stonemasons

Ah yes, the photo is there within the Journal 'online article' now (it never is first thing) so here it is . . .




I also like what they have done there, it is quite 'striking' and a more open space than previously.

[Newcastle Historian]

Originally Posted by Irish Blood English Heart

I agree it looks good, though a bit unsure on the pink granite beside the grass, but other than that looks a nice space.

Designed to blend in with the pre-existing stone plinth around Queen Vic!

[Newcastle Historian]

Originally Posted by Elswick

Although not Jewish myself. I recently discovered that the house I grew up in was built on the site of a former synagogue in Gloucester Street, Elswick. Does anyone have any information or photographs of this perhaps.

Also St John's Cemetery in Elswick has a huge Jewish section, this would seem to indicate there was once a large Jewish population in that area. Again any information would be welcome.

The above question, posed on the Questions thread, was thoroughly answered on that thread, but I am using it simply to introduce the below article that is on the BBC News Tyne & Wear Website, today.

The historical subjects of Jewish Graveyards, Synagogue Locations, and history of the Jewish people in the North East generally, have all been well covered on this forum of late.

If you look in the INDEX, you will find a fair number of links to those discussions.

This is todays article . . .


North East Jewish community fades
BBC News, Tyne & Wear Website, 17th May 2011



The Jewish community in the North East of England is shrinking, according to Rabbi Dovid Lewis, who has led the United Hebrew Synagogue in the Gosforth area of Newcastle since 2004.

Many synagogues have closed across the North East - those that are left have an ageing congregation and few children.

Rabbi Dovid and his wife are about to move to Manchester to take up a position in a much larger and more vibrant congregation.

He said: "We're in our 30s and we've still got 30 or 40 years worth of work left within us and we were looking for a community which is younger.

"The community that we're going to has got an average age of 40, there are 150 primary school children, as opposed to the 10 in Newcastle, it was the next step, that unfortunately we had to take."

Many synogogues across the North East have closed over the years as many Jews have moved to Manchester and London.

Rabbi Dovid said: "The Jewish community in the North East is shrinking. It wasn't so long ago there were synagogues dotted all around the North East... and the community is slowly but surely contracting."


Read More - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-13414672

[merleb]

However the Orthodox community in Gateshead is thriving.

The average number of children per couple is 11.

The Newcastle community has been declining for decades now and of course the only reason the Gateshead Jews are there is because they left the Newcastle brethren because of disillusionment several years ago.

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by merleb

However the Orthodox community in Gateshead is thriving.

The average number of children per couple is 11.

The Newcastle community has been declining for decades now and of course the only reason the Gateshead Jews are there is because they left the Newcastle brethren because of disillusionment several years ago.

Like many religions Judaism has many threads, and they don't always mix too well. Not a great comparison but a Glaswegian, Rangers supporting protestant might not be flavour of the month 'down the Catholic club'.

The Gateshead community is almost exclusively Ashkenazi [ultra] Orthodox which makes it unusual in the UK. In addition because of the number of Yeshiva the population changes hugely in and out of term time.

[alf stone]

Originally Posted by merleb

However the Orthodox community in Gateshead is thriving.

The average number of children per couple is 11.

Merleb is that statement about the average number of children per Jewish couple based on evidence and if so could we know the source?

[Steve Ellwood]

Good to see the a Planning Application has been made for the restoration of the War Memorial that stands on Whitley Bay Links. Just a shame that it was permitted to get into such a state!

Planning Application Ref 11/01010/LBC @ http://publicaccess.northtyneside.go...rchtype=WEEKLY

Re-pointing granite shaft, plinth, walls and steps: Replacement of stainless steel plaques with bronze

1. Masonry repairs and repointing to the granite shaft, plinth, low walls and steps of the Memorial.
2. The lifting and relaying of the granite setts forming the floor of the enclosure round the base of the plinth.
3. The cleaning, repatination and waxing of the existing bronze plaques and
decorations including repair and refixing of two damaged plaques, all related to the First World War.
4. The replacement with bronze plaques of all the stainless steel plates with lists of those who lost their lives in the Second World War.

From the Design, Access and Heritage Statement:
The Whitley Bay War Memorial is a Grade II structure commemorating the men who gave their lives in the First World War from all three armed services and the Merchant Navy. The names of all those who gave their lives in the Second World War were added in further record, so the Memorial forms the principal focus of the community’s tribute to those who died in both great conflicts.

Tyne and Wear HER (7380) describes the Memorial thus:
“War Memorial: Circa 1919. Granite memorial with bronze decoration and plaques; granite piers. Tall tapered square column. Bronze wreath decoration beneath Scotiamoulded and banded coping. Three bronze plaques on projecting panels bear the names of dead of both World Wars and commemorate the building of the memorial paid for by £7000.00 public subscription and £1000.00 from local authority funds.
Dwarf walls and semi-circular steps on North and South. Low square piers flank the steps. Twenty tapered square piers in outer circle formerly held chain.”

This description must have been made at a particular point in time after the theft of other bronze plaques, one relating to the First World War the rest recording Second World War losses. These were replaced with flat stainless steel panels with engraved lettering some filled with enamel but all of a very different character from the original bronze.

The War Memorial stands in a prominent position on the open Links opposite the Spanish City very definitely in the public eye since the Links are popular with both locals and holidaymakers as outdoor space close to the Town Centre. Since this memorial has a notable proportion of Royal Navy and Merchant Navy names it is of added poignancy that the site is so close to the sea.

[merleb]

Originally Posted by alf stone

Merleb is that statement about the average number of children per Jewish couple based on evidence and if so could we know the source?

Without saying too much I can tell you that I have worked closely with the Jewish Community in Gateshead for a few years and I am speaking from personal experience.

It is rare for a Jewish mother to have fewer than 8 children. Many, many families have 14 or 15 children.

Also Gateshead attracts Orthodox Jews from all around the world as, to put it crudely, it is their version of Oxford University as regards Talmudical and Rabbinical Studies.

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by merleb

Without saying too much I can tell you that I have worked closely with the Jewish Community in Gateshead for a few years and I am speaking from personal experience.

It is rare for a Jewish mother to have fewer than 8 children. Many, many families have 14 or 15 children.

Also Gateshead attracts Orthodox Jews from all around the world as, to put it crudely, it is their version of Oxford University as regards Talmudical and Rabbinical Studies.

I would say that this is probably correct, certainly amongst the ultra orthodox community, though I couldn't support it with 'firm' evidence.

The area is a centre of Jewish learning - though it ain't got the charm of Oxford

[Newcastle Historian]

Historic Local First Day Covers.
Part Twenty One


This 21st 'Local Commemorative Cover' commemorates the Centenary of the Diocese of Newcastle, in 1982.

It was issued on St Nicholas Day, 6th December 1982.

The 'Diocese of Newcastle', created in 1882, was detached from the Diocese of Durham, which up until 1882 stretched from the Tees to the Tweed. It was created as part of the Church of Englands response to the many problems and opportunities presented by the huge new populations developing in the major Cities of England, caused by the impact of the Industrial Revolution.





NB - A complete list of all the 'Local Commemorative First Day Covers' in this series, is now listed on the INDEX Thread under the letter "F" (First Day Covers) with direct links to the post containing each individual cover - http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...61&postcount=7

.

[Steve Ellwood]

A Fine and Private Place - Jesmond Old Cemetery by Alan Morgan and published by Tyne Bridge Publishing, ISBN185795 155 7.
An A5 sized softback book running to 80 pages.

One of my most thumbed books, a treasure trove of Newcastle's historical figures who now reside in Jesmond Old Cemetery.

Alan's book charts the reasons for the building of the Cemetery, has maps and drawings of the original design. He then moves on to explain Rites and Rituals covering such things as internment costs and the cost of mourning dress.

The book covers the three sections of the Cemetery, North West, South West and East, giving maps for each and identifying where the featured graves are located. He then covers some 105 individual graves, outlining the history and background of each individual, with the support of photographs and drawings of both headstones and buildings associated with many of the featured people.

A valuable resource and an essential guide to anyone wishing to seek out Newcastle's rich and famous as well as the less known.

[Newcastle Historian]

Originally Posted by Steve Ellwood; May 18th 2011

Good to see the a Planning Application has been made for the restoration of the War Memorial that stands on Whitley Bay Links. Just a shame that it was permitted to get into such a state!

Planning Application Ref 11/01010/LBC @ http://publicaccess.northtyneside.go...rchtype=WEEKLY

The War Memorial stands in a prominent position on the open Links opposite the Spanish City very definitely in the public eye since the Links are popular with both locals and holidaymakers as outdoor space close to the Town Centre. Since this memorial has a notable proportion of Royal Navy and Merchant Navy names it is of added poignancy that the site is so close to the sea.[/I]

Whitley Bay war memorial set to be restored
by Sonia Sharma, Evening Chronicle, May 31st 2011


Whitley Bay war memorial will be repaired, cleaned and stolen bronze plaques will also be replaced in the scheme

A WAR memorial that has been blighted by vandals and thieves is to be restored to save it from further attacks.

The monument on The Links, in Whitley Bay, honours soldiers who died in the First and Second World Wars.

The Grade II-listed structure has had bronze plaques stolen from the site in the past and they have had to be replaced with stainless steel plates.

Now North Tyneside Council has drawn up proposals to restore the memorial.

Work will include masonry repairs to the granite shaft, plinth, low walls and steps, and the cleaning of existing First World War bronze plaques and decorations.

Two damaged plates will be repaired.

In addition, all the stainless steel tablets with lists of those who died in the Second World War will be replaced with bronze plaques.

They will then be coated with anti-theft SmartWater liquid in an effort to deter thieves.


Read More - http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/north...#ixzz1NwKu2IXf

[Steve Ellwood]

There was a discussion on the General Knowlege thread about the hoarding at the Quayside Pocket Park that shows All Saint Church with some unusual additions.

Well I went for a closer look and low and behold I think I have located the ghost of Jack the Beadle

This is the story of Jack:

When inner Town Church burials were banned in 1854 Jack who was the Beadle at All Saints lost many of the fees that would end up in his pocket following burials. To maintain his finances Jack embarked on a scheme to dig up graves and recover lead from the coffins.

His enterprise was found out and it is reported that such was the mood of the populace that if they got their hands on him he would have been torn limb from limb.

He was eventually tried and sentenced at the Guildhall to 18 months hard labour.

The local children thought up this little ditty which is sung to the tune of Pop Goes The Weasel:

If you want to rob the deed
Gan to Jack the Beadle
He's the man that stole the leed
Pop goes the weasel

Jack's Ghost is claimed to haunt the graveyard - so is that the figure in the shots?

So I wonder if this is him?

[Deebex]

Originally Posted by Steve Ellwood

There was a discussion on the General Knowlege thread about the hoarding at the Quayside Pocket Park that shows All Saint Church with some unusual additions.

Not just unusual additions, but an unusual background too. I've just realised on seeing your pics that the background offices (i.e. one of T Dan Smith's grand visions) have been airbrushed out and replaced with some lovely trees/sky.

Also, if you visit All Saints Church and look at where your red arrow is pointing in the above pic, you will see a very 'James Bond' style approach to disabled access/fire escape. A whole section of the wall below the window pivots down to facilitate access and egress. The stonework on that bit is (I think) fibreglass.

T Dan Smith as a James Bond villain, hmmmm

[GBDT]

Originally Posted by Deebex

Also, if you visit All Saints Church and look at where your red arrow is pointing in the above pic, you will see a very 'James Bond' style approach to disabled access/fire escape. A whole section of the wall below the window pivots down to facilitate access and egress. The stonework on that bit is (I think) fibreglass.

This is from a series of photos showing the opening of the fire exit. The 'fibreglass is on a steel sub frame though :-)

image hosted on flickr

Photo from P&T Image Archive, NCC, hosted on my flikr account.

Cheers
GBDT

[Deebex]

Originally Posted by GBDT

This is from a series of photos showing the opening of the fire exit. The 'fibreglass is on a steel sub frame though :-)

GBDT

I may be wrong re. the fibreglass - it could actually be real stonework. I'll have to check

[Steve Ellwood]

Originally Posted by Deebex

I may be wrong re. the fibreglass - it could actually be real stonework. I'll have to check

The original stones were cut to use on the frontage of the exit - I did hear tell that the exit isn't used these days (meant for disabled access) as it is too expensive to put right if it breaks down

[WilfBurnsFan]

Originally Posted by Steve Ellwood

My understanding of burials at the Gaol was that only a small number were actually buried there - something like 13 springs to mind. When the Telephone Exchange was built they were exhumed and buried elsewhere. However there was one mystery in as much as one coffin exhumed did not contain any human remains!

Apologies for going a bit off-topic, but that seems a very low number given that Newcastle Prison would have been used for executions from when it was built (1830s?40s?) up to the 1920s. Wasn't part of the death sentence rubric "and that your body be buried within the precincts of that gaol" or words to that effect?

Maybe they didn't bother mark most of the burial sites.