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Supertalls Discussions of projects under construction between 300-599m/1,000-1,999ft tall.
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Old July 29th, 2014, 04:11 PM   #1201
Tikal
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Nice, what is the road that comes out from a tunnel and goes around that building ?
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Old July 29th, 2014, 04:52 PM   #1202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by generalscarr View Post
What are you talking about? No curves here. The angles are off how...?
Please enlighten all the mortals here and shed a little light on how a real architectural mastermind like yourself would go about designing this tower - I hope you're listening too KPF!
Is the building a box? If not, then it has curves. Here you go: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curve. I think it's always best to take a deep breath and research before berating someone for their commentary (especially a subjective opinion). You can then be sassy and condescending when you have a basic understanding at hand.

As for the angles, imo they are too sharp and the change between the lines is too abrupt. The best curvy buildings follow the Verre model of a shifting shape. Either you go for boxy and monolithic (like Sears) or go for a more sinewy design that's gradual and flows well (like the Shanghai Tower). This tower tries to blend boxy and monolithic with having an evocative design and it doesn't work well. There's too much 'stuff' going on (meaningless angles, random materials, plant walls next to Greek columns under copper ceilings and sand-colored floors leading out towards gray lined walkways full of Modern Art. How is that cohesive?) None of that 'stuff' is particularly well-thought out. I think the crown is the epitome of 'hot mess'.

I like KPF generally: Heron Tower, ICC Hong Kong, Shanghai WFC. This design, however, is in need of a major revamp. At least the height is good and there's no random trees sticking out of the building.
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Old July 29th, 2014, 05:43 PM   #1203
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I think you're confusing "curve" with non-90-degree angles, although I don't think anyone needs to snark about it, as it's pretty obvious what you were talking about.

In any case, I find the base more coherent than all that, but it could probably stand to be refined and simplified. 10 and 30 Hudson Yards are far worse offenders in that regard.

For me the real travesty is the crown. Definitely a "hot mess" like you say, as currently rendered. I don't mind that it's all glass (that's actually quite nice as a simple way to distinguish it from the Terra cotta body of the tower, a la Chrysler and chrome) but the lines and proportions are totally unappealing. Plenty of time to be refined, thank god.
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Old July 29th, 2014, 06:02 PM   #1204
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I'll tell my grandchildren about the 29th of july, the day that triangles got curves... :P

But that aside, i do agree that the building could use some interestingness when i comes to proportions and angles. It lacks tension i think.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 04:10 AM   #1205
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I like this tower but I agree it somehow lacks finesse but I can't put my finger on it: the crown, the body, the proportions? I get the sense the architects wanted this to echo classic skyscrapers like the Chrysler, especially with the crown, but the materials and the rather short windows give it a mid-century feel, which doesn't feel contemporary. I do like the base a lot, though, and I could see it interacting well with the street, but I agree something needs to be refined (seems like the crown irks people the most). I would also like it to be taller because it looks a bit squat at certain angles.

That said, this could have been way way worse and I would still be pretty happy with this being built as is.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 09:10 PM   #1206
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Not sure if this was ever posted, and to think Penn Plaza might join these two midtown giants.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 09:17 PM   #1207
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I don't think I've seen that picture before. Really shows how much it will dominate the skyline.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 10:33 PM   #1208
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It looks too squat in that rendering.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 10:57 PM   #1209
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That's not KPF's design. A forum member made it.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 11:06 PM   #1210
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It's an approximation of the design. We've never seen it rendered from that angle, or really been given a proper idea what it'll look like from the North/South. Size seems about right to me though.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 11:56 PM   #1211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodegavendetta View Post
I like this tower but I agree it somehow lacks finesse but I can't put my finger on it: the crown, the body, the proportions? I get the sense the architects wanted this to echo classic skyscrapers like the Chrysler, especially with the crown, but the materials and the rather short windows give it a mid-century feel, which doesn't feel contemporary. I do like the base a lot, though, and I could see it interacting well with the street, but I agree something needs to be refined (seems like the crown irks people the most). I would also like it to be taller because it looks a bit squat at certain angles.

That said, this could have been way way worse and I would still be pretty happy with this being built as is.
You took the words right out of me. I don't really like this tower, but I can't put my finger on it. Mecca Royal Clock Tower has a horrible facade that is only suitable for its culture, and Sky City is way too fat. But I don't know why I don't like this tower.

I like the base, too. It fits in really well with the rest of the streets of Manhattan.

The tower reminds me a little of One World Trade Center, but I don't like the design. Maybe it'd look better it the top was a little wider or if the base was a little thinner. It could be that the tower tapers too much, but if that was the case, I'd hate the Shard. I like the crown and the base, but they don't clash well.

On the bright side this will dominate Midtown, not only on the west side like Hudson Yards or the north side like West 57th, but on the east. The crown will add a little flair and maybe the spire will have special lighting, but they need to tweak the design.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 11:56 PM   #1212
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I made it. The base takes up the whole block and I think the height is right. I guessed on tapering and it looks like it won't taper nearly that much. The other renders are straight on while this is from the diagonal which also makes it taper more. Looks so fat though..
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Old August 11th, 2014, 01:29 AM   #1213
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Quote:
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I made it.
It looks good and it would be great if you could add 15 Penn to this render.
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Old August 11th, 2014, 03:18 AM   #1214
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Yeah, I meant the tower inherently looks too fat, not that the rendering is inaccurate (great job by the way, Funkyskunk2). I want to like this tower so badly but the proportions, among other things, just seem too off to me.
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Old August 11th, 2014, 03:39 AM   #1215
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I think the tower will be far from fat. 1,350' for a 1.6m office tower is a recipe for a slim tower.

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Old August 16th, 2014, 07:00 AM   #1216
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Businesses are starting to vacate 317 Madison! Perhaps, we'll have some news soon.

As of 15th of Aug., 2014, Fridays and the adjacent store are closed!

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Old August 18th, 2014, 04:48 PM   #1217
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18th of Aug

All of the stores in 317 Madidon have closed but for TD Bank!



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Old August 19th, 2014, 04:02 AM   #1218
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The store on the 43rd St side is closed too.




Last edited by LondoniumLex; August 19th, 2014 at 04:11 AM.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 02:06 PM   #1219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seb.nl View Post
I'll tell my grandchildren about the 29th of july, the day that triangles got curves... :P

But that aside, i do agree that the building could use some interestingness when i comes to proportions and angles. It lacks tension i think.
He's talking about aesthetic curves; the way combined shapes draw the eye through a composition.



Come on, this is supposed to be an architecture forum. This is basic stuff.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 06:28 PM   #1220
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Originally Posted by SomeKindOfBug View Post
He's talking about aesthetic curves; the way combined shapes draw the eye through a composition.
Come on, this is supposed to be an architecture forum. This is basic stuff.
Pretty condescending for having no idea what you're talking about.
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