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Old December 16th, 2013, 02:41 AM   #241
ThatOneGuy
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Strange how they say such a poorly built building stayed up for 40-50 years. Most of the ones with major construction flaws collapse very early on.
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Old December 16th, 2013, 11:14 AM   #242
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Some history about that: The current owner brought the houses in 2009. During that short time he surly did not ruin the houses. Missing repair task are a flault of the previous owner. Since the new owner brought the houses the situation is stucked.
The houses were comleated as "top-modern Plattenbau" in the early 60ies

pic from the early 70ies

http://www.mopo.de

The first owner, Family Schütze, actually let the houses ruin. They spared money for refurbishments and rented the flats overpriced. When the new owner came, the "Bayrische Hausbau", of course he had plans with it, the houses were already in a bad condition. The ferroconcrete was heavenly damaged, a new foundadtion needed as well as a total deconstruction of the tower block, also due to construction faults. Of course the new owner choosed the most cheapest way for him like everyone would did - demolition and building a new one. The owner and the lessors warned since 2009 that doomsday is about to come ...

The hate of the activists however surprisingly aimes only against the Bayrische Hausbau instead of the Family Schütze, who is responsible for the construction faults, mssing repair tasks and overpriced rents (up to 15€/cold rent for this crappy block).
It is a very cheap left wing thinking "Investor->money-> evil -> all experts are brought and lie about the condition of the houses-> block everything he wants-> only a total save of the houses like they are is an option(and victory).

That's simply nuts imo. When the owner offered a guarantee for the residents to return for same rents, an aid of 2000€ each for moving twice and help to search a replacment flat durig that time, the activists missed, that this would be huge success for their social goals and one should have gone to fix that in a contract with the residents, the owner and the district office - with some extra points (no cheating making the flats for the residents much larger so that no one could afford a return despite the guarantee).

But the activist argument was also, that up to 200 new flats would be build and the owner/investor made no secret out of the fact, that they will be expensive ones for the upper class. So the whole blockade is not only against demolition, but also against Gentrification. So no deal: Keep them like they are or get ****ed...

After the district also stepped, ordering the owner to rise the percentage of social housing to 50% and forbid the including of condos, the owner replanned, reacted pissed of himself and so no more words of the prevoius guarantees fell.

The residents surly got chrushed between two sides and their plannes, while left wingers set up a 100% block and zero tolerance politic against the owner. With an earlier agreement and a possible conract including the gurantees for the owner all residents probably could already live in replacement flats ... Of course no side wants to be guilty now. The owner prepares a press conference (currently busy with hire hotel rooms for the homeless and organisze together with the emergency service how to get the personal stuff out of the houses), while the left wingers already know who is guilty for this fiasco - of course only the current owner.. only

Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; December 16th, 2013 at 11:20 AM.
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Old December 16th, 2013, 01:27 PM   #243
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Another example to show how stupid extremist of all directions are and the people that follow those extremist are just as stupid!

They should replace those 100 flats for the current residents, fill the rest to 50% supported housing (not social housing) and get the rest of condos and such. After all, it has to be of some profit for everyone. The residents, the city quarter and the investor.
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Old December 17th, 2013, 01:57 PM   #244
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large render of the elbe philharmonic hall from inside. Unfortunately in German

Bild: http://openbuildings.com/buildings/e...ldings-media/2
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Old December 17th, 2013, 11:46 PM   #245
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Extensionbuilding of one of the biggest Hospitals in Hamburg, the:
"Universitäts Klinikum Eppendorf"
or short "UKE"

including cafes, shops and other service provider dedicated to healthcare.
Goal is not to force hospital personal, visitors and of course patients out of the
huge hospital area to satisfy their daily needs


www.spectrum-am-uke.de


http://www.dghyp.de
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Old December 18th, 2013, 06:23 PM   #246
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Are there any skyscraperprojects going on in Hamburg? The only type of buildings Hamburg don't have....

I hope to visit your wonderful city next summer again...
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Old December 18th, 2013, 09:15 PM   #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny H View Post
Are there any skyscraperprojects going on in Hamburg? The only type of buildings Hamburg don't have....
Not U/C

just planned for eatsern hafen City, but no one knows how they will look and how high they will be.

Just tons of stumps between 50-120 Meters U/C and confirmed
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Old December 19th, 2013, 05:44 PM   #248
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ji-Ja-Jot View Post
Not U/C

just planned for eatsern hafen City, but no one knows how they will look and how high they will be.

Just tons of stumps between 50-120 Meters U/C and confirmed
Ok thanks for the info...
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Old December 20th, 2013, 10:43 AM   #249
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Hamburg plannes next cruise center...


2013 was a record year in Hamburg of Cruise Ships staying here (177 times)
For 2014 the number will rise to 191 (+10%)


The number of passengers climbed 2013 to 555.000(+29%), and will climb to 600.000 in 2014.

In the beginning of 2014 the city government will discuss about this topic, a compleatation of the new center is planned for 2015. Next to the existing terminals in Altona and HafenCity the new Center will rise at Kronprinzkai in the Harbour


FULL STORY in German
http://www.abendblatt.de/hamburg/ham...ahrthafen.html

traffic jams in ze Harbour

Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; December 20th, 2013 at 10:50 AM.
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Old December 20th, 2013, 08:17 PM   #250
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Quote:
Developments around the Reeperbahn (ESSO-Houses) - Update
Green number 13 on the map in the opening comment


construction thread (German):

Riots expected for Saturday - city center declared as danger zone


In connection with the evacuation of the ESSO Houses the city government and state police expects heavy riots for Saturday in the district of Altona (in particular St.Pauli and Schanze Quarters) and the district of Hamburg-Mitte (in particular Altstadt and Neustadt Quarters)

The ESSO-Houses activists joined together with another left-wing activist gorup - the rote flora Group.

Background is that the Owner of the occupied Rote Flora Building in the Schanze Quarter ... this one


wants to tear down the building an replace it with a new theater and a kindergarden. The current owner, Mr. Kretschmann, brought the Rote Flora building in the 90ies from the city and made a contract between city and occupyers that the Rote Flora will remain a cultural center for the district runed by the activists. The district of Altona rejected the plans of Kretschmann and insists on this contract. The city already offered to rebuy the building for the same price to defuse the already heated up situation after Kretschmann and his partners announced to go to cuoght to archive a compulsory eviction by police forces.
Kretschmann and the Red Flora are both not very loved in Hamburg. Kretschmann is seen as greedy but incompetent speculant who ruins everyprojects he touches like the in Hamburg very sadful noticed downfall and insolvency of the famous Riverkasematten


The Rote Flora is mostly hated, because cultural events and festivals of them are often infiltrated by violent left wing autonoms for riots in the Schanzenviertel. Hamburgs population often mistakenly brings together the Rote Flora activists with the Autonoms and rioters. After their anual main event - the once peacefull Schanzenfestival beeing several times infiltrated by rioters, the activists burried this festival. Actions and demonstrations by them which get not infiltrated are usually loud but peacefull.

However left wing autonoms already announced to missuse this joint-venture-ESSO-Rote Flora-demonstration for violance and rioting. Rioters from all over Germany are expected for Saturday. The Protestors also claimed to have another protest organisation on their side - the African-refugee Group and their Supporters (Lampedusa-Group), but the refugees and their supporters already dissociate from the ESSO-Rote Flora activists and canceld their own planned protest march for saturday not to be mistakenly getting connected to the riots.

The police itsself, for the firt time in Hamburgs post war history, declared the city center of Hamburg to a danger zone for the night.

danger zone for Saturday night

You may ask, why I am writing all this.
The plans for the ESSO-Houses and the development plan for the Schanze Quarter including the bitchfight between Kretschmann and the Rote Flora have been the most controversial dicussed development projects in Hamburg - but outside the city boarder the disaster about the exploding costs of the Elbe Philarmonic Hall overshines everything about what is going on else in this city, so I just wanted to let you know witch projects are currently really take the cake in the regional medias.
The regional press heated up the situation about the ESSO discussion by sensasionalistion reporting with very unpleasant pictures for the people who lost their homes.

Everyones nerves (homeless, state and riot police, activists beeing infiltrated, owners/investors and in the district offices of Hamburg-Mitte and Altona) are now on the edge.

Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; December 20th, 2013 at 08:33 PM.
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Old December 21st, 2013, 01:46 PM   #251
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earlier as expcted first small riots already started on friday night, when the police station at the Reeperbahn close to the ESSO houses was attacked (in teh video from minute 1)
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Old December 21st, 2013, 02:52 PM   #252
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Such a shame to tear down a wonderful building like that. But it also highlights everything that's wrong with the anarchist scene in Germany, everything they occupy tends to end up looking like ruins.
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Old December 21st, 2013, 03:45 PM   #253
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it strongly depends on who occupies the buildings. Mostly those guys and girls claim to have some political reasons for their doings, but in reality they just want to live for free in the city. Their claim in Hamburg "the city is open for all" is nuts, because with "all" they mean just "us" while certain people (Gentrification) are wanted to stay out of their neighbourhoods.

I lived for three years next to an occupied building, which is longer occupied as the Rote Flora. Its Heystraße 1-3 in Eppendorf and looks like this and is occupied since 1970.

Those people act total different. They take care of their house, pay the refurbishment and set up events which cause the interests of all people in the hood (for example inviting all people to watch a football/soccer championship game with a barbecue in their garden), instead of just do some "cultural stuff" for people with same interests.
They respect their (upper class) neighbours with other political orientations as they are accepted and respected by them.
So everytime someone wants to have them out, they can be sure to have the support of the district office and their neighbours. Acting respectful they have a lot of more influence on other people, because they are more willing to listen to their different oppinions.
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Old December 21st, 2013, 04:32 PM   #254
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btw. The ESSO-Rote Flora marsh currently escalates (already after 20 minutes from the start). water guns in action, warning shots fired - black block builds barricades, throws begalos, stones and bottles to the riot police.



Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; December 21st, 2013 at 04:57 PM.
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Old December 21st, 2013, 07:31 PM   #255
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current situation. several people injured. lootings in the Schanze Quarter


Riots moved from Schanzenquarter to the Reeperbahn, where the street battles take place now. train-traffic collapsed. Reeperbahn closed by riot-police.
ESSO-Houses have been stormed by protestors. Police and protestors both claim the other side started the riots. currently two videos of the start of the riots have been uploaded to proof, the police would have start the riots. One is short one, that just shows how the police stopped the march but with no story before shown

then there is huge time gap to the next video suddenly showing a water gun in action


the other one is a loonger uncut footage uploaded under the title " Police attack on protesters #RoteFlora in Hamburg" what on the first sight show the difference. I guess the uploader copied from some blog and did not check it proper. It is clrealy not visbile who started the fight, but it is visible, that before the water guns moved in the police is attacked by bengalos, stones and illegal fireworks.


I hope I can clearify what happened, tommorow. For now I am a bit too pissed of for a clear judgement. Hamburg just survied its hardest stormflood with minor damage and now riotors demolish the city

Lets just hope the ESSO Houses don't collapse with the protestors in it.

Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; December 21st, 2013 at 07:38 PM.
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Old December 21st, 2013, 11:39 PM   #256
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While it gets quiet in Schanzen Quarter, St.Pauli and Neustadt the riots move to Hoheluft, Harvestehude and Eimsbüttel. So now 4 of 7 districts have been szene of the riots (Altona, HH-Mitte, Eimsbüttel and HH-Nord).

approx 82 injured police troopers are reported for now - 15 are in hospital. No news about injured protestlers and rioters, but hunderets arrested.

Water guns on their way to Eimsbüttel-district


This two planned construction projects really heat up the moods here. We had no protests like that for the Elbe-Philharmony disaster, despite toilet brushes for over 200€ each are really something to get upset about.
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Old December 22nd, 2013, 12:54 AM   #257
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what are they protesting about?
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Old December 22nd, 2013, 03:17 AM   #258
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officially against the demolition of two buildings (one occupied), high rents, gentrification and for a stay of refugees from africa.

Sorry, my average english will fail to translate this one proper: Maybe some of you speak German to read the summary of the outcome of an heated up situation about Hamburgs currenty most controversial discussed projects. If you cklick on the quote you have it with (German) text.
Quote:
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Old December 22nd, 2013, 01:28 PM   #259
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So machts du hier aber keine Werbung für Hamburg...
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Berlin Projects
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Old December 22nd, 2013, 01:45 PM   #260
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I know, but JiJa always tells the full story, when JiJa is not in the office. And further Berlin is my main client to be "good" advertised.
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