Most (and Least) Desirable Neighbourhoods in the GTA?

[Mace]

I think the most desirable neighbourhood - atleast to raise a family - is Thornhill.

My vote for least would have to be Rexdale.

5 Most desirable enclaves:

Thornhill
Forest Hill
Lawrence Park
Beaches
Unionville

5 least desirable enclaves:

Rexdale
Jane-Finch
Regent Park
St. Jamestown
Riverdale

[Mr Man]

You could throw in all of Scarborough under least desireable.

[Archivistower]

Whatever. Riverdale in the least desirable? You're obviously working on a kind of wealth criteria, that frankly, leaves me unimpressed. Unionville? I'd rather have hot pokers in my eyes.

[valantino]

"I think the most desirable neighbourhood - atleast to raise a family - is Thornhill"

Why?

[KGB]

Well, I was shaking my head when I was reading Thornhill as the most desireable neighbourhood...one, because it isn't a "neighbourhood", and two, it's about as suburban boring as you can get.

Then I read you think Riverdale is one of the LEAST desireable neighbourhoods...and then it all made sense....you are NUTS!!! LOL!!

Seriously dude...Riverdale has been one of the HOTTEST neighbourhoods in Toronto and the GTA for years...and why wouldn't it...it represents the ideal place....old, established nabe, with leafy streets, great old houses, great schools, shopping, parks, TTC, and close to downtown....and at reasonable prices.

In fact, TREB would list Riverdale as in the top 5 hottest sub-markets in the GTA for sales and appreciation...not the bottom 5.


Don't believe me?

Here's a blurb from Pulse24 News from May 2004....




What’s the hottest real estate neighbourhood in Toronto?

Forest Hill?

Nope.

Rosedale?

Not that either.

It’s actually Riverdale, an area off the Danforth, where the prices of houses are matched only by the growing demand for homes in the area.

Take the place at Danforth and Chester. It sold for a whopping $402,000. “This house was on the market for a week, and it had three offers on it and it sold for $52,000 over the asking,” reveals real estate agent Noni Fenby.

“The hardwood floors were definitely a bonus. People are looking for that in the homes. And then the kitchen. It's renovated. People look for that.”

But it’s not just the house that’s hot. It’s the area. According to a new real estate survey, Riverdale has become the most desirable area to live in the entire city.

“It's just a real warm neighbourhood,” explains Walter Rinaldo, whose own place is up for sale. “Here, I know everyone on the street.”

Add in the shops, the parks and the nearby subway, and you’ve got the ultimate example of ‘location, location, location.’

Not to mention price. The cost of buying a home in the area has soared seven percent in the last year alone, with the average two-storey dwelling going for an eye-popping $458,000!

Still, you get what you pay for. “It is pricey in Riverdale," agrees Debra Bain of Remax Hallmark. "But it's still a lot cheaper than moving … north of Eglinton, you know, that Yonge corridor. It's still cheaper to live here than it is there.”

Depending on how you define “cheap”.

* Other hot local neighbourhoods cited in the study include Leaside, High Park, and that old standby, The Beaches.









KGB



KGB

[Mr Man]

It's quiet possible the original poster could be a Jaybird or Chris in Sauga.

[doady]

Jaybird? Doesn't he post on this site regularly still and hasn't he changed? I never heard of Chris in Sauga.

Frankly, I think the neverending Jaybird-bashing is as tiresome as the neverending Toronto-bashing.

[hkskyline]

Desirable - Rosedale

[Mr Man]

Originally Posted by doady

Jaybird? Doesn't he post on this site regularly still and hasn't he changed? I never heard of Chris in Sauga.

You must be new then.

[Mace]

You could throw in all of Scarborough under least desireable.

Everytime I see this, I shake my head.

One thing that Toronto urban planners must be given credit for is their (conscious?) decision not to house all low-income housing in one concentrated "slum" - this being what precipitated much of the decline in American inner-cities. Jane-Finch is quite aways from Malvern, which is quite apart from the projects in Regent Park, which is only a stone's throw from the gargantuan mansions of Rosedale. Meanwhile Parkdale shoulders tony High Park, and stray a few blocks from Guildwood and you're suddenly in "ghetto" West Hill.

Perhaps "Scarborough" is as close is of a large "ghetto" area as one gets in Toronto, but Scarborough is incomparable Cabrini Green in Chicago or the South Bronx (talk about real urban blight and destitution). Even Scarborough cleans up once you gets past Sheppard, and there are several "nicer" districts like Guildwood, Highland Creek, and the Hillcrest-Bluffs region.

Generally speaking, Scarborough is still buoyed by its largely immigrant entrepreneurial dynamism which prevents its slide to true underclass status ala East St. Louis. Drive by Scarborough - you don't see boarded up tenement housing, vacant shopping lots and drug dealers and prostitutes perusing the streets (as some would make it out to be judging by these posts!). What you see are a multitude of ethnic shops, East and West Indian restaurants, car dealerships and busy (largely immigrant-owned) strip malls. Sure, Scarborough is home to a disproportionate share of geared-to-income rental housing, but given its share of "low-income" residents, its crime rate is comparively not even that high!

[Mr Man]

I use to live in Scarborough and I agree with you 100%. The mixes of low-income and high-income areas are its only redeeming factor. The same is true for all of Toronto which is why Toronto is considered one of the greatest world cities. I ignore the pessimist locals as you can never truly appreciate Toronto until you leave it.

However my beef is with the overall planning of the area which has made it very undesirable. Everything is wrong from a planning perspective: reserve lots, excessive greenspace requirements, lack of pedestrian friendly buildings yet an insane overall density. Mix them all together and you got a planning nightmare... aka Scarborough.

But judging from your posts, you seem less interested in the actual neighbourhoods but rather the income levels of the neighborhoods which you then equate a higher income with being more desirable. That's simply not true (for the majority of us anyway).

[Mace]

Well I am looking at it in terms of the best neighbourhood in which to raise a family. I would love to live in chique Yonge-Eglinton or the ritzy Harbourfront condos was I a single yuppie, but would I raise a family there? Probably no.

To an extent, the desirability of a neighbourhood is correlated with the socioeconomic status of its inhabitants... this is just my opinion - don't you all now bite me at once! Generally neighbourhoods with wealthier residents are cleaner, safer, greener, with better schools etc. If I was a upper-middle income professional with two children, I'd rather raise my kids in Thornhill than Malvern. Wouldn't you?

[Mr Man]

While we're at it, the employment situation is horrible and there is very little to do in Scarborough. The drop out rate is also very high. This might explain why there are so many wannabe gangstas who terrorize the streets. The vast amounts of greenspace make it easy for them to carry out their gangsta activites which includes rape, murder, drugs, etc...

"First, there must be a clear demarcation between what is public space and what is private space. Public space and private spaces cannot ooze into each other as they do typically in suburban settings or in projects.

"Second, there must be eyes upon the street, eyes belonging to those we might call the natural proprietors of the street. The buildings on a street equipped to handle strangers and to insure the safety of both residents and strangers, must be oriented to the street. They cannot turn their back or blank sides on it and leave it blind.

"And third, the sidewalk must have users on it fairly continuously, both to add to the number of effective eyes on the street and to induce the people in buildings along the street to watch the sidewalks in sufficient numbers. Nobody enjoys sitting on a stoop or looking out a window at an empty street. ... Large numbers of people entertain themselves, off and on, by watching street activity. -The Death and Life of Great American Cities.

[Mr Man]

Originally Posted by Mace

Well I am looking at it in terms of the best neighbourhood in which to raise a family. I would love to live in chique Yonge-Eglinton or the ritzy Harbourfront condos was I a single yuppie, but would I raise a family there? Probably no.

To an extent, the desirability of a neighbourhood is correlated with the socioeconomic status of its inhabitants... this is just my opinion - don't you all now bite me at once! Generally neighbourhoods with wealthier residents are cleaner, safer, greener, with better schools etc. If I was a upper-middle income professional with two children, I'd rather raise my kids in Thornhill than Malvern. Wouldn't you?

I love Google Images...

[Mace]

What exactly is wrong with what I said? You yourself have made the admission that Scarborough has its fare share of problem...

However, I think Scarborough gets a really bad rap - sure "shooting in Scarborough" has become almost ubiquitous on the daily news but it's really not as bad as people make it out to be. Also, much of the violence in Scarborough concentrated within one or two neighbourhoods and, though I hate to say it, within one community in particular. But whenever there's some sort of shooting all of Scarborough is, well, scarred!

The problems of Scarborough arise from a high concentration of rental buildings + a rather high underclass Caribbean population + a sudden, rapid influx of refugees. However as a one-time resident of Scarborough I can vouch that most of Scarborough is actually not too bad - and there are very desirable enclaves (Guildwood, Highland Creek, the Scarborough Bluffs...) And virtually any part of Scarborough north of Sheppard is thriving, with condos and shopping malls sprouting everywhere (and no doubt abetted by the massive infusion of HK capital). It's also *very* safe (that is, unless you're driving! =P).

In fact I'll go so far as to credit the Hong Kong Chinese community for the "rejuvenation" of Scarborough. I think it was their huge investments into that region that effectively prevented Scarborough's steady slide into an outright slum.

[scarbmike]

How many of you people actually live currently in Scarborough!!!.....there seems to be a lot of talk about "gangsta" activity and other nonsense...

How about you guys actually ask teens who live in Scarborough?? ever thought about that?? LOL!!!

[Mr Man]

My old bud still in Cardinal Newman HS just called me 5 minutes ago. So ha!

I'm still a teen, and lived in Scarborough for a good few years and only left in 2003. I'm fully entitled to call the shots as I see fit. Forget about the hometown pride and just admit it's shitty. Anyone to deny the gangsta problem does NOT live in Scarborough.

At night little motherfuckers 8 and 9 years old would be tossing eggs or shooting bb guns at cars passing by.

Some dude got killed in the local elementary school because he and a bunch of his so-called frends were drinking and playing chicken on the GO tracks.

Go into any one of scarborough's ravines and you'll likly see illegal activity taking place at any time a day... although I'd guilty to this one.

My old High School, Cardinal Newman had a designated area to smoke weed outdoors in the summer, and even indoors in the winter. The valedictorian even joked about this pratice when giving his speech, to the embarrasement of the administration. It was just an area teachers and principals would turn a blind eye too so whatever gambling, drug deals, etc... could take place without fear of suspension.

My scarborough high school even had a prositution ring when the 9th graders would give head for $20 and the OAC's would collect some of the money and set up appointments.

The school was near the beautiful greenery of the bluffs, however walking down there during school was danerous as you would see many condoms on the ground or might actually catch a couple in the act (again guilty )

And don't even get me started about Town Center

[elliot]

As Mr. Man clearly hinted ("clearly hinted"???), the plethora of negative threads appearing authored by the Mace and Crusty and others should just be ignored.

Trolls. No life.

[salvius]

Scarborough is hardly the den of crime or evil. I hear this constantly with Jane and Finch too. Okay, these are crappy looking parts of town, but it's not like I'm afriad walking the streets at night. I can't recall how many times I walked J & F at 3-4AM when my girlfriend lived there. No bullets, no robberies, or beatings. Imagine that!

[VAN-TO]

Originally Posted by Mace

In fact I'll go so far as to credit the Hong Kong Chinese community for the "rejuvenation" of Scarborough. I think it was their huge investments into that region that effectively prevented Scarborough's steady slide into an outright slum.

Hong Kong capital has shifted north towards Richmond Hill & Markham, & Chinese capital these days in Scarborough is mostly from Mainland Chinese.

Scarborough suffers from a lack of Police Services... Last time I remembered, Scarborough's 42 divison was the largest in the Toronto area. Areas that need the services, ie. Malvern, often find it harder to get it be/c police resources are stretched so thin from Victoria Park to Rouge park.

Parts of Scarborough, like Agincourt, certainly don't deserve the bad rap.