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Old March 10th, 2015, 11:41 PM   #601
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I was under the impression the block is extending up to the Shoe Building. Sorry then.
I think such a facade should be preserved even (or especially) in NYC if possible.

701 Seventh Ave is this one? How did it look like without billboards?


Source: http://www.emporis.com/buildings/203...rk-city-ny-usa
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Old March 11th, 2015, 12:51 AM   #602
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Also, source and previous discussion.
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Old March 11th, 2015, 06:52 AM   #603
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I know this thread is mostly about Manhattan, but the other four boroughs have a great deal to offer that is worth preserving. In Brooklyn many of the beautiful residential areas have prospered since the 1980s economic boom - especially the areas of Park Slope and Brooklyn Heights that are easily accessible to commuting to Manhattan over the bridge. Rows of town houses have been restored and are in excellent condition.

Unfortunately the same cannot be said about the Woodlawn section of the north Bronx, which used to be one of the most attractive, safe and handsome residential sections in NYC. The trains to Manhattan run through there. Several of my relatives lived there in the 1930s and 40s. It was populated mostly by Irish, Germans, Italians and WASPs. That world ended after WWII, when white flight and the postwar boom resulted in an exodus to the suburbs.

I visited the buildings where they once lived - elegant, solid four-story brownstone townhouses with paneled glass double-doors, carved stone courtyards, marble foyers. They still exist, but they are in ruins: crumbled, peeling, seedy. Its very sad. But they do exist and it doesn't pay to destroy them. Someday perhaps they will be restored, like Brooklyn.
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Old March 11th, 2015, 04:22 PM   #604
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Isn't the Bronx experiencing some kind of boom as well? Frankly I haven't really been there for a decade (and much of it appeared to be somewhat crumbling). But I've read it's experienced a lot of gentrification recently, so there should be chances more formerly grand buildings get revitalized.

And what about Queens btw?
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Old March 30th, 2015, 01:16 PM   #605
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New York should keep his Gothic,Art Deco and Neoclassical Style.
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Old March 30th, 2015, 11:29 PM   #606
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Don't forget Victorian
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Old March 30th, 2015, 11:31 PM   #607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
I was under the impression the block is extending up to the Shoe Building. Sorry then.
I think such a facade should be preserved even (or especially) in NYC if possible.

701 Seventh Ave is this one? How did it look like without billboards?


Source: http://www.emporis.com/buildings/203...rk-city-ny-usa
Poor Building, this is f***** ugly ...
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Old March 31st, 2015, 01:26 AM   #608
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
I was under the impression the block is extending up to the Shoe Building. Sorry then.
I think such a facade should be preserved even (or especially) in NYC if possible.

701 Seventh Ave is this one? How did it look like without billboards?


Source: http://www.emporis.com/buildings/203...rk-city-ny-usa
That is the old Broadway Lowe's Mayfair, a mid-town film theatre. The billboards are ugly, but this theatre has had a wrap-around billboard for decades. That is the Broadway district where everything is used for marketing and advertising.

Here is a site that discusses some of the history:

http://vanishingnewyork.blogspot.com...-building.html
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Old March 31st, 2015, 05:37 AM   #609
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Actually quite a few people, among them the famous Jane Jacobs, were concerned that modernization would wreck our cities. And they were right. The utopian character of town planning at the time was part of a larger sentiment in society that the old world needed to die. This whole idea which first raised its ugly head during world war I was at first extremely destructive and fascist at heart. The very reason the war was welcomed can be explained by the fact that it was believed a "modern conflict" would eradicate the old world with its overcrowded cities, corrupt social structure and immorality. What many wanted was a clean table. This ideology survived the war and lived on in fascist and communist regimes. Even in democratic countries the state took an authoritative role, and radical and harsh structural change was widely supported, especially in certain circles.

As late as during the destructive bombardment of cities in WWII politicians, architects and city planners applauded the destruction of cities world wide as this destruction would pave the way for a better tomorrow. After the war the ideology of modernization was humanized and democratized, but it remained utopian in nature. One should keep in mind that what wrecked our cities after the war was not some momentarily whim of craze, but the culmination of an already long established idea. We should also remember that although this ideology originated in a culture in crisis and developed into something of a collective psychosis the humanized version of this movement brought about a lot of positive change. A sincere believe in social justice and equality meant that during the post-war era living standards rose massively and poverty declined sharply.
Your explanations prove the theory that the particular architectural styles and urban planning usually suited well to the needs and preferences of the society in this time.

The problem is that they maybe don´t fit with the needs of the next generation. So you could either tear down our cities every fifty years and build something new or freeze the cities, force the planners and architects into a tight corset of continuing with yesterday´s style if you want to preserve the decent old buildings and the cityscape how it was once.

The happy medium in between results in the patchwork cities we´re used to, with good and bad examples of every era. It requires tear down buildings which have been breathing history for a time to make place for something new and give it the same chance to become historic. Sometimes the old-new exchange is an advance for the city, sometomes it´s a loss.
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Old March 31st, 2015, 07:20 AM   #610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
Isn't the Bronx experiencing some kind of boom as well? Frankly I haven't really been there for a decade (and much of it appeared to be somewhat crumbling). But I've read it's experienced a lot of gentrification recently, so there should be chances more formerly grand buildings get revitalized.

And what about Queens btw?
Well, there are parts of the Bronx that have prospered along with the city as a whole - but the high-crime areas are very dangerous. The situation has improved since the peak in the early 90s and NYC in general is much safer. But the Bronx is divided into neighborhoods that have a unique character even today. Sometimes only a few blocks separate a safe, middle class neighborhood from a high-crime area.

The Williamsbridge section covers most of the north Bronx. There are many neighborhoods within Williamsbridg" Wakefield, Norwood and Bronxwood are very dangerous - which is very sad because they used to be beautiful (many years ago) and contain many townhouses and detached 19th century houses. But the crime rate makes it impossible to restore and develop them. It would not be worth it.

However, there are several attractive and safe neighborhoods: Riverdale, which is and always has been a very nice place to live. Fordham has an excellent university. Woodlawn Heights is pleasant.

As a born-and-bred New Yorker I would love to see those old apartments and houses restored. They have high ceilings, staircases with carved wood, murals in the foyers. My family has many photos of those wonderful residences from 70-80 years ago. But I am not optimistic.

The reason for the beauty of those buildings is associated with the immigrant patterns into NYC during the years from 1840-1940.

The new immigrant groups used to arrive from Europe and move into the cheaper, more crowded housing in lower Manhattan and the south Bronx. As they established themselves and moved into the lower middle class - and then sometimes into the middle class they would move to larger, more attractive housing - and that always meant moving north or east (unless they left NYC).

Sometimes they moved to central and northern Manhattan. That is what the residents of the old Little Germany on the Lower East Side.did after about 1910 (also the General Slocum disaster helped accelerate the process). For the Irish and the Italians and some Germans and Swedes and later the Jews, that meant moving from the South Bronx to Williamsbridge. That was the goal.

So it is very sad that these beautiful homes have fallen into decay. They used to symbolize success and prosperity and security.
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Last edited by TimothyR; March 31st, 2015 at 07:37 AM.
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Old March 31st, 2015, 07:28 AM   #611
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Regarding Queens: It is an interesting story. It is much larger and more spacious than the Bronx. It is also directly connected to Brooklyn through many commercial and family connections.

In recent years Brooklyn has been enjoying a boom, and now Queens is starting to become gentrified as well. Of course Brooklyn has an ideal location - very close to Manhattan, right over the Bridge. Queens is slightly less convenient and does not have the trendy, upper middle class reputation of western Brooklyn. But it is still very close and has many pleasant residential neighborhoods that look like suburbs.

The part of Queens I know the best is Astoria, a very attractive residential and commercial area. My great Uncle lived there when I was a boy and we visited there many times.
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Old April 5th, 2015, 06:21 AM   #612
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Theaters have played a significant role in the life of New York City since the middle of the nineteenth century.

During the period from 1880-1930 several large-scale theaters were built in mid-town to showcase the musical revues and spectacles that became popular during that period of economic expansion and optimism. Unfortunately many of them have since been torn down and then replaced by smaller theaters or by commercial office buildings.

I am fascinated by these theaters. They were not necessarily examples of beautiful architecture on the outside. But inside they were opulent and splendid.

The largest and one of the most famous was the Hippodrome. I was located on the Avenue of the Americas between 43rd and 44th streets.

The scale of the theater was entirely different than the usual theaters built for Broadway plays and even for operas and concerts. It was used for stage musicals but also for circuses and a variety of spectacles.

The quotes are from:http://nyc-architecture.com/GON/GON027.htm

Quote:
With J. H. Morgan as architect, the Hippodrome first opened in 1905 with a seating capacity of 5,200, and is still considered as one of the true wonders of theatre architecture. Its stage was 12 times larger than any Broadway "legit" house and capable of holding as many as 1,000 performers at a time, or a full-sized circus with elephants and horses. It also had an 8,000-gallon clear glass water tank that could be raised from below the stage by hydraulic pistons for swimming-and-diving shows.
Here is the exterior of the Hippodrome. The view is somewhat obstructed by the "El" - the elevated railway that used to cover parts of Manhattan and the Bronx and which now no longer exist in most places. For those who are interested in NYC's history - this was the IRT 6th Avenue line.

The Hippodrome Theater



https://static-ssl.businessinsider.c...ty-of-5200.jpg

Here is a 1907 postcard showing the enormous interior of the orchestra section.


http://www.nycago.org/Organs/NYC/img...eInt1907PC.jpg

Quote:
For a time the Hippodrome was the largest and most successful theater in New York. The Hippodrome featured lavish spectacles complete with circus animals, diving horses, opulent sets, and 500-member choruses. Until the end of World War I, the Hippodrome housed all sorts of spectacles then switched to musical extravaganzas produced by Charles Dillingham, including "Better Times," which ran for more than 400 performances.
Eventually the cost was too great and the theater had to close. It was torn down and replaced by a very ordinary, boring office building.

The name o the building is also the Hippodrome because the old theater was considered a gem of old New York. It is quite sad.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...xth_Avenue.jpg
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“The meaning of earthly existence lies not, as we have grown used to thinking, in prospering but in the development of the soul.”
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Old April 5th, 2015, 06:35 AM   #613
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The story of the Lowe's Paradise Theater has a slightly happier ending. It is located on the Grand Concourse in the north Bronx.

These movie palaces, as they were called, were a true part of New York's architectural heritage. The interior design was intended to be an aesthetic experience. Unfortunately most of them have been turned into those horrible multiplexes.

It seemed that the same thing would happen to the Paradise - but instead it has been registered as a landmark to be preserved. It no longer functions as a theater but it is used for church services. It has been restored and it is in excellent condition.

Here are some photos from their website
http://paradisetheater.net/:


http://paradisetheater.net/foyer.jpeg


http://paradisetheater.net/decor.jpeg


http://paradisetheater.net/theaterback.jpeg

I knew of this theater when I was growing up because it was my grandparent's favorite theater. It was a true New York "Film Palace". There were stage shows and 'specialty acts' as well as the feature films.
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“The meaning of earthly existence lies not, as we have grown used to thinking, in prospering but in the development of the soul.”
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Old April 5th, 2015, 06:43 AM   #614
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The Lowe's Paradise is an example of the Atmospheric style, popular in the 1920s. The intention was to create an exciting and stylized setting with a sweeping, circular design in the auditorium.

Quote:
The Loew’s Paradise Theatre was one of the last ‘Atmospheric’ style theatres built towards the end of the movie palace building boom. John Eberson, the architect who designed this $4,000,000 deluxe picture palace, was famed for his ‘Atmospheric’ theatres and the Bronx Paradise, is perhaps the greatest example of his work to survive since the demolition of the Paradise Theatre in Chicago (1928-1956).
http://photos.cinematreasures.org/pr...jpg?1417833224



http://photos.cinematreasures.org/pr...PNG?1362052586


http://www.placematters.net/sites/de...s/pm_676_2.jpg
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Old April 5th, 2015, 06:54 AM   #615
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Unfortunately there was no happy ending for the wonderful Hotel Astor, a gem of a building located in Times Square. It was built in 1904 and was torn down in 1967.

The 60s was such a terrible time for New York - in so many ways.


The Hotel Astor, Times Square, New York.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._York_1909.jpg

This is the splendid Grand Ballroom:


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...orBallroom.jpg
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Old April 5th, 2015, 06:58 AM   #616
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The Hotel Astor had a rooftop garden that had a lounge and a dining room. It is a glimpse of a gracious world that no longer exists:


http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs...b0/MNY3970.jpg


http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs...4c/MNY9417.jpg



http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs...4c/MNY9417.jpg



The Hotel Astor was replaced by One Astor Place, completed in 1972

No elegance No class. No dignity. :



http://wirednewyork.com/images/skysc...om_milford.jpg
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Old April 5th, 2015, 07:34 AM   #617
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Many of the grandest and most unique lost buildings in New York were residences along avenues and boulevards that are now the home of commercial buildings and apartment buildings.

The Gilded Age was a time when the very wealthy families of New York built mansions in many different places, but usually the primary dwelling was in Manhattan.

The Vanderbilt mansion was perhaps the most spectacular. It was located on 5th Avenue between 57th and 58th. It had 130 rooms.

It was completed in 1883 and was very much a product of its time: lavish, imposing and ornate.

http://blog.bergdorfgoodman.com/bg-m...use-in-america



https://d9hblenkye35w.cloudfront.net...2ab757d_b1.jpg


It was the largest single-family home in the history of the city. Eventually it was sold and - of course - torn down. I understand why. There is no room for a single family home in mid-town Manhattan. But I would love to have seen that mansion.

That space is now occupied by the Bergdorf Goodman flagship Manhattan store. It is not beautiful - but at least it is moderately attractive:


http://www.patrasevents.gr/imgsrv/f/full/667644.jpg
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Old April 5th, 2015, 07:41 AM   #618
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
I was under the impression the block is extending up to the Shoe Building. Sorry then.
I think such a facade should be preserved even (or especially) in NYC if possible.

701 Seventh Ave is this one? How did it look like without billboards?


Source: http://www.emporis.com/buildings/203...rk-city-ny-usa
ok, i see some first world country-non-sense in this building.... if this were in Mexico people might call it "visual pollution", but this is in USA, so it doesn't matter, is a tourist attraction....
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Old April 5th, 2015, 07:51 AM   #619
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ok, i see some first world country-non-sense in this building.... if this were in Mexico people might call it "visual pollution", but this is in USA, so it doesn't matter, is a tourist attraction....
It is not a tourist attraction. It is used for marketing. It has been used for marketing for decades.

No one thinks it's beautiful. I don't like it at all. But it is in the middle of the theater district - all of those plays are in theaters in the proximity of that building. It is pragmatic - that's all.
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“The meaning of earthly existence lies not, as we have grown used to thinking, in prospering but in the development of the soul.”
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

"We are more closely connected to the invisible than to the visible"

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Old April 8th, 2015, 01:37 AM   #620
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimothyR View Post
It is not a tourist attraction. It is used for marketing. It has been used for marketing for decades.

No one thinks it's beautiful. I don't like it at all. But it is in the middle of the theater district - all of those plays are in theaters in the proximity of that building. It is pragmatic - that's all.
You're right, the Times Sq. theater district was always an area where advertising on buildings was part of the scenery. The irony of this however is that today there is more advertising than ever before but Times Sq. and the adjoining area is a pale shadow of it's former self as all the great Movie Palaces (in addition to the live theaters) that made it such a world wide attraction have now gone (only RCMH remains on 6th Ave.)
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