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Old November 15th, 2012, 04:31 PM   #81
snowdog
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Under used right lanes:




Typical behavior on the A16, also between Gouda-Utrecht on the A12...

Pretty much all the cars in this picture can easily bugger off 1 lane to the right...
On the right side, what is that black MPV and that saxo doing there ?
On the left side, what is that clio doing there ?
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Old November 15th, 2012, 04:37 PM   #82
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And what are you doing here?
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Old November 15th, 2012, 05:03 PM   #83
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Agree about the right side. On the left side, there could be a truck just south of the picture.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 07:25 PM   #84
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I think on such wide motorways it's better to stay in your lane, so there isn't too much weaving and traffic flows smoothly (but for god's sake, keep the leftmost lane free).
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Old November 15th, 2012, 07:32 PM   #85
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Old November 15th, 2012, 07:46 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
I think on such wide motorways it's better to stay in your lane, so there isn't too much weaving and traffic flows smoothly (but for god's sake, keep the leftmost lane free).
So that I, faster than everyone, either pass them on the righmost lane or have to zigzag...
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:00 PM   #87
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You can't expect everyone to be on the rightmost lane on a 2×4-lane freeway. These people are faster than trucks, so they would have to zigzag all the time. If it's so hard to overtake all the time, perhaps it's better to just go with the flow?
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:03 PM   #88
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So that I, faster than everyone, either pass them on the righmost lane or have to zigzag...
No, you pass them in the left lane, which Verso (and yours truly, the thread-starter, several times) have left free for you.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:04 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
You can't expect everyone to be on the rightmost lane on a 2×4-lane freeway. These people are faster than trucks, so they would have to zigzag all the time. If it's so hard to overtake all the time, perhaps it's better to just go with the flow?
Which is exactly what I've been trying to say for, like, a week.

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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:06 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog View Post
Under used right lanes:

https://kuqcqw.dm1.livefilestore.com...rks.jpg?psid=1

Typical behavior on the A16, also between Gouda-Utrecht on the A12...

Pretty much all the cars in this picture can easily bugger off 1 lane to the right...
On the right side, what is that black MPV and that saxo doing there ?
On the left side, what is that clio doing there ?
To be fair in that picture the density of lorries on both sides probably warrants anything faster to stay in lane 2. On the LHS of the picture we don't know if there isn't a lorry just out of shot.

The positions of the black and yellow cars on the right (the blakc MPV and the saxo you are talking about?) are a bit perplexing though.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:07 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
You can't expect everyone to be on the rightmost lane on a 2×4-lane freeway.
Yes, I can.

Quote:
These people are faster than trucks, so they would have to zigzag all the time.
They only have to go back one lane. If that's too difficult for them it's better they stay at home.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
No, you pass them in the left lane, which Verso (and yours truly, the thread-starter, several times) have left free for you.
Forcing me to go from lane one to four and back again because you're too lazy to go from lane three to two? No way, man.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:07 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
Which is exactly what I've been trying to say for, like, a week.

Well of course you stay in lane 2 when slower moving lane 1 is saturated or near saturation. The problem being talked about here is hogging lane 2 when there are clear stretches in lane 1.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:14 PM   #93
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But is that a problem? I really don't see the need for everyone to stick resolutely to the right (or left, depending where you are) lane of a road that has three or more. As long as people in the middle lane(s) are moving faster than those in the lane(s) to the slow side of the road from them, and as long as the passing lane is kept free for that purpose. Yes, if it's the law where you are, do it that way, but I really don't see that it's intrinisically better.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:21 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
Yes, I can.


They only have to go back one lane. If that's too difficult for them it's better they stay at home.




Forcing me to go from lane one to four and back again because you're too lazy to go from lane three to two? No way, man.
Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
Yes, I can.


They only have to go back one lane. If that's too difficult for them it's better they stay at home.




Forcing me to go from lane one to four and back again because you're too lazy to go from lane three to two? No way, man.
If everyone in a given country distributes themselves according to speed across the three non-passing lanes of a four-lane freeway, then those who are adhering to that custom are not "forcing you into the situation" of having to cross three lanes to pass; you are forcing yourself into that situation by insisting on following the rules you prefer rather than the rules the people around you are following. And, arguably, creating danger by doing so.

And calling those who are respecting the custom of the people around them rather than yours "lazy" is arrogant and offensive.
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Last edited by Penn's Woods; November 15th, 2012 at 08:40 PM. Reason: Took a deep breath....
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:38 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
AND DON'T CALL THOSE WHO ARE RESPECTING THE RULES OF THE COUNTRY THEY'RE IN "LAZY." (or "Unthinking.")
Uh, I hit a nerve.

Quote:
*Italian rules? Is there such a thing?
At least we don't go out and bomb other countries because we don't like their rules.

However, man, chill out. You started the topic asking why a certain behavior is wrong, I explain that to you and you don't want to understand and get angry. To paraphrase one of your presidents, "if you don't like the heat stay out of the kitchen".


EDIT: I decided I'll never write again on a topic that doesn't involve which roads are being built and when they'll open. It's just not worth it.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:43 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
If everyone in a given country distributes themselves according to speed across the three non-passing lanes of a four-lane freeway, then those who are adhering to that custom are not "forcing you into the situation" of having to cross three lanes to pass; you are forcing yourself into that situation by insisting on following the rules you prefer rather than the rules the people around you are following. And, arguably, creating danger by doing so.

And calling those who are respecting the custom of the people around them rather than yours "lazy" is arrogant and offensive.
Do you know three unwritten rules of lane discipline in EU?
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:43 PM   #97
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I apologize for the (pre-editing) tone of my previous post.

But no one has in fact explained why using only one lane of a three-or-more-lane road is better. Which is what I've been trying to get at since the beginning of this.

Please see post-editing previous post.

[EDIT: arrows are for Spinoza]
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:44 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by admirer of sir ALEX View Post
Do you know three unwritten rules of lane discipline in EU?
I don't live in the EU.
(Thank God.)
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:51 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
However, man, chill out. You started the topic asking why a certain behavior is wrong, I explain that to you and you don't want to understand and get angry. To paraphrase one of your presidents, "if you don't like the heat stay out of the kitchen".


EDIT: I decided I'll never write again on a topic that doesn't involve which roads are being built and when they'll open. It's just not worth it.
Get a grip. You started throwing around words like lazy and saying people should stay home. (Or was that what I was supposed to understand as "explanation"?)

"Stay out of the kitchen," indeed.
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Old November 15th, 2012, 08:53 PM   #100
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Lmao okay this thread is taking a turn for the worse.

Some anecdotal evidence:

Driving on relatively quiet 4 or 6 lane motorways in the NL: almost ideal, people are super disciplined (at least here in the North ). On a busier motorway though, not so much, which has mostly to do with the fact that there's common irritation about traffic jamming up.

In Germany it can get pretty paranoid when your own car can do no more than 150km/h and you're driving on a quiet zweistreifigen Autobahn without a maximum speed limit. There's always some ******* with LED headlights tailgating you when you have to overtake a small train of trucks. Busier traffic yields about the same results as in the Netherlands.

As for the US, specifically GA, I was kinda stunned when driving on I-16 between Macon and Savannah the first time because there were a shitload of people I had to overtake on the right but it wasn't exactly dangerous and rural traffic in the US is pretty laid back. Downtown Atlanta is a bit different but not too chaotic since speed limits are low. The nastier parts are IMO suburban eight or ten lane highways where trucks pass you on the right at full speed in heavy traffic, that's just not something I'm used to here in quaint old Europe.

If you really want to see some strange shit going down: drive around in the UAE. As soon as I'm back home I've got to adjust to road rules for a couple of days since you get primed to cross four lanes at ones in a massive hail mary since a mom driving a Landcruiser while on the phone, a taxidriver jamming the brakes because of a non-operational speedcam coming up, a pickup full of gasbottles and a pedestrian speed Ashok Leyland bus are potentially blocking you from entering a non-signposted hairpin exit from a twelve lane freeway.
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