Woman dies after abortion request 'refused'

[Craig91]

Originally Posted by thebig C

But you are mistaken if you believe that all young people are pro-choice.

I'm 21 and live in Dublin. Speaking from personal experience, most people of a similar age, while not at all religious, are pro-life. Lack of education on the issue makes them all think that abortion really is murdering babies and should only be done to save the mother

[belfastuniguy]

Can I just add that being pro-life does not mean you can't be pro-choice.

[odlum833]

Indian authorities have summoned the ambassador out there.

I know it's moving away from the core point of this thread but there is so much coverage of this case in India I don't think it's appreciated here.

Here is another debate

[belfastuniguy]

They have every right to be furious. This woman travelled to Ireland, educated herself and worked to achieve a better life. She contributed to Irish society and was looking forward to having her child and raising it in Ireland.

She was then failed by incompetent doctors and the Irish state, her life was deemed of less value than that of a dying foetus. A decision based upon scandalously unclear abortion guidelines and the Irish Parliament is responsible for that lack of clarity.

[odlum833]

It's over the top especially given nobody actually knows what happened yet.

[oon27]

I am very glad that this is getting so much attention worldwide as it will hopefully embarrass our government into action.

[odlum833]

It's been 20 years. Why rush now?

Taoiseach: Government will not be rushed into abortion legislation


16/11/2012 - 15:46:27


Taoiseach Enda Kenny said today that he will not be rushed into legislating on abortion following the death of Savita Halappanavar.

Speaking to Galway Bay FM today, Taoiseach Kenny said that the issue has divided Irish society for decades and should be dealt with rationally.

"I'm not going to be rushed into a situation by force of numbers on any side," he said.

"This is something that has to be treated rationally and openly and truthfully, and that's what will happen.

"So we'll have the recommendations and the report brought to Government by the Minister for Health, the report will then be published."

Earlier this afternoon, a meeting between the Indian Ambassador to Ireland and Tánaiste Eamon Gilmore took place at the Department of Foreign Affairs regarding the death of Ms Halappanavar.

Speaking on his way into Iveagh House, Ambassador Debashish Chakravarti said that the message to Minister Gilmore is one of concern of the Indian people.

"I'm under instructions from my government to approach the Irish authorities and to convey our concern at this unfortunate, huge human tragedy, and to hear what the Irish side has to say." he said.

Ambassador Debashish Chakravarti said that there was "a great deal of angst and sadness, and also a lot of public interest in the matter and among civil society groups."

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/t...on-574495.html

This is because previous governments just left this alone.

[Viking74]

Originally Posted by thebig C

Viking, I agree with your sentiments. But you are mistaken if you believe that all young people are pro-choice.

I agree Big C , l can think of at least one crazy organisation . I do however believe that it is safe to say that many older people in general, which would include many TDs, are part of an old ultra conservative Ireland which is thankfully fast dying out. That's why it's important for as many young people to get involved in Public life as possible to change things.

[JD47]

This is such a sad story. The poor girl and her family. I am livid at the way this country is run. If it was up to me, people should be able to choose if they want to have an abortion or not. Its their life and their body. If a women should not be allowed have an abortion at the risk of her life, then a fireman should not be allowed to leave a burning building if there is still someone inside.

This is getting a lot of attention in India and so it should. Its scary to think that in this day and age, in this country, we could let something like this happen.

This has given us a bad name. Not only do we look bad but it has also probably made people think twice about moving here to have a baby. The worst thing about this tragic story is that she was looking forward to having a baby here and starting a family and building a future here.

[oon27]

I would love if we had similar rules to those in Sweden.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Sweden

[thebig C]

Originally Posted by JD47

This is such a sad story. The poor girl and her family. I am livid at the way this country is run. If it was up to me, people should be able to choose if they want to have an abortion or not. Its their life and their body. If a women should not be allowed have an abortion at the risk of her life, then a fireman should not be allowed to leave a burning building if there is still someone inside.

This is getting a lot of attention in India and so it should. Its scary to think that in this day and age, in this country, we could let something like this happen.

This has given us a bad name. Not only do we look bad but it has also probably made people think twice about moving here to have a baby. The worst thing about this tragic story is that she was looking forward to having a baby here and starting a family and building a future here.

Excellent post Buddy. It perfectly sums up my feelings on this terrible incident.

[thebig C]

Originally Posted by Viking74

I agree Big C , l can think of at least one crazy organisation . I do however believe that it is safe to say that many older people in general, which would include many TDs, are part of an old ultra conservative Ireland which is thankfully fast dying out. That's why it's important for as many young people to get involved in Public life as possible to change things.

I don't even think its all that cut and dry. Despite the media trying to present Labour/SF as being left wing and pro-choice and FF/FG as being right wing pro-life, the reality is much more complex. I would say all of the parties are split along old/young, urban/rural and even social classes on this issue.

For example, we discussed this in the house last night and myself and my sister are pro-abortion and my parents are anti-abortion. And, I hasten to add that my parents are not even religious and haven't gone to Mass in at least 10 years. Maybe they are just a product of their times?!

[thebig C]

Originally Posted by oon27

I would love if we had similar rules to those in Sweden.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Sweden

Thanks for posting. Those laws seem very reasonable. A while ago I spoke to tweo French friends about this issue. France seems to have a decent system also. Ironically, both of the French people viewed the UK regulations as too liberal.

[Catmalojin]

Originally Posted by Craig91

I'm 21 and live in Dublin. Speaking from personal experience, most people of a similar age, while not at all religious, are pro-life. Lack of education on the issue makes them all think that abortion really is murdering babies and should only be done to save the mother

I'm 21 and live in Dublin too, but most of my friends are pro-choice. In fact, the most avid pro-lifers I know are girls, which I find strange. Especially as they're also usually devout atheists! It definitely isn't a 'religious' issue among younger generations, but tends to be among older ones.

[odlum833]

Protests today Ireland/India. Not that many at the protest in Dublin. A few thousand.

[oon27]

I was at the one in Dublin today. It was nice to see so many people.

There is another one planned for next week that is supposed to be as global as possible with protests planned outside Irish embassies.
http://www.facebook.com/events/175080575964011/

[odlum833]

The media in India is slowly but finally waking up to their hypocrisy actually allowing people to say how attrocious India's record is whereas no one was allowed say that before.

[belfastuniguy]

My concern isn't what the media in India is or isn't saying. I'm more concerned about what the Irish government are doing.

Focusing on what Indian media are saying is merely a distraction from the central issue

[odlum833]

Don't think Savita Halappanavar's husband is doing himself any favors here.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1120/sav...r-inquiry.html

[belfastuniguy]

Not really, he has a very good point.

He said Mr Halappanavar wants an independent inquiry, with oral hearings held in public, a full discovery of records and witnesses called in under oath and cross examined in public.

Mr O'Donnell said: "Any inquiry conducted by the HSE does not meet with his approval. He has no faith in the HSE.

“It's important to remember that he lost his wife while under the care of the HSE", he added.

I wouldn't want them taking the case either. I'd rather have a wholly independent inquiry. I'm fully supportive of his position, as many would be.