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Old December 29th, 2014, 11:18 PM   #221
hateman
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Lobby rendering:

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Old January 2nd, 2015, 08:38 AM   #222
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But it has three strikes against it. 1. The destruction of an urban landmark, 2. The defacement of one of the most elegant urban vistas in the world, and 3. Anti-pedestrianism. Basically everything wrong with the period where International Modernism was in vogue can be symbolized by the GM Building.
All three of these claims are wrong. The previous building wasn't a landmark, there was no change to the urban vista (in fact the GM building opened up urban vistas by being set back) and the GM building is hardly anti-pedestrian.

The GM Building has a massive amount of pedestrian-oriented multilevel retail space, as well as a pedestrian plaza. There is no "car showroom" at the GM building, so don't get your anti-transit claim (not even sure why a car showroom, which in this location would simply be a pedestrian oriented retail space, would be anti-transit, but that's another story).

The predecessor building had almost no retail space nor any pedestrian amenities. It was basically just a nice old building. The GM Building improves the public realm and the pedestrian experience.
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Old January 2nd, 2015, 10:26 PM   #223
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All three of these claims are wrong. The previous building wasn't a landmark, there was no change to the urban vista (in fact the GM building opened up urban vistas by being set back) and the GM building is hardly anti-pedestrian.
You think those claims are wrong because you have limited understanding and historical knowledge. Let me correct you.

1. It's a landmark (iconic, significant, noteworthy), but it wasn't "landmarked." It was slated for demolition in 1964, the year before the Landmarks Preservation Commission was formed--precisely because of such demolitions.

2. The Savoy-Plaza was 250' tall with several setbacks and a sloped roof, the GM building is 700,' and a slab, facing Central Park at 3/4 perspective. That "opens up vistas?" Clearly the urban vista has changed:



3. I never claimed that there IS an automobile showroom in the building. There WAS an automobile showroom in the GM Building, for many years. And avoiding the point of selling cars in a mass transit city, putting an automobile dealership in prime NYC retail and pedestrian space is clearly anti-pedestrian. How many more people go into shops and restaurants, which the ground floor retail of the Savoy-Plaza had, compared to an auto dealership and sunken plaza:



So to reiterate my point, the GM Building showed all the failures of mid-century urban planning: demolishing a noted and important piece of work by a noted firm, disfiguring an urban vista with an out-of-scale slab, and anti-pedestrianism.

EDIT: Here, read this article from the paper of record:
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/07/18/re...-drummers.html
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Last edited by hateman; March 23rd, 2015 at 05:04 AM.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 01:34 AM   #224
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Lobby rendering:



The lobby looks like a mausoleum.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 03:09 AM   #225
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more like a 19th century mansion... like what the residents would probably be able to afford anyway.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 03:17 AM   #226
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The lobby looks like a mausoleum.
I'm with you, it's pretty dreary. Hopefully RAMS gives the interior some tweaks to humanize things and bring some warmth. But as the adage goes, money doesn't buy taste, and the units in this building will sell no matter what.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 03:46 AM   #227
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You think those claims are wrong because you have limited understanding and historical knowledge. Let me correct you.
The GM Building was not designed to fit harmoniously with the surroundings. That was a major point of the style - to break away from the constriants of the past. It was a revolutionary style that created a new style of context rather than adhering to the archaic urban rules of yore. The mass and verticality of the facade are its defining characteristics. And it works.


The open plaza was very cool 50 years ago, but now it is home to the Apple cube
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 04:13 AM   #228
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Not to bring this GM building talk further off topic, but I would like to interject that urban planning types have since come to almost unanimous agreement that these urban plazas, which seemed like a good idea in the 50s and 60s, are disruptive to the urban environment.

You're on the money with the intent of the building, though, and anyone who doesn't recognize its importance in the Modernist movement is blind (even if its aesthetic value is totally subjective). My problem is that it came at the expense of another gem from a different era; the worst aspect of Modernism was the disdain for older building styles that led to a shortsighted "cleansing" of many great pre-war icons.

As all this relates to 520, I guess I'd say that while Stern's style isn't really my cup of tea (I much prefer "pure" styles that are a product of their time and place rather than referring back to an old one) I'm glad we're seeing a wide variety of building styles going up, from PoMo to Industrial to Avante Garde stuff the likes of which we could never have imagined before AutoCAD. Variety is the spice of life!
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 06:47 PM   #229
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http://www.520parkavenue.com/



In this render it seems like it's taller than the Bloomberg Towers 246m roof height, while it is 8 meters lower.
This pic is made from about 260 meter.
You can also compare it to the Citigroup Center, the bottom of the slope is over 240 meter, so from this angle it should apear to be way under that.

Last edited by tim1807; January 3rd, 2015 at 06:52 PM.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 06:52 PM   #230
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I guess because that photo was taken from the west and Bloomberg is further east, so it looks smaller.
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 10:22 PM   #231
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Everything is wrong in that rendering, scale, perspective, etc. The windows are a dead giveaway. They'd have to be huge to look like that. I suspect that it'll look thinner and shorter when it's built.
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Old January 5th, 2015, 12:12 AM   #232
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Originally Posted by LondoniumLex View Post
I guess because that photo was taken from the west and Bloomberg is further east, so it looks smaller.
That would have been a good point, wasn't it for the fact that the pic is taken from an higher altitude.
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Old January 13th, 2015, 04:33 AM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallKnight View Post
Not to bring this GM building talk further off topic, but I would like to interject that urban planning types have since come to almost unanimous agreement that these urban plazas, which seemed like a good idea in the 50s and 60s, are disruptive to the urban environment.

You're on the money with the intent of the building, though, and anyone who doesn't recognize its importance in the Modernist movement is blind (even if its aesthetic value is totally subjective). My problem is that it came at the expense of another gem from a different era; the worst aspect of Modernism was the disdain for older building styles that led to a shortsighted "cleansing" of many great pre-war icons.

As all this relates to 520, I guess I'd say that while Stern's style isn't really my cup of tea (I much prefer "pure" styles that are a product of their time and place rather than referring back to an old one) I'm glad we're seeing a wide variety of building styles going up, from PoMo to Industrial to Avante Garde stuff the likes of which we could never have imagined before AutoCAD. Variety is the spice of life!
You have to consider market forces. Most single family homes are built in traditional styles because that's what buyers want. And those homes typically have higher resale values than contemporary ones. Stern has seen the same forces in play with previous residential towers.


Étages_supérieurs_du_15_Central_Park_West_habité_par_Sting, Denzel_Washington. Penthouse_valant_88_millions_à_lui_seul_occupé_par_Ekaterina_Rybolovlev, étudiante_de_24_ans Upper West Side NYC by grgoirebreault, on Flickr
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Old January 23rd, 2015, 05:09 AM   #234
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Excavation on this has clearly started.
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Last edited by desertpunk; March 5th, 2015 at 05:06 AM.
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Old January 25th, 2015, 09:44 PM   #235
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Looks like the walls of the pit are already done. This should be U/C in no time.
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Old January 26th, 2015, 08:48 PM   #236
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I'm waiting impatiently.
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Old January 27th, 2015, 01:19 AM   #237
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Aren't those caissons in the pic? So shouldn't it be under construction already?
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Old March 5th, 2015, 06:59 AM   #238
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Old March 5th, 2015, 03:08 PM   #239
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U/C? Look at the rebar steel ...
And btw ... the city is approaching 20 200m+ towers U/C!!

Last edited by hunser; March 5th, 2015 at 04:18 PM.
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Old March 5th, 2015, 07:22 PM   #240
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Cheers cheers cheers!
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Hudson Yards mega development Map: June 2015
http://i.imgur.com/FVrYwpy.jpg
(click again once inside to enlarge the map)
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