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Old December 29th, 2012, 03:50 PM   #1
Gannet!
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WALES | Public Transport

A thread to share news and pictures about Wales public transport. Buses, trains, planes etc.

I'll start with some bus pictures from Cardiff, the capital city of Wales. The city owned 'Cardiff Bus' company operates the majority of services across the city.

Cardiff bus operates 220 buses and has a daily ridership of just below 100,000 people.

The number 18/19 Capital Red service, is the cities busiest route, operating every 5 minutes at peak times, and every 10 minutes off=peak.

The Green service is another popular route, highlighting the cities green credentials.

The Cardiff Airport service.

An older bus operated by Cardiff Bus.

A doubledecker, operating on the cities most popular routes.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 12:49 AM   #2
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Hum, nice pics! Line 18 is operated only by bendy buses?
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Old December 30th, 2012, 05:05 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodalvesdepaula View Post
Hum, nice pics! Line 18 is operated only by bendy buses?
Thank you or your compliments!

Yes the 18/19 service is always operated by bendy buses. Those buses are all fully air-conditioned, have live bus information, full CCTV coverage, and the best thing is the live rolling news from BBC News 24, shown on TV screens on the buses. The buses were all bought in 2006 for £235,000 each (That's $380,000 or €290,000).
Sadly the route used to run with trolleybuses, until the city removed them in the early 1950s, which would be good to still have.

Here is the schedule. As you can see, it doesn't run 24/7, but only from 4.30am until midnight. Cardiff has no real nightbus services.
http://www.cardiffbus.com/english/pdfs/routes/17-18.pdf

Those bendybuses also run on the 'baycar' service, running from the city centre to the cities dock area. This service runs every 10 minutes during the peak period, and every 15-20 minutes off-peak.


If you're interested in other Cardiff pictures please looks at this page: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1369693 It has lots of wonderful pictures.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 07:07 PM   #4
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There were plans for a light metro in Bristol but I believe they were quashed by the All Knowing.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 07:36 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwdwone View Post
There were plans for a light metro in Bristol but I believe they were quashed by the All Knowing.
Bristol is in England...

Swansea has a BRT system in place inaptly named Swansea Metro - it consists largely of dedicated bus roads and lanes around the city centre operated by 'ftr' articulated buses with segregated cabs for drivers. That's really the only mass transit operation in the whole of Wales sadly. The only tramway in Wales is a three-stop narrow gauge line in Llandudno.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 07:49 PM   #6
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Whereas Swansea used to have the worlds most wonderful tram railway which ran between the city and Mumbles head, the most amazing route followed the coast and used double decked trams. Sadly closed in the early 60's, a terrible waste.


From Cardiff333UK's youtube channel

I have many a childhood memory of the Mumbles railway!

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Old December 31st, 2012, 01:29 AM   #7
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Gannet, I have a question:

What type of bus is better to operate in Cardiff: bendy buses or double-decker bus?

I live in Sorocaba, Brazil, and I'm studyng a reform of the public transportation in my town. Here, we use front-engine midibuses and 15-meter, three-axles rear-engine Scania buses in lines between Downtown, villages and neighborhoods. I'm thinking if is better to use bendy buses or double-decker buses in suburban lines...
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Old December 31st, 2012, 02:06 AM   #8
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Rod-
Cardiff Bus doesn't have many double decker buses, so it's hard to tell. In the 'olden days' they used to operate a lot more, but they were replaced by bendy buses and by increasing the frequency of smaller buses on other routes.
I think the bendy buses work very well in Cardiff, but I'm a big fan of bendy buses generally, so maybe I'm biased.

Derek/ Tom- It's such a shame that former mass transit infrastructure was destroyed across Wales (and the UK), mainly in the 50s, 60s and 70s.
The good news for those wanting to head down to the Mumbles is that First operate an open top double decker on the route; during the summer months. From what I understand it is quite popular.

Plus, here's nice photo on Flickr

The ftr has been fairly widely derided. It seems to have cost a hell of a lot of money, for small returns, and according to some retailer a negative impact. Plus off peak you will rarely see the ftr buses, but rather normal buses.

Also, the Valleys Lines services, across the South Wales Valleys operate as a practical mass transit operation. On sections there are 6 trains an hour to Cardiff Central. Even in outer areas they are usually twice per hour. I'm hoping to a grand tour of the Valleys Lines soon and to post a few photos.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 01:19 PM   #9
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That's nice, Gannet! São Paulo had some double-decker buses in the 1980's, but the results were very bad 'cause there are a lot of trees in the streets, buses curled in trolleybus aerial wires, there was much mess and commotion on the upper deck...

Today, São Paulo has thousands of bendy buses (and "bi-bendy buses") in main lines, with good results.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 09:33 PM   #10
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I think the reason for British cities having double deckers is a historical thing. We always had double decker trams, so it was natural to build double decker buses. In Glasgow, routes that are not as important will use single deckers, but most routes are double deckers, with the most important routes using very long triple axle double deckers.

Articulated buses were absolutely despised in London, and there are only a handful in operation in Glasgow (and many other British cities).
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Old December 31st, 2012, 11:46 PM   #11
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Vehicle length also plays a large part in it. For the most part the double and single deckers used in the UK are short compared to standard length (~12m) rigid single deckers that are used elsewhere in the world. This is due to narrower streets and tighter turns.

Articulated buses generally replicating the turning circle of a standard of a 12m rigid, so logic says that where ever a 12m rigid can go so too can an 18m articulated bus. So hence as there are few 12m route buses in the UK, there are also fewer artics compared to the rest of the world and clearly a lot more double deckers.

Though Kolothos I do dispute your claim that there are only a handful of artics used in other British cities. From what I have seen outside of London aritcs are not all that rare and are well used.

And Rodalvesdepaula for the most part double deckers and artics carry the same amount of people, though as standing on the top deck is not allowed double deckers carry more seated passengers and artics more standing. Also a double decker is slower to load and unload due to the staircase. So for the most part if you have a short high capacity route where standing isn't an issue then use an artic. If you have a longer high capacity route and you can afford longer wait times at stops then go for a double decker.
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Old January 9th, 2013, 02:30 PM   #12
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Cardiff and South Wales have a pretty good passenger rail network, and with the electrification and expansion programme over the next few years I think it has the potential to be excellent.

The City of Cardiff itself (population 350,000) has around 20 stations on several lines and the wider commuting area including Newport, the Valleys and Vale of Glamorgan has around 100 stations for a population of some 1.4m

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Old January 10th, 2013, 05:47 AM   #13
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Nice welsh language....
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Old January 10th, 2013, 03:01 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Cardiff and South Wales have a pretty good passenger rail network, and with the electrification and expansion programme over the next few years I think it has the potential to be excellent.
Yes, I was in Wales for about a month in 2003 in the Cardiff/Pontypridd area and used the trains exclusively to get around the area as far north as Brecon and east to Caerleon. They are actually really convenient, clean, and easy to use. Nice system for a city of that size really.
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Old July 3rd, 2013, 10:16 AM   #15
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Does not suit Souter

Unsurprisingly Stagecoach are not enthused at the prospect of the re-regulation of buses in Wales.

http://www.4-traders.com/STAGECOACH-...hips-17063791/


Quote:
Stagecoach calls on Welsh Government to boost buses by promoting partnerships

02 Jul 2013

New regional bodies recommended for roads, public transport planning and delivery
Support for national transport network, but it "must be practical and affordable"
Bus contracting proposals and separate Welsh Govt regulatory powers rejected
Stagecoach reveals growth in passengers, bus networks and jobs in past five years

Stagecoach today (2 July 2013) urged the Welsh Government to boost bus use by making more use of existing legislation to encourage greater partnership working between bus operators and local authorities.

The company called for a more integrated approach to transport in Wales through the creation of new single regional bodies to take responsibility for both roads and public transport planning and delivery.

Stagecoach backed aspirations for a national transport network in Wales, but cautioned that any system "must be practical and affordable". It also rejected proposals for a bus contracting system and separate regulatory powers for the Welsh Government as unnecessary.

The details are included in Stagecoach's response to the Integrated Public Transport in Wales report published in May 2013 by the National Assembly's Enterprise and Business Committee. The company operates nearly 400 buses in South Wales, employs 900 people and carries 26 million passengers a year.

In its submission, Stagecoach revealed that in the last five years (2008/9 to 2012/13) the company had:

Increased service levels (miles operated) by 5.8%
Boosted jobs by 5.4%
Grown the number of adult fare paying passengers by 5.5%
Increased concessionary travel passenger numbers by 7.4%
Invested £11m in 100 new buses, with a further £3.4m order for 31 new buses in 2013/14

"Private sector operators are happy to work in partnership with the public sector to improve integration, co-ordination, ticketing and information, within the scope of competition law and on the understanding that services must be commercially and sustainably viable," Stagecoach said.

"There are already many examples of good quality public transport services in Wales. Stable and professional public sector governance and finance is essential to deliver further improvements."

It added: "The aspirations for a unified national public transport network with co-ordinated routes, timetables, ticketing and information must be tempered by practicality, affordability and deliverability."

Stagecoach, which has twice been independently assessed as offering the lowest fares of any major bus operator in the UK, said ticket pricing should continue to be left to bus operators.

In its submission, Stagecoach called for single Regional Planning Authorities, combining the Regional Transport Consortia (RTCs) with District Council planning and highway authorities, governed by Joint Boards of elected members from District Councils.

It said this approach would be "more efficient and effective" and would "provide a strong basis for national and local economic development".

However, Stagecoach said it was opposed to so-called Quality Contract schemes for legal, financial and practical reasons. They would take up to two years to put in place, divert vital funding away from services to pay for administering a contracting system, and leave taxpayers with the financial risk.

The company said that while London had an "enviable public transport system", the city was unique in the UK. It had high levels of commuting, but car use was impractical due to limited road and parking space, congestion and cost. London accounted for 40% of all UK transport expenditure and the London bus network public subsidy had mushroomed from £1m in 1999/2000 to £518m in 2011/12.

"It seems highly unlikely that the Welsh Government would be willing to commit such a high level of resource to public transport, even if it had the funds to do so," Stagecoach said.

The company pointed out that use of local bus services across the UK started falling from the 1950s due to increased car ownership, changing lifestyles, lower density housing and relocation of industry, which increased public transport costs. These factors were further exacerbated in the 1970s by rising fuel and wage costs, leading to a combination of rising fares, declining service levels, increasing subsidies and falling passenger numbers.

Stagecoach said it saw "no good reason" for the Welsh Government to have separate regulatory powers over bus services, which would lead to different regulatory systems as buses crossed over the border into England. Existing Transport Act powers were "already sufficiently wide to achieve any of the Committee's recommendations".

Elsewhere in its submission, Stagecoach said:

the scope of the committee's report should have been widened to include cars, roads, parking, and inter-urban coach services, as well the wider picture of national and local economic development and planning.
community and demand-responsive transport may be more appropriate than conventional bus services in areas of Wales where there is low demand.
there could be considerable benefits in co-ordinating transport provided by the health, education and social care sectors with more mainstream local bus services.
public transport should not be viewed in isolation from private transport.

ENDS

For media enquiries, please contact: Stagecoach Group Communications, tel: 01738 442111 or email: [email protected]

NOTES TO EDITORS

Stagecoach Group

Stagecoach Group is a leading international public transport group, with extensive operations in the UK, United States and Canada. The Group employs around 35,000 people, and operates bus, coach, train, and tram services.
Stagecoach is one of UK's biggest bus and coach operators with around 8,000 buses and coaches. Around 2.5 million passengers travel on Stagecoach's buses every day on a network stretching from south-west England to the Highlands and Islands of Scotland. The Group's business includes major city bus operations in London, Liverpool, Newcastle, Hull, Manchester, Oxford, Sheffield and Cambridge. Low-cost coach service, megabus.com, operates between around 60 towns and cities across the UK.
Stagecoach is a major UK rail operator, running the South West Trains, Island Line and East Midlands Trains networks. It has a 49% shareholding in Virgin Rail Group, which operates the West Coast inter-city rail franchise.
Stagecoach also operates the Supertram light rail network in Sheffield.
In North America, Stagecoach operates around 2,900 buses and coaches in the United States and Canada. Megabus.com serves around 130 cities in North America. Stagecoach is also involved in operating commuter and transit services, contracted bus services, charters, sightseeing tours and a small number of school bus services.
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Old March 27th, 2015, 12:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Could the Mumbles Railway make a comeback?

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wa...e-come-8929957


Image courtesy of Ian Dinmore

Columnist Robin Turner wonders if a revival of the Mumbles train could be considered as part of multi-million pound seafront development plans
Earlier this week while walking on the Swansea seafront I was reminded of what a beautiful part of the world this is.
A ship was gliding into Swansea Docks in the pale blue distance as a series of waves from a dead calm sea crashed into the steps in front of the city’s up-for-sale Civic Centre..
With the water sparkling like diamonds in the spring sunshine, people could not help but take snaps with their phones of the sun soaked curving shoreline with the distinctive Mumbles Pier at one end and Devon and Cornwall hanging in the distance.
Soon, Swansea council is drawing up a shortlist of bids which have been formally received for the waterfront Civic Centre site following presentations it gave in London and Swansea earlier this year to property development experts based in Wales, the UK and overseas.
The plans for an exciting tree lined “sky path” linking the city centre with a new look seafront full of homes, offices, hotels, bars, pedestrian paths and shops replacing the ill-designed, concrete Civic Centre could lead to a glittering new future for the centre of Swansea.
And it’s worth remembering that 208 years ago this week the Mumbles Railway carried the world’s first fare-paying railway passengers from a site near the present Civic Centre to Mumbles across the picturesque bay.
The railway moved from horse-power initially to steam locomotion and finally converted to electric trams, before closing, in what was surely one of Swansea’s most colossal mistakes, in January 1960, in favour of buses.
From those early days, when thirsty horses cooled off in the “horse pool” (now the bowling green and tennis courts on the Mumbles Seafront) to the gracious days of trams, the Mumbles train was a “must-do” for millions of visitors and locals alike.
Many mourned the passing of the world’s first passenger carrying railway on this glorious seafront crescent of ours.
And there have been feasibility studies into bringing back the service, even gravity defying maglev trains being proposed for the scenic route that would surely have people rolling up year after year.
But the costs have beaten them all.
However, could now be the time to revive the Mumbles railway?
The National Trust recently paid £3m for a car park at beautiful Rhossili, Gower; no doubt employing the principle the place will never stop being an attraction, decade after decade.
Maybe developers ploughing millions into the new look Swansea seafront may be tempted to revive the Mumbles Train.
There must be some financially rewarding way of bringing it back.
As inventor, Thomas Edison said: “I have not failed. I’ve just found 10,000 ways that won’t work.”
Not unnaturally, I think that this would be a splendid idea.
How much of the old route is extant?
Could it be integrated somehow into the Lagoon scheme at the other end of town?

Unfortunately as a long-term exile, I will not get the chance to do one of my walking tours capturing images of the existing state of the infrastructure – so if anybody with boots and a camera would like to volunteer I/we would be grateful.

Who knows that perhaps the Stockholm Concept tram could grace the rails someday?



Remind you of anything?
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Old October 13th, 2016, 02:55 PM   #17
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From Railway Gazette:

Quote:
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/p...o-options.html

Wales & Borders bidders asked to submit Metro options
13 Oct 2016





UK: The four bidders shortlisted for the contract to be the 'Operator & Development Partner' holding the next Wales & Borders franchise were announced by the Welsh Government's Economy & Infrastructure Secretary Ken Skates on October 13.

They are:
  • Abellio Rail Cymru;
  • Arriva Rail Wales/Rheilffyrdd Arriva Cymru Ltd;
  • KeolisAmey;
  • MTR Corp (Cymru) Ltd;
The current franchise held by Arriva Trains Wales was awarded by the UK Department for Transport, but the replacement ODP contract is to be awarded by the devolved Welsh Government through a very different process with much more design input from the bidders

...
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Old November 14th, 2016, 08:11 AM   #18
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The South Wales Metro is a truly ambitious programme, and I'm very happy the Welsh Government has announced this project.



Here is a map of the proposed scheme. Most lines are already in operation as heavy rail services. Some of them are in operation as bus operations (dark blue, half the yellow, both browns, Both turquoises, blue from Newport to Treharris).

The only route with no service at all at the moment is the brown line from Hirwaun to Treherbert - and I'm not being harsh when I say that service probably will never be viable, even if it has a subsidy.

I'm looking forward to seeing who wins the contract and I hope the proposal is ambitious.
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