daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Forums > Architecture > European Classic Architecture and Landscapes

European Classic Architecture and Landscapes All related to historical buildings and landscapes of the old world.



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old April 10th, 2013, 10:34 AM   #41
GhostOfDorian
Smartshitter
 
GhostOfDorian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Freiburg im Breisgau
Posts: 2,079
Likes (Received): 5959

Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfThomp View Post
This version seems best, as it more closely resembles the original street plan. It allows for the Palais de Saxe, but also the Hotel Stadt Rom. That said, the aesthetic value of the new construction is less than zero:

http://www.neumarkt-dresden.de/image...Moritz_02d.jpg
In this proposal they move the Hotel Stadt Rom from its original footprint. They would only rebuild 2/3 of the original structure. They would have to spend a lot of money to remodel those old buildings on Wilsdruffer Straße. I don't see any reason why someone should invest much money in such terrible houses. It would be a much better investment to tear them down, and built something better instead. That would also allow to reconstruct the original buildings at Neumarkt side on their former position.
GhostOfDorian no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old April 10th, 2013, 03:21 PM   #42
erbse
LIBERTINED
 
erbse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: McLenBurg
Posts: 43,310
Likes (Received): 58030

Couldn't agree more! MR. BLOBEL, TEAR DOWN THIS CRAP!
__________________
GET FREE!
D W F


🔥 Tradition doesn't mean to look after the ash, but to keep the flame alive! 🔥

keepthepast, SonOfThomp liked this post
erbse no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 10th, 2013, 04:35 PM   #43
keepthepast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 977
Likes (Received): 1677

Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post

IMHO, one of the main problems with the horrible post-war buildings is the site plan. Notice how far the set backs are from the streets and the larger inner courtyards. All this wasted space serves only to feature and shine-a-spotlight on the ugly structures.

Had the original footprint of the buildilngs and the original site plans been maintained, the ugliness of the buildilngs would have been easier to take. With a closer-in and connected layout, street level appearance nuances, decorations, interesting paint colors, and personal connections could have been created that would have been more acceptable.
keepthepast no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 10th, 2013, 07:26 PM   #44
SonOfThomp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 291
Likes (Received): 226

Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
Couldn't agree more! MR. BLOBEL, TEAR DOWN THIS CRAP!
This made me shoot coffee out my nose!
__________________

erbse liked this post
SonOfThomp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 10th, 2013, 07:27 PM   #45
SonOfThomp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 291
Likes (Received): 226

Quote:
Originally Posted by keepthepast View Post
IMHO, one of the main problems with the horrible post-war buildings is the site plan. Notice how far the set backs are from the streets and the larger inner courtyards. All this wasted space serves only to feature and shine-a-spotlight on the ugly structures.

Had the original footprint of the buildilngs and the original site plans been maintained, the ugliness of the buildilngs would have been easier to take. With a closer-in and connected layout, street level appearance nuances, decorations, interesting paint colors, and personal connections could have been created that would have been more acceptable.
Ahh, yes - but Totalitarians do SO love their parades.
__________________

keepthepast liked this post
SonOfThomp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 10th, 2013, 09:43 PM   #46
keepthepast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 977
Likes (Received): 1677

Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfThomp View Post
Ahh, yes - but Totalitarians do SO love their parades.
Yes indeed they do! Tough to squeeze marching troops and tanks through narrow streets.
keepthepast no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 10th, 2013, 10:29 PM   #47
GhostOfDorian
Smartshitter
 
GhostOfDorian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Freiburg im Breisgau
Posts: 2,079
Likes (Received): 5959

Quote:
Originally Posted by keepthepast View Post
Yes indeed they do! Tough to squeeze marching troops and tanks through narrow streets.
Hopefully you don't think that the French are totalitarians. They like that, too.
GhostOfDorian no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 12th, 2013, 08:53 PM   #48
EvanG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Antwerp
Posts: 1,656
Likes (Received): 132

The French kings and both Napoleon's also weren't really that big fans of democracy though.
EvanG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 12:01 PM   #49
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,450
Likes (Received): 21129

What is intersting about this project is that is shows that large-scale demolitions are nothing new (as in beign an invetion of post-WW2).

Thus, if it was done much earlier and people liked the results, we should be able to keep demolishing new areas of contemporary cities to build new avenues, highways etc.
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 12:08 PM   #50
erbse
LIBERTINED
 
erbse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: McLenBurg
Posts: 43,310
Likes (Received): 58030

^ No. Just no.
__________________
GET FREE!
D W F


🔥 Tradition doesn't mean to look after the ash, but to keep the flame alive! 🔥
erbse no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 12:38 PM   #51
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,450
Likes (Received): 21129

Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
^ No. Just no.
Isn't this EXACTLY what they did in Dresden opening the Koening-Johann-Strasse - demolishing old quarters to make room for new and modern (for their time) buildings??
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 12:53 PM   #52
erbse
LIBERTINED
 
erbse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: McLenBurg
Posts: 43,310
Likes (Received): 58030

Yeah. And I don't think that was the best move after all. We lost very valuable baroque gems this way.

Same thing goes for "releasing" churches from their surrounding buildings, which was often done during the Gründerzeit. It never was the intention to have completely free standing religious structures all over the place.

The difference compared to today is: People still had a sense for what's harmoniously integrating. When they've torn down old buildings and replaced them with new ones, they cared about the cityscape. Built integrating architecture.

As happened with König-Johann-Strasse. Imagining it'd have been done in the 70s, oh my... You can expect horrible, non-integrating results only.

While in the 50s, they were at least able to still grab a sense of what was there before, as the Altmarkt shows. It features typical elements of Saxonian baroque.
__________________
GET FREE!
D W F


🔥 Tradition doesn't mean to look after the ash, but to keep the flame alive! 🔥

Cager, SonOfThomp liked this post
erbse no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 08:08 PM   #53
SonOfThomp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 291
Likes (Received): 226

ARCHITEKTUR IN DRESDEN 1800-1900, Volker Helas

I scanned this from the book, used OCR software to convert to PDF, then Google Translate:

"The breakthrough of the König-johann-Straße 1885 - 1888 from the Altmarkt in Center of the old town in west-east Direction after Pirnaischen-Platz
was urgently needed to the Pirna suburb and the eastern suburbs better-connect to the city center. Cultivate were 400 m, for which partially artistically
valuable substance had to be sacrificed. The ortsgesetzli-chemical basis (???) of the breakthrough companies vied with the regulator of 27 March 1885
and the Decree of 25 July 1885. The Creative Guidelines exhausted in two paragraphs, Clause 3 wrote a height of four storeys, and Mansard before,
paragraph demanded on the front facades "pure work" ie sandstone cladding. The designs were at the no public tender nine Companies invited.
The jury made Canzler the chief master builder, Stadtbaurat Palmie, the Supervisory Board of Long Construction Bank and city architect Bruno Adam.
The project was approved by Dresdner Architects support. The Dresdner Anzeiger reported on 11 January 1885, p 24: "The Dresden Architektenverein expressed
for the anticipated Road expansion and Breakthrough projects its full sympathy and actuated same by choosing a Commission, which test the
same before and baldigsten reporting reimbursement asked about them at the club will. "The Commission was for the Architects Giese, Haltenhof, Bruno
Adam Martin and Wanckel on. The Breakthrough occurred at a phase characterized by Severe fatigue of historicism Nicolai Prägung stamping in was.
The artistic management should serve the Picturesque in the Dresden's architectural aesthetics of new viewpoint. "The picturesque element, that the streets of old cities
(...) inherent is not wither numbers. "The multiple cutting through of the new road Cross streets, the slight kink (...) allows interesting recovery by Corner Solutions, hoping bay and towers. "
(Dresdner Gazette of 24 February1885, 5 Supplement, p 20)
The result of the competition was very in terms of expectations from local, what does not surprising, since both Price candidates, however one
View of the capital is not fails had, and the jury of same artistic ideas were marked. The results of the competition were publicly exhibited. The German construction newspaper reported (19] g, 1885, No. 61, pp.
367): "In its architectural equipments, most designs are true children of the Dresden school, if even in diverse Abartungen. Of the simple and sober style of barracks time up to the picturesque old-funny
Facades decoration in their wildest forms and motifs German Renaissance are here pretty much all attempts represented on paper, which one of the recent buildings can see. Something Emphasis is individually Jumping
under it hardly, as you know, the training of imaginative self-like always been the weakest side of the craftsmanship in all the art so excellent Dresden Architecture school has been. "On 5 October 1885
began fretwork, 1888 were the work completed. The Works were in the hands of this purpose founded Aktiengesellschaft Community "Construction Bank". Bruno Adam acted as their technical director.
This breakthrough is in the street Eighties was highly praised: "Later generations are likely probably with the same respect, we the Schöpfungcn Pöpelmanns, Semper, George Bear, Wolframmsdorffs, etc.,
on the buildings Heynes, Gurlitts, Adams and other Mirus Baumei-art look. I remember it only to the King John Street. The Dresden shows resurrected the magnificent buildings with Pride.
However, at best, during their formation increase was granted. 1903 wrote Otto Richter, albeit from a converted aesthetics starting:
"For the Cityscape was certainly not lucky that the Construction in a time where the architecture everywhere was ruled by an addiction to pomp and Overload was the rule. "(Judge, History, p 101)
ln the course of this road breakthrough followed also the Moritzstraße to the Johannisplatz and the continuation of the road under the name Johann-Georen-Alee, at the same time were de-conditioning of the Ring-Straße promoted."

Any clarification is appreciated, as Google Translate can be a bit 'amusing'

Last edited by SonOfThomp; April 15th, 2013 at 08:18 PM.
SonOfThomp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 11:16 PM   #54
SonOfThomp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 291
Likes (Received): 226

I just LOVE this:
__________________

erbse, Photodash liked this post
SonOfThomp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 15th, 2013, 11:21 PM   #55
JohnnyMass
Whatever
 
JohnnyMass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Porto
Posts: 46,077
Likes (Received): 1493

Stunning architecture!
__________________
Edit my Signature
JohnnyMass no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 16th, 2013, 06:09 PM   #56
SonOfThomp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 291
Likes (Received): 226

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMass View Post
Stunning architecture!
Yeah, isn't it? Who made that stuff up? How would you even describe the tower/turret affair in architecturalese?
SonOfThomp no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 16th, 2013, 11:54 PM   #57
JohnnyMass
Whatever
 
JohnnyMass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Porto
Posts: 46,077
Likes (Received): 1493

A very talented and imaginative architect! Over the top Neo-Renaissance would be a good way to describe it.
__________________
Edit my Signature

erbse liked this post

Last edited by JohnnyMass; April 17th, 2013 at 11:50 PM.
JohnnyMass no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 17th, 2013, 08:00 AM   #58
TimothyR
Ike
 
TimothyR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Born in NYC, Living in Boston
Posts: 1,272
Likes (Received): 2088

Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfThomp View Post
I just LOVE this:
It is literally fantastic. It looks like the set for a film by Murnau or Fritz Lang.
__________________

“In keeping silent about evil, in burying it so deep within us that no sign of it appears on the surface, we are implanting it, and it will rise up a thousand fold in the future. When we neither punish nor reproach evildoers we are thereby ripping the foundations of justice from beneath new generations.”

“The meaning of earthly existence lies not, as we have grown used to thinking, in prospering but in the development of the soul.”
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

"We are more closely connected to the invisible than to the visible"

-Novalis
TimothyR no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 18th, 2013, 12:00 AM   #59
JohnnyMass
Whatever
 
JohnnyMass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Porto
Posts: 46,077
Likes (Received): 1493

So much was lost... this one was stunning as many others but the Viktoriahaus on Prager Strasse and the Kaiserpalast on Pirnaischer Platz will allways be, at least to me, two of Dresden's greatest war losses.
__________________
Edit my Signature

erbse, cilindr0, Fudgis liked this post
JohnnyMass no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 18th, 2013, 07:27 AM   #60
keepthepast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 977
Likes (Received): 1677



Yes, those two icons of Dresden's glorious archetecture are sorely missed. The Viktoriahaus location is now fully developed with new and modern buildings. However, the Pirnaischer Platz remains vacant so the possibility of a reconstructed Kaiserpalast is a valid hope and dream.
keepthepast no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu