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Old March 21st, 2015, 02:45 AM   #101
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But the main point is that we feel better surrounded by old architecture, small streets and squares. I'm from Croatia and I see a lot of German tourists visiting our old towns just because they can't get the same experience in their own country.
There's still loads and loads of German old towns, many of the smaller places survived and also some bigger cities and old towns (like Regensburg, Bamberg, Lübeck, Heidelberg, Erfurt, Stralsund, Schwerin, Wismar, Görlitz, Quedlinburg, Goslar). Check this album for instance or this list of old towns.
But Germans have what we call Fernweh, or what became a global synonym: wanderlust. We love to explore new and somewhat exotic, different places. Add to that the climate of the mediterrenean... Though travelling across Germany is number 1 in German tourism, so it's not like we don't value our own culture and cities/towns.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 08:25 PM   #102
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There's still loads and loads of German old towns, many of the smaller places survived and also some bigger cities and old towns (like Regensburg, Bamberg, Lübeck, Heidelberg, Erfurt, Stralsund, Schwerin, Wismar, Görlitz, Quedlinburg, Goslar). Check this album for instance or this list of old towns.
But Germans have what we call Fernweh, or what became a global synonym: wanderlust. We love to explore new and somewhat exotic, different places. Add to that the climate of the mediterrenean... Though travelling across Germany is number 1 in German tourism, so it's not like we don't value our own culture and cities/towns.
I know that there are a lot of preserved old towns, but the bigger cities are filled with cheap postwar architecture.

It's weird, but I would rather visit a German old town than a Croatian one. And the Mediterannean climate is so overrated. But maybe I feel that way because I got used to stone buildings and beaches, who would know it?
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Old March 22nd, 2015, 05:39 PM   #103
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There's still loads and loads of German old towns, many of the smaller places survived and also some bigger cities and old towns (like Regensburg, Bamberg, Lübeck, Heidelberg, Erfurt, Stralsund, Schwerin, Wismar, Görlitz, Quedlinburg, Goslar). Check this album for instance or this list of old towns.
But Germans have what we call Fernweh, or what became a global synonym: wanderlust. We love to explore new and somewhat exotic, different places. Add to that the climate of the mediterrenean... Though travelling across Germany is number 1 in German tourism, so it's not like we don't value our own culture and cities/towns.
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I know that there are a lot of preserved old towns, but the bigger cities are filled with cheap postwar architecture.

It's weird, but I would rather visit a German old town than a Croatian one. And the Mediterannean climate is so overrated. But maybe I feel that way because I got used to stone buildings and beaches, who would know it?
Of all those noted, I think if one wants to "time travel" into a pre WWII environment that is almost 100% intact from the train station onward, experience Gorlitz.

And Titan, I agree about the overrated Mediterranean climate similar to what we have here in SF. We never know what month we're in!
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Old March 22nd, 2015, 06:03 PM   #104
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woow..frankfurt is Beeeaaauuutyyyfuuulll
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Old March 22nd, 2015, 06:51 PM   #105
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Of all those noted, I think if one wants to "time travel" into a pre WWII environment that is almost 100% intact from the train station onward, experience Gorlitz.

And Titan, I agree about the overrated Mediterranean climate similar to what we have here in SF. We never know what month we're in!
I live in an area with cold winters and hot summers, which is kinda weird, but you get the best of both, so I don't have a problem like yours, my friend. But summer months can really be bi*ches with temperatures jumping over 45 degrees Celsius.
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 12:36 AM   #106
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Modernism should be banned in once historic districts and only faithful reconstructions should be allowed.
i agree personally
but how can we actually convince people, architects, and in general critiques of old styles or reconstruction?
there are a whole bunch of people who say "why does it matter?","who cares?", "who cares about the history or identity?" "what benefit does it bring?" and more importantly on a larger scale :" why does architecture matter?"

i am asking, for help, to see how we can perhaps bring more logistical approaches to convincing these people and answering these types of questions
any thoughts?
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 12:59 AM   #107
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^ Well, if you'd understand German I'd redirect you to an article. I collected various arguments pro reconstructions there to counter-balance contra arguments mentioned. I plan to translate it for the English language reco article for some time, but it's a bit of work.

Here it is (pros and cons of reconstruction, in German): https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rekons...konstruktionen
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 01:07 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by Titan Man View Post
I know that there are a lot of preserved old towns, but the bigger cities are filled with cheap postwar architecture.

It's weird, but I would rather visit a German old town than a Croatian one. And the Mediterannean climate is so overrated. But maybe I feel that way because I got used to stone buildings and beaches, who would know it?
Just the other way around here I simply love Croatia and croatian old towns. But the german ones are usually good as well. If they still exist, that is...
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 04:36 AM   #109
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^ Well, if you'd understand German I'd redirect you to an article. I collected various arguments pro reconstructions there to counter-balance contra arguments mentioned. I plan to translate it for the English language reco article for some time, but it's a bit of work.

Here it is (pros and cons of reconstruction, in German): https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rekons...konstruktionen
thank you ! this will be of great help
the second link really opens up the idea (i skimmed through it , i will read it in detail later)

also, anybody have any similar articles regarding the importance of architecture and the urban world as a whole ?
sadly many people dismiss architecture as a psuedo-science with little regard to the importance of the design process, or they simply believe architecture is an easy subject, having it often compared to stuff like decoration and furniture design , while in reality is has fairly large engineering implications and more "mechanics" to it ( although that does slightly depend on the country you work in) , but people think its something anyone can do, and they can , but poorly

there are many people who say they dont care about the appearance of the cities as long as it works, and they show examples of monolithic chinese cities or american urban sprawl and say that the people are happy and nobody seems to care about what is built

as a result, projects like dresden or frankfurts reconstruction or generally anything aesthetic, pedestrian etc becomes like a childish fashion show for them, they then bring the matter of "personal tase" and also claim that people like us are old fashioned and inefficient
which is somewhat laughable
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 02:12 PM   #110
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Why was my last post removed????
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 02:58 PM   #111
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People today don't care how their city looks, which is very sad. If you ask me, my city is one of the ugliest in Croatia, but other citizens say it's beautiful just because it has awesome position right next to the sea. It's filled with cheap, post-war communist architecture with no emotional or historical value, but unfortunately, nobody even talks about reconstruction or something like that.

P.S. Zadar was bombed in WW2. Almost entire historical city center was destroyed and only churches were reconstructed. The cultural damage that was done to the most important city on eastern Adriatic coast is even comparable to Dresden bombings.
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 07:13 PM   #112
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but i think that they do
subconsciously
we as humans spend money on good looking clothes, food , cars , furniture
we shope and tend to travel to good looking places with good economic, aesthetics etc
yet its so hard to convince people that they already are aiding a need for good architecture

the people of your town might seem to not care but if you give them a choice of two cities, one better than the other , they choose the better one , yet they would deny that there is a "better" option and that they are all the same

for exampe, renovated clean market areas attract much more customers than ugly ruined ones yet many people seem to think aesthetics of good design is just for some fantasy in an architect's mind

anyway, i think i am getting a bit off topic
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Old March 23rd, 2015, 07:41 PM   #113
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Unfortunately, we don't have money to reconstruct cities. Croatia is in deep economic crisis and we just can't afford to rebuild entire city center. At least Frankfurt is trying to bring back some of its old charm. I hope that in few yers when citizens see the outcome and the beauty of the reconstructed area, they will push for some new, bigger reconstruction projects.

Any new photos of the construction site??
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Old March 24th, 2015, 02:51 AM   #114
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There's still loads and loads of German old towns, many of the smaller places survived and also some bigger cities and old towns (like Regensburg, Bamberg, Lübeck, Heidelberg, Erfurt, Stralsund, Schwerin, Wismar, Görlitz, Quedlinburg, Goslar). Check this album for instance or this list of old towns.
and Chemnitz? Was there no old town in Chemnitz?
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Old March 24th, 2015, 01:17 PM   #115
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There was, but there isn't too much left sadly. Chemnitz in Saxony used to be the richest bigger city of Germany before WW2 by the way. You can find many pre-war images here: http://www.historisches-chemnitz.de/index2.html


I think Frankfurt, Dresden, Potsdam, Berlin and others will send out signals to other contemporary urban planners, investors, politicians and citizens of the world. Reconstructing lost marvels of your history, new classical architecture - it's worth it! It's worth it, to have great, unique and beautiful places to live in.
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Old March 24th, 2015, 01:27 PM   #116
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Dom-Römer Altstadt construction update

And here you are, fresh photos of Frankfurt's old town phoenix rising from the ashes!

All from the Frankfurt forum Dom-Römer thread.


http://www.fnp.de/lokales/frankfurt/...art675,1278457





They marked the houses individually with their names, really neat idea:

Courtesy of: SSC forumer skyliner1


The first floors and fire-resisting walls will be all made of concrete for safety reasons.
The upper floors are all made of timber-frame constructions, bricks and stones.
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Old March 24th, 2015, 04:45 PM   #117
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There was, but there isn't too much left sadly. Chemnitz in Saxony used to be the richest bigger city of Germany before WW2 by the way. You can find many pre-war images here: http://www.historisches-chemnitz.de/index2.html


I think Frankfurt, Dresden, Potsdam, Berlin and others will send out signals to other contemporary urban planners, investors, politicians and citizens of the world. Reconstructing lost marvels of your history, new classical architecture - it's worth it! It's worth it, to have great, unique and beautiful places to live in.
I hope so, nobody wants to see some modern interpretations of ugly postwar architecture.
Btw, nice photos.
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Old March 24th, 2015, 05:25 PM   #118
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People today don't care how their city looks, which is very sad. If you ask me, my city is one of the ugliest in Croatia, but other citizens say it's beautiful just because it has awesome position right next to the sea.
I think they do, but there's a major difference between what you and the general population consider attractive architecture. Every city that was heavily damaged during the WW2 struggles while trying to find its own identity. Where I'm from a possible reconstruction of anything lost during the war isn't even being considered. Both people and authorities of Rotterdam are crazy about being modern and unique. They're so blinded by their desire to be special they don't even see most of the current projects will be considered worthless in 10-20 years. So, having that in mind I think Frankfurt [and Berlin] is doing an exceptional job restoring the city back to its former glory. When I hear that a giant tube that sucked millions of euros and is now filled with hippie-friendly joints is being called "iconic" I really wish I could just pack my stuff and move to Frankfurt.
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Old March 24th, 2015, 06:19 PM   #119
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I think they do, but there's a major difference between what you and the general population consider attractive architecture. Every city that was heavily damaged during the WW2 struggles while trying to find its own identity. Where I'm from a possible reconstruction of anything lost during the war isn't even being considered. Both people and authorities of Rotterdam are crazy about being modern and unique. They're so blinded by their desire to be special they don't even see most of the current projects will be considered worthless in 10-20 years. So, having that in mind I think Frankfurt [and Berlin] is doing an exceptional job restoring the city back to its former glory. When I hear that a giant tube that sucked millions of euros and is now filled with hippie-friendly joints is being called "iconic" I really wish I could just pack my stuff and move to Frankfurt.
The only modern structure in Rotterdam that is interesting is Erasmus bridge. Everything else is not even worth seeing.
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Old March 24th, 2015, 09:43 PM   #120
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The only modern structure in Rotterdam that is interesting is Erasmus bridge. Everything else is not even worth seeing.
I disagree, there's plenty of modern structures worth seeing in Rotterdam, but they are drawning in a sea of lego-like structures, giant tubes and three doors waredrobes. I wish the city center was rebuilt in the 1940-1950s, those two decades gave Rotterdam so many good architecture.
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