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Old August 2nd, 2014, 05:57 PM   #3621
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
Man, please, change your fetish...
What is wrong with monorails? I think they are sleek, neat and very modern-looking. Many European cities should be looking forward to use monorails instead of trams.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 06:23 PM   #3622
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Had to be done: http://youtu.be/wJ5CbLnSjo0
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 11:32 PM   #3623
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I think they are sleek, neat and very modern-looking.
It flies as softly as a cloud?

(wonder how long before I quote the whole song one-post at a time)
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 12:44 AM   #3624
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Quote:
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What is wrong with monorails? I think they are sleek, neat and very modern-looking. Many European cities should be looking forward to use monorails instead of trams.
They require you to cover streets and obscure buildings facades and where in the US you have grid layouts for your towns and cities, London has basically a medieval layout in the centre so it'd be a bugger to build and horrendously unpopular
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 02:51 AM   #3625
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They require you to cover streets and obscure buildings facades and where in the US you have grid layouts for your towns and cities, London has basically a medieval layout in the centre so it'd be a bugger to build and horrendously unpopular
I was thinking of a monorail in South London, like a Greenwich - Croydon monorail.
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 02:22 PM   #3626
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I was thinking of a monorail in South London, like a Greenwich - Croydon monorail.
1) have you seen South London's streets?
2) there's a perfectly decent rail corridor between the two (or at least as far as Lewisham) - if the change at Elmers End (and Lewisham) isn't good enough, then surely you do something about that, rather than start from scratch and build a monorail...
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Old August 4th, 2014, 12:51 AM   #3627
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Going back to real life, looks like something´s moving in the direction of a future extension of the Bakerloo line towards SE London.

Not as a monorail, btw.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 01:42 AM   #3628
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I still don't believe he actually proposed monorail for London.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 03:25 AM   #3629
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The Docklands Light Railway is grade-separated, automated, and mostly elevated. It's as functionally close to being a monorail as is possible without actually being a monorail.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 03:42 AM   #3630
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They're also much faster, cheaper, and probably more comfortable...
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Well, sir, there's nothing on earth like a genuine, bona fide, electrified, six-car monorail!

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Old August 4th, 2014, 10:09 AM   #3631
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Stop this bi-rail insanity! Two rails = twice as expensive and half the fun. It's just simple maths
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Old August 4th, 2014, 03:16 PM   #3632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
They're also much faster, cheaper, and probably more comfortable...
The advantage of a monorail is that the shadow projection of the beams is much narrower than a deck that takes up 2 tracks.

Of course, monorails are only effective for largely elevated lines. It wouldn't make much sense to build them underground, or at surface level.

London has a lot of rail lines taking up a lot of space, and nobody seems to give much worry about them because they have been there for 120+ years. So I don't see why would be so problematic to build new elevated structures over existing neighborhoods. Being elevated, they wouldn't even form access barriers to neighborhoods like heavy rail lines do.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 04:18 PM   #3633
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg_christine View Post
The Docklands Light Railway is grade-separated, automated, and mostly elevated. It's as functionally close to being a monorail as is possible without actually being a monorail.
The DLR re-uses a great many existing rail viaducts. It would be nonsense to try and waste all of that infrastructure by going with monorail.

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Stop this bi-rail insanity! Two rails = twice as expensive and half the fun. It's just simple maths
Hardly. Surface rail transport is generally cheaper than monorail.

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Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
The advantage of a monorail is that the shadow projection of the beams is much narrower than a deck that takes up 2 tracks.
Nowadays, improved construction techniques means that heavier-duty monorails are about as massive as some of the lighter-weight heavy rail/light rail viaducts. Just look at Seattle and DC (Dulles Metro).

Quote:
Of course, monorails are only effective for largely elevated lines. It wouldn't make much sense to build them underground, or at surface level.
Truth.

Quote:
London has a lot of rail lines taking up a lot of space, and nobody seems to give much worry about them because they have been there for 120+ years. So I don't see why would be so problematic to build new elevated structures over existing neighborhoods. Being elevated, they wouldn't even form access barriers to neighborhoods like heavy rail lines do.
People are USED to the existing rail lines and accustomed to the noise they emit. But any increase in noise will be met with resistance. And yes, monorails DO have some level of noise emissions. Additionally, the pylons would be massively disruptive to city life, and people would complain about monorail riders looking in their windows.

The closest thing to what you are talking about would be the Shonan Monorail in Japan. And that was built prior to NIMBY movements really taking off there.

If you think that the NIMBY movements in London won't stop anything other than an overwhelmingly underground (or existing right of way) route in their tracks, you need to think a bit more seriously.

--------------------------

Also, the rail lines don't take up nearly as much space as the roads (proportionate to the over-all land area).
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Old August 4th, 2014, 05:22 PM   #3634
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Hardly.
That was a joke... Unless you can prove they aren't twice as fun? :-p
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Old August 5th, 2014, 01:12 AM   #3635
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Look in the Sao Paulo thread. I've been impressed by how quickly they have built their first monorail line. Sao Paulo has already contracted for two more monorail lines, and now Rio de Janeiro is planning to build monorail.

I have zero expectation that London would ever choose monorail. The British like to stick with tradition. They would probably still have steam trains in London if it weren't for the pollution.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 02:00 AM   #3636
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg_christine View Post
The British like to stick with tradition. They would probably still have steam trains in London if it weren't for the pollution.
That's incredibly subjective, yes we have certain rigid traditions but were not exactly stuck in our old ways are we? We were the first country to develop a tilting train (APT) and it'd probably be running and it not been destroyed by the press who were ill while onboard and blamed it on the tilting (rather than the copious amounts of alcohol BR had supplied them). We really wouldn't, the lines in South London were electrified by the southern in the 20s and early 30s. The Brighton main line was one of the worlds first main line electrification schemes completed in the 30s. By 1929 Southern were operating around 280 route miles of electrified track. Steam was killed by the 1955 modernisation plan which saw steam locos built just a few years prior scrapped, we probably would have kept steam into the 70s had we not rushed to get rid of it.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 02:07 AM   #3637
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London should adopt it's own 'grand london express' scheme like the one in paris, but made up of 8 lines
- 4 lines that cross the center and making half A circle line within the center.

- 2 circle lines
A: city center circle (conveniently using tunnels made for those other 4 lines.)
B: suburb circle

- 2 lines that fill the important gaps left by the other six.

Making 8 lines in total.

Being very difficult to built around exsisting lines, such A scheme would probably never happen in London.

Last edited by Dooie_Amsterdammert; August 5th, 2014 at 02:10 AM. Reason: dreadful error removed.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 02:40 AM   #3638
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Quote:
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the first country to develop a tilting train
This is highly debatable
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I've sold monorails to Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrooke, and by gum, it put them on the map!
Well, sir, there's nothing on earth like a genuine, bona fide, electrified, six-car monorail!

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Old August 8th, 2014, 11:49 PM   #3639
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg_christine View Post
The British like to stick with tradition. They would probably still have steam trains in London if it weren't for the pollution.
We still do


Met. 1, Kings Cross Station Station, London by IFM Photographic, on Flickr

Met. 1, Kings Cross Station Station, London by IFM Photographic, on Flickr

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Old August 9th, 2014, 05:57 AM   #3640
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Quote:
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Look in the Sao Paulo thread. I've been impressed by how quickly they have built their first monorail line.
It's not running yet though. But yes, our monorail lines are built much, much faster than the usual underground lines.
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