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Old March 20th, 2008, 12:44 PM   #681
DarJoLe
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I don't know why trains have such small windows these days.
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Old March 20th, 2008, 04:54 PM   #682
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I don't know why trains have such small windows these days.
At the Cooling the Tube talk recently, Kevin Payne told how there has been a sucessful trial of removing the large windows from Central line trains and replacing them with a smaller window and a vent.
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Old March 21st, 2008, 03:44 AM   #683
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It'll definately increase noise levels though.
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Old March 22nd, 2008, 06:33 PM   #684
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opps

Last edited by Acemcbuller; March 22nd, 2008 at 06:38 PM. Reason: Posted in wrong place
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Old March 23rd, 2008, 06:29 AM   #685
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And what about in the winter? Will we be able to close these gaps?
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Old March 24th, 2008, 03:11 PM   #686
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Video showing the different rolling stock on the Underground, with the exception of a few (95TS, 72TS, 67TS and A Stock) the silver trains towards the end of the video are now all refurbished and now all look like the train at 4:30.

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Old March 26th, 2008, 04:58 PM   #687
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Some bloke goes on a tour of Northumberland Park Depot, showing the new 2009 Stock for the Victoria line.
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Old March 26th, 2008, 07:27 PM   #688
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They look very swish, I like them.
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Old March 28th, 2008, 07:41 PM   #689
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I'm going to London in April. can't wait to see the underground and canary wharf station
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Old March 29th, 2008, 03:11 AM   #690
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Canary Wharf isn't the only interesting station...
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Old March 29th, 2008, 03:17 AM   #691
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acemcbuller View Post
At the Cooling the Tube talk recently, Kevin Payne told how there has been a sucessful trial of removing the large windows from Central line trains and replacing them with a smaller window and a vent.
That doesn't sound like a particularly good solution to me. A vent would just allow cooler air from the tunnels and stations to be circulated into the train but, as there is a general problem with heat in the stations and tunnels generally, it wouldn't help too much.

What is needed is some system to remove the heat from the tunnels and disperse it to the open air. That is much easier in the case of the sub-surface lines as these have much more air space generally and several sections that are not roofed in.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 07:19 PM   #692
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That doesn't sound like a particularly good solution to me. A vent would just allow cooler air from the tunnels and stations to be circulated into the train but, as there is a general problem with heat in the stations and tunnels generally, it wouldn't help too much.

What is needed is some system to remove the heat from the tunnels and disperse it to the open air. That is much easier in the case of the sub-surface lines as these have much more air space generally and several sections that are not roofed in.
True but it helps the air circulate more into carriages while the train is moving.
That does cool people down because it carries heat away from them, just like if you stand in front of a fan. The fan doesn't cool the air it just creates windchill. But yes its not a solution to the actually problem of heat in the system.
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Old March 30th, 2008, 01:40 AM   #693
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Anyone that has been on LU in the summer will appreciate this.



The Piccadilly line shares tracks with the District line between Acton Town and just north of Ealing Common station, only on the Uxbridge branch. I've witnessed the Piccadilly line stopping in the District line platforms at Acton Town, but I don't think they're timetabled to do so. The Piccadilly line stops at Turnham Green early mornings and late evenings, but never stops at Chiswick Park, there aren't even platforms for it!
They stop pn the same platforms as the District line.
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Old March 30th, 2008, 02:16 AM   #694
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They stop pn the same platforms as the District line.
At which station?
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Old March 31st, 2008, 01:09 PM   #695
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acemcbuller View Post
True but it helps the air circulate more into carriages while the train is moving.
That does cool people down because it carries heat away from them, just like if you stand in front of a fan. The fan doesn't cool the air it just creates windchill. But yes its not a solution to the actually problem of heat in the system.
Better ventilation - or fans - make substantial differences to the comfort of a ride. Beijing's line 1 has fans on the carriage ceilings that really help to cool you down.

Unfortunately I think our trains are too small to do this... that said, there are suppose to be fans on the Victoria and Pic lines - but I never feel anything from them on these trains
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Old March 31st, 2008, 03:30 PM   #696
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acemcbuller View Post
True but it helps the air circulate more into carriages while the train is moving.
That does cool people down because it carries heat away from them, just like if you stand in front of a fan. The fan doesn't cool the air it just creates windchill. But yes its not a solution to the actually problem of heat in the system.
I started using the tube again last summer after having not used it much at all for several years. It definitely seems much warmer than it was back in the late 90s. In the summer months, even when a train was not particularly crowded it could be uncomfortably hot on the Victoria Line.

Any increase in train length, frequency or just general passenger load is bound to increase the heat in the tunnels. In the medium to long term, an air conditioning solution will probably be the only answer coupled with extraction of hot tunnel air.
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Old April 2nd, 2008, 06:53 PM   #697
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I used the tube a whole lot during my recent trip to London. My goodness, how it drove me insane! Trains keeping their doors open for forever when coming to a station, trains stopping all the time in tunnels, ghetto trains many of which can barely hold tall people, slow-moving trains, sometimes huge distances up and down stairs and walkways to connect between lines at what is called the same station, unreliable time estimates if there are even any, confusing use of platforms, rarely ever good service on all lines at once, short operation hours, frequent closures, handicap-unfriendly, stations that seem a bit useless given that they are only used during certain parts of the day or week... gahhh!!

Of course I understand that many of these problems is due to the fact that the London system is so old, and I doubt that the systems in places like New York and Chicago are much better. A lot could be fixed and improved, though. But even as just as a tourist for three days, these things were driving me insane and were virtually ruining the trip for me (given how much I had to use the tube). I've been too spoiled by the Stockholm system.
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Old April 2nd, 2008, 10:16 PM   #698
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan1113 View Post
I used the tube a whole lot during my recent trip to London. My goodness, how it drove me insane! Trains keeping their doors open for forever when coming to a station, trains stopping all the time in tunnels, ghetto trains many of which can barely hold tall people, slow-moving trains, sometimes huge distances up and down stairs and walkways to connect between lines at what is called the same station, unreliable time estimates if there are even any, confusing use of platforms, rarely ever good service on all lines at once, short operation hours, frequent closures, handicap-unfriendly, stations that seem a bit useless given that they are only used during certain parts of the day or week... gahhh!!

Of course I understand that many of these problems is due to the fact that the London system is so old, and I doubt that the systems in places like New York and Chicago are much better. A lot could be fixed and improved, though. But even as just as a tourist for three days, these things were driving me insane and were virtually ruining the trip for me (given how much I had to use the tube). I've been too spoiled by the Stockholm system.
When it works, it works well. When it doesn't work, it goes tits up.

I'm sorry you had such a bad experience. Many tourists find the labyrinth and history of the tube a tourist attraction in its own right.
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Old April 2nd, 2008, 10:20 PM   #699
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Trains keeping their doors open for forever when coming to a station, trains stopping all the time in tunnels
I take it you used the Circle/District lines a lot?

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sometimes huge distances up and down stairs and walkways to connect between lines at what is called the same station,
Where? It's never seemed particularly bad to me.

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confusing use of platforms
How can the use of platforms be confusing? Do you think it would be less confusing if there were no platforms or something?

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Originally Posted by Dan1113 View Post
short operation hours
Doesn't seem different to any other metro IMO.

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frequent closures
That's to sort out all of the problems that you're whining about

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handicap-unfriendly
Same in practically all other big city metros.

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stations that seem a bit useless given that they are only used during certain parts of the day or week... gahhh!!
Which in Central London?
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Old April 3rd, 2008, 12:27 AM   #700
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Comments in red.

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Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
I take it you used the Circle/District lines a lot?

Yes... my hotel was right near High Street Kensington, which is serviced by these two lines, so I used them the most. I tried virtually all the other lines at least a couple times though, particularly the Piccadilly line. I think I only didn't go on a couple. The District line in particular though seems to be pretty large, so I don't think it's ok for it to be like this on any line.


Where? It's never seemed particularly bad to me.

Charion's Cross comes to mind. Seemed like it was shorter to walk to the next station where the other line was then transferring there.

How can the use of platforms be confusing? Do you think it would be less confusing if there were no platforms or something?

Well, maybe it was just because of the problems on the district line a few days ago (I was there over the weekend), but there were pretty much no trains going to High Street Kensington from Earl's Court whereas there were plenty of other District lines going elsewhere... and to make things all the more confusing, the trains weren't really running from the platforms they were supposed to, so the one train that did go to HSK I missed. At least at Earl's Court, I found the signage about which trains leave from where to be pretty confusing.

Doesn't seem different to any other metro IMO.

Well my main experience at least is from the Stockholm metro. Open till 1 am, open till 3.30 am on weekends. Starting this summer it'll be going 24/7 on weekends -- which is the total opposite than the London one, which seems to go worse on weekends. I find this odd given the number of people who party on weekends and thus need a way to get home. I find it especially odd that I am able to get back home using the a commuter train line here later than one is able to take the tube home (my last train on weekdays is at 12.50, 1.20 on weekends with an extra departure to be added this summer). Given that Stockholm is very small compared to the London metro (and thus the amount of people that need to get around late at night), it just seemed really shocking to me. It limited how late I (and my friend from London) were able to stay out.

That's to sort out all of the problems that you're whining about

Touché. Doesn't seem to be improving too much though. New trains wouldn't hurt either...even the new trains that have been purchased seem a little ghetto, to be honest, but this is more of a personal opinion.

Same in practically all other big city metros.

Sure. IMO I find it a huge shame though, and I wish every metro fixed this. Here in Stockholm the whole system should be fully accessible by 2010 -- thankfully already now virtually all stations have both elevators and escalators, and the steps to the trains are pretty small. The same goes for the commuter trains.

Which in Central London?

None, but it seemed strange nonetheless. It would be a bit useless to me to have a metro station near where I live but one that I can only use on weekdays, or only during rush hours, etc.
Please don't get me wrong - I love London and have nothing against the city. It was just the underground that drove me a bit insane. I also admire that London was pretty much the first to get a metro system, so obviously given its age I fully understand many of the problems and the need to close to renovate/fix things a lot. A lot of it seems to be fixable/avoidable, though.
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