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Old February 21st, 2011, 07:20 AM   #1801
iampuking
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Video showing the decreased journey times with ATO on the Jubilee line.



And likewise for the Victoria line (but instead because of new trains).


Last edited by iampuking; February 23rd, 2011 at 05:50 AM.
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Old February 21st, 2011, 08:02 PM   #1802
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How much did capacity change in the Victoria line?
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Old February 21st, 2011, 11:09 PM   #1803
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Video showing the increased journey times with ATO on the Jubilee line.
Why have journey times increased?
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Old February 22nd, 2011, 04:23 AM   #1804
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Faster speeds between the stations.

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Originally Posted by PortoNuts
How much did capacity change in the Victoria line?
The old 67TS trains are still running, they will all be gone by summer. Therefore the new timetable hasn't come into fore.
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Old February 22nd, 2011, 01:02 PM   #1805
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Quote:
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Faster speeds between the stations.
Then I suppose you mean journey times have decreased right?
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Old February 22nd, 2011, 02:24 PM   #1806
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Maybe he meant "improved".
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Old February 22nd, 2011, 02:49 PM   #1807
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Why have journey times increased?
The trains seems to be travelling a lot slower between stations these days and they often stop just short of stations for up to 30 seconds, in what appears to be delays caused by singnalling issues.....
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Old February 23rd, 2011, 05:49 AM   #1808
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Quote:
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Then I suppose you mean journey times have decreased right?
Oops just noticed the typo... I didn't know whether to write "increased train performance" or "decreased journey times", looks like I just went for half of each.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Face81
The trains seems to be travelling a lot slower between stations these days and they often stop just short of stations for up to 30 seconds, in what appears to be delays caused by singnalling issues.....
If you're referring to the Victoria line than that is because of the increased performance of the 09 Stock. If there is an old, slower 67 Stock then the 09 will catch up with it and then crawl slowly behind it. This issue was solved on the Metropolitan line by 'capping' the performance of the new S Stock to match the A Stock. Once all the 67TS are retired then we'll see better journey times.
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Old February 23rd, 2011, 01:05 PM   #1809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
If you're referring to the Victoria line than that is because of the increased performance of the 09 Stock. If there is an old, slower 67 Stock then the 09 will catch up with it and then crawl slowly behind it. This issue was solved on the Metropolitan line by 'capping' the performance of the new S Stock to match the A Stock. Once all the 67TS are retired then we'll see better journey times.
I was referring to the Jubilee Line, actually.... It really does seem to be getting worse and commute times are so variable! Somedays it takes 17 minutes to get home, while other days it can take as long as 25 minutes - these are ofcourse optimal travel times, when there are no delays of any sort, i.e., no fires, power failures, defective trains, crowed platforms, etc etc etc.

Like all other commuters in London, it's the bain of my life!
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Old February 23rd, 2011, 10:14 PM   #1810
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The Jubilee Line is still under a huge resignalling process so no wonder delays might happen.
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Old February 23rd, 2011, 10:21 PM   #1811
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Quote:
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Somedays it takes 17 minutes to get home, while other days it can take as long as 25 minutes
oh dear....a whole 8 extra minutes, what a catastrophe....
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Old February 24th, 2011, 03:51 AM   #1812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Face81 View Post
I was referring to the Jubilee Line, actually.... It really does seem to be getting worse and commute times are so variable! Somedays it takes 17 minutes to get home, while other days it can take as long as 25 minutes - these are ofcourse optimal travel times, when there are no delays of any sort, i.e., no fires, power failures, defective trains, crowed platforms, etc etc etc.

Like all other commuters in London, it's the bain of my life!
Well the Jubilee line is the line that I use the most often, and I haven't noticed bad service recently, so you're either:

a) unlucky
b) exaggerating
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Old February 24th, 2011, 11:17 AM   #1813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PortoNuts View Post
The Jubilee Line is still under a huge resignalling process so no wonder delays might happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Well the Jubilee line is the line that I use the most often, and I haven't noticed bad service recently, so you're either:

a) unlucky
b) exaggerating
Nope, there are still some major signalling issues! This morning it stopped short of the platform at Waterloo and we were told we would have to wait until the train was reset and moved forward. It took about 10-15 minutes before anything happened. Needless to say I was late to work this morning.
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Old February 24th, 2011, 02:52 PM   #1814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Oops just noticed the typo... I didn't know whether to write "increased train performance" or "decreased journey times", looks like I just went for half of each.



If you're referring to the Victoria line than that is because of the increased performance of the 09 Stock. If there is an old, slower 67 Stock then the 09 will catch up with it and then crawl slowly behind it. This issue was solved on the Metropolitan line by 'capping' the performance of the new S Stock to match the A Stock. Once all the 67TS are retired then we'll see better journey times.
I'm under the impression that both Vic and Jub timetables haven't changed yet, as the Victoria line doesn't have all it's rolling stock and the Jubilee signalling isn't finished all the way to Stanmore (and what is finished isn't working very well).

Journey times should be exactly the same until new timetables are introduced. The trains might accelerate harder but they'll be fixed to the same average speeds.

There's been plenty of problems on the jubilee: I get text alerts and at 8.15 each morning there were delays (or worse) reported on the 17th, 14th, 7th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, of Feb, and the 27th, 26th, 25th, 24th, 21st, 18th, 11th, 7th and 4th of Jan.

How you experience delays depends where you are, at stratford southbound you'd often barely notice. At London Bridge eastbound even a four minute gap can cause queues on the platforms.
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Old February 25th, 2011, 04:25 PM   #1815
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See, I told you

Quote:
Jubilee line a disgrace for the misery it causes commuters, says MP
Miranda Bryant
24 Feb 2011



An MP has become the latest commuter to criticise the Jubilee line for its weekend closures and signal problems, branding it a "disgrace to London".

Former Croydon MP David Winnick said the line, which connects north London to Canary Wharf, had become so bad it has superseded the Northern as "the new misery line".

Mr Winnick, now Labour MP for Walsall North, uses the line on the journey from his constituency in the Midlands to the Houses of Parliament.

He said: "It is frequently delayed during the day which is why it has become the new misery line. There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the Tube daily to get to work and have no alternative who are constantly being held up.

"It's not occasionally, it's every single day. It's such an acute problem that you would've thought it was something that the Mayor would do something about, but he hasn't. It's a disgrace to London."


Many other commuters have written to the Evening Standard's letters page venting their frustration about the line. Last week three trains broke down during the morning peak. Figures published by the Standard revealed that the Jubilee line, which only opened fully in 1999 with a £3.5 billion extension, was disrupted by planned engineering works on 615 days up until the weekend of 25/26 September - not including repeated signal failures.

Transport for London said it had been working "day and night" to complete an upgrade on the line since it acquired failing maintenance company Tube Lines last summer. A TfL spokeswoman said: "We inherited a project in disarray, but in a few short months have ensured that the new automatic signalling system is now in use on much of the Jubilee line, with all trains on the line using it during passenger service.

"Significant progress has been made and the upgrade is on-track to be completed in spring this year."


Source
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Old February 25th, 2011, 07:34 PM   #1816
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My nearest station features the jubilee line and it is still definitely a problem.

Tbf, there really isn't much Tfl can do. They inherited a project in total disarray and have just had to finish the job as best they could and as quickly as they could. It is the same with the Victoria line, where the stock and signaling upgrades were all began by a private firm. Tfl probably wouldn't have chosen that stock. All areas which haven't yet started (upgrades to the Northern Line, new stock for the Piccadilly line, etc) went straight under review once Tfl took over, hence why the northern line's weekend closures were cancelled. The SSL are reportedly having a different approach to their signal replacement which won't involve weekend closures (metronet's plan did). The original new stock design for the Piccadilly has been shelved. I also think Tfl are considering block closures to save money and speed up works.

The PPP upgrade will go down as one of the worst examples of a transportation development framework anywhere. It has been a total disaster from the start: delayed for several years because the mayor knew how crap it was; one company collapsing and another bought out because they were so shit, with taxpayers footing a bill close to a billion (absorbing liabilities); huge delays and overruns (esp. re. the upgrade of stations); poor and shoddy (jub line) work; 100s of millions wasted on legal, consultation and accounting fees; a bigger bill in the end (alternative proposed by the mayor was a bond scheme which it was argued would result in costs of almost £100m less per year. Considering this is a project that is 15 years or so in length that is a huge amount).
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Old February 26th, 2011, 06:48 AM   #1817
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Teething problems. I believe the Central line had similar issues when it first began working under ATO. Also the Piccadilly lines 73TS did too, now they're among the most reliable trains on LU.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lasdun View Post
I'm under the impression that both Vic and Jub timetables haven't changed yet, as the Victoria line doesn't have all it's rolling stock and the Jubilee signalling isn't finished all the way to Stanmore (and what is finished isn't working very well).
I know this, if it's such a problem for you, consider my videos under the banner "increased train performance". That does account for the difference.
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Old February 26th, 2011, 04:10 PM   #1818
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The Jubilee Line delays have been explained here numerous times, I don't know why so much surprise from Face81.
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Old February 27th, 2011, 04:00 PM   #1819
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Old February 27th, 2011, 09:29 PM   #1820
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