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Old November 11th, 2013, 07:37 PM   #141
Ruston
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A note about Venessian language (also here debate about spelling , some opt for "Venexian" ) : it is a so strong identity factor that is really possible to localize the speaker from the way of speaking , at least in discerning main insular venetians from Burano, Murano , Malamocco / Lido and Mestre Marghera.

Another note for bridges -

image hosted on flickr

The shops on top of Rialto bridge have not just a commercial function , their weight contribute to stabilize the arch shoulders , that in a very difficult place to build like Venice its a vital requirement.
Calatrava didn't want to learn this lesson , and we are obliged to re-set the new bridge with hydraulic jacks every few months.
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Old November 13th, 2013, 09:52 PM   #142
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News and correction

I have some news and correction to make

Ponte della Costituzione (Calatrava)

Today the trial against Calatrava should have begun. Since our justice system is a complete shit, it was postponed to 13 November 2014 due to the failure to notify the date of the first meeting to the lawyers.

As for the bridge itself, the problems with the design resulted in a very high cost of manteinance, as pointed out by Ruston. The cable-car was inaugurated by a young mom with her baby 2 days ago, and it will cost 50,000 € for the next 6 months.
It's remote controlled, and takes more than 7 minutes to cross the canal. Therefore it's almost useless, as the right solution was to think of the mobility of the disabled during the design of the bridge, not after.

Update: I've changed the picture of the lower part of the bridge with a better one, showing the cable car. See the post here

Venetian language and the city of Trieste

As pointed out by the user A l e x (who should write here as well, come on! ), the city of Trieste has never been under Venetian domain. They speak Triestino, which is a variety of Venetian, but they've been a free city under Austrian influence. This influence became very strong in the 18th century, when the city grew as a port and had a large immigration from Venetian domains. That's when Venetian language became very common together with Italian, with large minorities speaking Slovenian and German.

You can easily notice the Austrian influence on the architecture of the city this is Piazza UnitÓ d'Italia (Italian Unity Square) in Trieste, facing the sea.

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Trieste piazza unitÓ 2 di Evujw, su Flickr

Here's the updated post

Sports palace


I've finally been able to find a picture of the only slice of it which can be seen fron the South Bank of Venice. So I've added it to the post.

It's a short glimpse when you're moving by boat, or walking on the nearby bridge. Here's the updated post with the picture
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Old November 13th, 2013, 10:32 PM   #143
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Sestieri: Cannaregio III - Moorish/Moreans area

The second Fondamenta changes 3 names as well: de l'Abbazia (of the [Mercy] Abbey), dei Mori (of the Moorish) and de la Sensa (Ascension, a very important feast for Venice).

Fondamenta de l'Abazia is actually a porch inside Scuola Vecchia di Santa Maria della Misericordia (Old School of Saint Mary of the Mercy). This is the older part of the complex of Misericordia, and I'll talk about it and the nearby church in a future post

This is a great picture, showing the Old School with the Fondamenta inside the porch on the left. The building on the right is the Church of the Abbey, and the square (Campo de l'Abazia) is one of the very few squares in Venice which have kept the ancient red fired bricks pavement, arranged like a fish spine (a spina di pesce).

image hosted on flickr

Venice / Venezia / Venedig di jurip, su Flickr

This street goes on with a bridge facing one of the six remaining Squeri in Venice. A Squero is a tiny boatyard with an inclined plane (to take the boats out of the water), and a Tesa (wooden building to repair boats from the rain while working on them).

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Venice 2008 391 di dvdbramhall, su Flickr

But the most interesting and misterious place is definitely Campo dei Mori (Square of the Moorish), a small square on Fondamenta dei Mori.
The history of this place is very mysterious and filled with legends, but apparently the Moorish were actually three Greek brothers of the family Mastelli, moving away from the region of Morea as it had been invaded by the Turkish (hence Mori would mean Moreans, not Moorish).
The 3 merchants, called Rioba, Sandi and Afani, came to Venice in 1112 and built the entire group of houses on the square. At the base of these buildings there are 3 marble statues representing the three brothers. There's also a fourth one around the corner, but it's unclear what it represents: it's probably their servant

Legend says that the merchants were turned into statues because of their greed, after trying to deceive a woman into buying some low-quality silk tissues at a very high price

The most famous of these statues is Rioba: in the 19th century it became very common to attach satyrical paper messages to it, like if they had been written by the statue itself.
Rioba has a huge and ridiculous iron nose which replaces the original, probably broken during the uprisings against the Austrians in 1848.
Rioba's head was vandalized in 2010, removed and thrown into the canal, with no particular reason. Luckily it was found a few days later, repaired and put back in its place.

Here are the statues. I can only recognise Rioba from the iron nose

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Venezia 2007 065 copy di likamccuntz, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Campo dei Mori (Venise) di dalbera, su Flickr

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Campo dei Mori (Venise) di dalbera, su Flickr

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Campo dei Mori (Venise) di dalbera, su Flickr

Owned by the family Mastelli, who are the descendants of Rioba, Sandi and Afani, Palazzo Mastelli o del Cammello (Camel) is a very beautiful building facing the third Fondamenta. The family name may come from the Venetian word mastŔo (basin, washbowl), used to indicate that they were so rich that they filled many mastŔi with money!

There's a bas-relief of a servant with a camel on the fašade of Casa del Cammello, who could be the same guy on the 4th statue. The camel definitely shows the multi-ethnicity of ancient Venice, where commerce made every culture meet each other.
You can also see the different styles of the fašade: the lower were renewed in the Renaissance, whereas the upper floors are Gothic.

image hosted on flickr

Venezia - Sestiere di Cannaregio di fulvio timossi, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Cammello di Gianluca Damante, su Flickr

Here's Campo dei Mori (Square of the Moorish/Moreans). The statues are just outside the picture, on the right corner.

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Campo dei Mori di Sparky the Neon Cat, su Flickr

This is a general streetscape of the Fondamenta and canal. You can notice that this area is definitely non-touristic and peaceful

image hosted on flickr

Rio della Sensa di albireo2006, su Flickr

Unfortunately the street ends with some houses apparently from the '50s and '60s... They don't look nice at all.

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Venice di GwenaŰl Piaser, su Flickr

The third fondamenta on the next post
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Last edited by Jasper90; November 16th, 2013 at 02:31 AM. Reason: Added title
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Old November 13th, 2013, 10:39 PM   #144
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I love venice!!!
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Old November 13th, 2013, 10:52 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper90 View Post

This is a great picture, showing the Old School with the Fondamenta inside the porch on the left. The building on the right is the Church of the Abbey, and the square (Campo de l'Abazia) is one of the very few squares in Venice which have kept the ancient red fired bricks pavement, arranged like a fish spine (a spina di pesce).

image hosted on flickr

Venice / Venezia / Venedig di jurip, su Flickr
)
What a charming square.
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Old November 14th, 2013, 05:37 PM   #146
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Guys, there's HUGE news!!!
Google Streetview has finally arrived in Venice!!! It's going to be extremely helpful.

They've done a great job, as they have mapped both the canals and the streets. They've also reached every important island! And they've travelled a little through the lagoon, for example from Venice to the airport
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Old November 16th, 2013, 05:37 AM   #147
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Sestieri: Cannaregio IV - Madonna dell'Orto and Sant'Alvise

The third, shorter Fondamenta, which is interrupted by the convent of Canossian Daughters of Charity, has 3 names too: Fondamenta Gasparo Contarini (a Venetian cardinal and ambassador), de la Madonna dell'Orto (from the name of the church which lies there) and dei Riformati (of the Reformed Franciscans).

Since this street is divided in two parts and very peripheric to the city, it's usually very peaceful and quiet.
The street begins just after this arch and bridge, on the left. To the right there's Sacca della Misericordia, a large dock where boats and water-taxis are parked. A Sacca is a gulf in the lagoon, which was generally used as a dump site for excavation ground and demolition waste until it became a new island.
However, Sacca della Misericordia was never filled with ground, and remained as a dock. Obviously, nowadays you can't just throw bricks from demolition into the water like they used to do until the '70s

Here's the arch:

image hosted on flickr

Arco di Sockrates 1984, su Flickr

This is Sacca della Misericordia, as seen from the bridge on the previous picture when looking right. The island on the right on the background is San Michele, the city's cemetery, whereas the other island on the left is Murano.
Here's the Streetview link. I'm a little ashamed to share it as the first thing you can see when turning around are unlicensed street sellers, hiding from the police http://goo.gl/maps/96o47

image hosted on flickr

sacca della misericordia di flipflopblog, su Flickr

The street goes on with a few very beautiful buildings, some of which need to be restored

image hosted on flickr

fondamenta Gasparo Contarini di ValeryToth, su Flickr

Until you get to the magnificent Chiesa della Madonna dell'Orto (Church of Mother Mary of the "vegetable garden").

It's one of the best examples of Venetian Gothic in the entire city. It was built at the half of the 14th century by the congregation of the Umiliati (humbled) and was first dedicated to Saint Christopher, the protector of travellers and shippers, since it's located in an area which was very crucial for exchange (as testified by the mix of cultures you can find, see previous post).
However, the current name refers to a statue of Mother Mary which was built by Giovanni De Santi for the church. While the statue was temporarily left in De Santi's vegetable garden waiting to be completed, it was seen glowing in the dark of the night. This sparked the belief that this statue could make miracles, and so Venice bishop decided that the statue had to be transferred inside the church, in order to avoid improper worship. Hence the origin of the name, from the statue of Mother Mary kept in the vegetable garden

The fašade is dated 1460-1464, while the statues are nearly contemporary to the belltower (which is from 1503). The square in front of the church is another very rare example of "fish-spine" fired bricks pavement in Venice, similar to the one in Campo de l'Abazia (previous post).

I think the Moorish influence is easily recognisable at first sight on the belltower!

Here's Streetview: http://goo.gl/maps/Qb1cX



Detail of the belltower



And this is the famous Mother Mary statue of the miracles

image hosted on flickr

Madonna dell'Orto di Elisa ... my colours, su Flickr



The other segment of the street, called Fondamenta dei Riformati, begins with Campo Sant'Alvise. It's a Venetian-only name, deriving from Louis and its latinizations Ludovicus and Aloisius.

The square takes its name from the omonymous church, built by the noble woman Antonia Venier in 1388 in honour of Saint Ludovicus (Alvise) from Toulouse, who had appeared in her dream and told her the location where to build the church.
A few years later the community was about to be extinguished, when suddenly in 1411 many Augustinian female monks arrived from Serravalle (the historical centre of the current city of Vittorio Veneto, 80 km north of Venice). They built the Church and the Augustinian Convent altogether in 1430, giving them the current Gothic appearance.

However, in the 17th and 18th century the interior of the church was heavily modified with Baroque taste. The huge fresco on the ceiling of the church, painted in 1678, forced to raise the lateral walls, also changing the exterior and leading to the bizarre fašade with the Gothic roof slopes interrupted by the horizontal ceiling!

Here's the Streetview link: http://goo.gl/maps/aLNKX

image hosted on flickr

chiesa Sant'Alvise di ValeryToth, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

L1100045 di Darren and Brad, su Flickr

The Augustinian Monastery (on the first picture on the right) was taken on by the Canossian Daughters of Charity at the beginning of the 19th century. From 1843 they ran a school for "deaf-mute" girls, which moved to a larger location in the mainland in 1909. At present day, this building hosts a nursery school and a centre for the elderly.

One of the two cloisters is perfectly unaltered (including the famous "fish-spine" red fired-bricks pavement and a wellhead), even though it definitely needs to be restored.

The first picture is taken from inside the nursery school, whereas the second one shows the cloister better. You can also see the gothic belltower.
You can find a lot more pictures here: http://bluoscar.blogspot.it/2013/04/...o-di-sant.html






Sant'Alvise is a very residential and peaceful area. However, behind the square, there are also a swimming pool, two basketball courts and a football court

image hosted on flickr

Quartier "Cannaregio" di brigeham34, su Flickr

I just wish to share this streetview sight with you: it's the perfectly peaceful waterbus stop, on the north side of the lagoon http://goo.gl/maps/JhSer
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Old November 17th, 2013, 07:56 AM   #148
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Sestieri: Cannaregio V - Fondamente Nove and Gesuiti

Let's finally finish with Cannaregio!!!

Today we're talking about Fondamente Nove (New foundations). It's a street running for 1 km on the north bank of Venice, and it was built in the 16th century. The project is unfinished on both directions.

I like the north bank of Venice because it's always dark and windy, since it's exposed in the opposite direction of the sun. The main feature of Fondamente Nove is the sight towards the islands of Murano and San Michele (Cemetery), and the waterbus stop for public service to the Northern Lagoon destinations (Murano, Burano, Torcello, Sant'Erasmo, Vignole, Treporti and Airport).

Let's begin this journey, from west to east
The street begins from Sacca della Misericordia, the dock which should have been filled with ground in order to continue the street. More information on Sacca della Misericordia on the previous post. On the other side of Sacca, there's a house in the corner called Casin dei Spiriti (little house of the spirits).
The house is said to be the home of all the troubled spirits of the city, probably due to its isolated setting and to the sinister noises of the wind and waves during the winter. This belief grew a lot in the '50s when a prostitute was killed, and her murderers confessed and admitted cutting her body in pieces.
A few months later, while some guys were swimming close to Casin dei Spiriti, they found a chest floating in the water, covered with algae and crabs. When they opened it, hoping to find some kind of treasure, they actually found the remains of the dead body of the girl.

Here's the streetview link: http://goo.gl/maps/fdEzw

image hosted on flickr

Casino degli Spiriti, Cannaregio, Venise di HervÚ D., su Flickr

The street itself is somehow the back-door of the city: in fact it hosts a petrol station for boats and a depot for public transport boats. The eastern part of this street is in Sestiere Castello, and hosts the back of the hospital with the emergency room, and the depot for boat ambulances. See here for a post on the hospital.

image hosted on flickr

Gas station on the Fondamente Nove di APIstudyabroad, su Flickr

This is a sight of Fondamente Nove, with the nearby church of Gesuiti and St Mark's belltower on the background, which looks close but is actually 20 minutes' walk away from Gesuiti!

image hosted on flickr

Fondamente Nuove / I Gesuiti di Ben Morlok, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

VENICE di patstmand, su Flickr

When the air is very clear, you can even see the mountains from Fondamente Nove! They're about 100 km away. The grey building on the background is the airport. Here's another picture of the mountains http://flic.kr/p/bhxno6

image hosted on flickr

Waterways di PaulST1, su Flickr

Very close to Fondamente Nove, there's Campo dei Gesuiti (Jesuits square). The name comes from the church of Santa Maria Assunta dei Gesuiti, built around the half of the 12th century but replaced with the current Baroque church in 1715-1728.
This church is huge: you can see the statues on top from many angles of Cannaregio, as they're higher than the surrounding buildings.
The interior is extremely decorated and coloured, as with Baroque fashion.

image hosted on flickr

Venice, Chiesa dei Gesuiti di barnyz, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Gesuiti church di mark.hogan, su Flickr

image hosted on flickr

Chiesa dei gesuiti, Venice di Digitaler Lumpensammler, su Flickr

This is a picture of Campo dei Gesuiti. The building on the right is former Convent of the Crucifers, then transformed into barracks and then abandoned as you can see from the walled windows in the picture.
However, after decades of abandonment, the convent was finally transformed into a University students' residence which opened a few months ago

You can make a comparison with this painting from Canaletto from around 1750: very little has changed

Here's the Streetview link: http://goo.gl/maps/noNU3





Our journey through Cananregio ends here. I hope you've enjoyed it!
Do I post too many pictures? Are they too large or heavy to download? Do you have any comments, suggestions or questions? Please let me know!!!
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Old November 20th, 2013, 12:55 AM   #149
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Cuisine: introduction

Following Feo's advice, I've decided to leave the description of the remaining Sestieri for the future, and write a little about Venetian cuisine.

A typical Italian meal at the restaurant is divided in the following courses, with the following order:
- Antipasto (appetizer, entrÚe): smaller and elaborate portions of food, or a selection of different foods arranged together on a plate
- Primo piatto (starter, first course) is usually pasta, rice-based dish or a soup
- Secondo piatto (main "second" course) is usually grilled or fried meat, fish or eggs.
- Contorno (side dish) usually comes with the main course, and it's usually some kind of vegetables, potatoes or mushrooms.
- Dessert
- Coffee or amaro (it's a bitter-sweet herbal liqueur)

Venetian traditional cuisine usually has very large Antipasti, and it's almost entirely based on fish and a lot of seafood. On the other side, beef and pork meat is scarcely present.

Over the next posts, I'll try to go into detail about Venetian cuisine, including all the "strange" seafood that we eat
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Old November 20th, 2013, 01:13 AM   #150
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Cuisine: Spaghetti with cuttlefish ink

The most famous Venetian Primo piatto is probably Spaghetti in nero di seppia (Spaghetti with the black ink from cuttlefish)

They're quite simple, as you just need to cook the cuttlefish on a frying pan, add some white wine and the black ink and then mix it with the spaghetti. The result is completely black, and can potentially stain your clothes if you drop spaghetti on yourself

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Spaghetti in nero di ZeroVisibility, su Flickr

However, as I said before, the most important part of Venetian cuisine are the various types of seafood that we eat. I'll go into detail in the next posts.
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Old November 20th, 2013, 01:57 AM   #151
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Cuisine: crabs

MoÚche are the green crabs (scientific name: carcinus mediterraneus) caught while they're changing their shell. Since they have no shell, they're very tender and can be fried and eaten as a whole, without removing any part. They're small, as their diameter is about 4 cm.

Since the moulting happens in Spring and Fall, moÚche can only be eaten in two periods of the year!

These are moÚche before cooking

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moeche di hidden side, su Flickr

And these are cooked moÚche (here's a better picture: http://flic.kr/p/4wNQcj )

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Moeche di Buauro, su Flickr

Mazanete are female green crabs just like moÚche, but after the summer when they have a shell and the so-called "corallo". Coral are the red eggs before they are laid.
Mazanete are incredibly hard to prepare, as you need to remove the exterior shell while leaving the inside intact. They're usually boiled and seasoned with olive oil and parsley.

image hosted on flickr

masanete www.prolocovillaorba.it di Mondo del Gusto - EAT, su Flickr

Another kind of crab we eat is called Granseola (European spider crab, latin name: Maja squinado). These crabs are very large (12-15 cm diameter, excluding the legs) and they're usually just boiled and eaten. The inside is white with some red parts (coral, eggs) and it's very delicate

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Capodanno 2008 di costellazione del toro, su Flickr

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Granseola, c'Ŕ gente che viene dall'altro capo del mondo per assaggiare quella che fanno qui! #venezia #restaurants #venice #fish #buonacucina #nightlifeinvenice di veneziadavivere, su Flickr
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Old November 21st, 2013, 01:33 AM   #152
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A real Venessian habit



When you pass on this bridge, you will often hear a metallic noise , a "clang"



Are the venessian that touch these old hooks fixed on house corner pillar for good luck

These Hooks were used for hanging pieces (Literally!) of human corpses after the executions by quartering under Venetian Republic, after the capital execution in San Marco square - between the two columns, each piece was hanged to the "city gates" - in this case the "Traghetto di Murano" the north side approach.

Pics by streetview
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Old November 25th, 2013, 07:10 PM   #153
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Those areas of Cannareggio are probably seen by less than 10% of all tourists in Venice

And then they all complain Venice is crowded...
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Old November 26th, 2013, 08:44 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddard Stark View Post
Those areas of Cannareggio are probably seen by less than 10% of all tourists in Venice

And then they all complain Venice is crowded...
I think it's good that these areas don't receive many visitors, so that Venice can have some quiet and untouristic areas. They're visited by the most adventurous and curious tourists, who are also the ones with great respect for the city.

Unfortunately a lot of tourists come to Venice on a one-day visit and so they only visit St Mark's square, only because it's included in their cruise-ship programme, or because they wish to visit the entire Europe in 7 days

So that's the kind of uninformed tourism which crowds the streets, because they don't really know where thet want to go, or what they wish to see. Some of them even take the shuttle bus and spend their days in the hideous cheesy modern Venice-like Noventa shopping mall outside Venice, instead of visiting the actual city!

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DSCN2157 di ciccio luca, su Flickr

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NOVENTA DI PIAVE DESIGNER OUTLET di Florin Noghi, su Flickr

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DSCN2166 di ciccio luca, su Flickr
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Old December 26th, 2013, 04:09 PM   #155
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About venetian Language:
this is a recent song in venetian (rap style) talking about the beauty of the city but also all its big problems

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Old December 29th, 2013, 02:02 PM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper90 View Post
Some of them even take the shuttle bus and spend their days in the hideous cheesy modern Venice-like Noventa shopping mall outside Venice, instead of visiting the actual city!
No, seriously? If I were on an organized Venice tour and they put me into that lousy shopping mall, I would want my money back.

Before getting anywhere close to that damn mall, I'd rather prefer seeing the small historic centre of Mestre.
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Old January 2nd, 2014, 11:55 PM   #157
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Jasper, we are all eager to read your next post about venetian food, or about anything you wish to share!

Sarde in saor, bacalÓ mantecato, carpaccio di branzino...

Also, a few tips on how to avoid crappy touristic restaurants in Venice would be useful for our foreign readers!

Movite dai, che semo drio spetarte!
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Old January 3rd, 2014, 12:15 AM   #158
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Jasper, we are all eager to read your next post about venetian food, or about anything you wish to share! Sarde in saor, bacalÓ mantecato, carpaccio di branzino... Also, a few tips on how to avoid crappy touristic restaurants in Venice would be useful for our foreign readers! Movite dai, che semo drio spetarte!

Thank you a lot!! I promise I'll go back to giving more attention to this thread, especially when I'm not studying for exams at University!!
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Old January 4th, 2014, 09:23 AM   #159
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amazing thread. thank you and Happy New Year.
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Old January 4th, 2014, 11:16 AM   #160
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amazing thread. thank you and Happy New Year.
Thank you very much! Your thread on Warsaw (and Warsaw reconstruction itself) is amazing!


Still on Venetian lamguage and its heritage: let's talk about Mexico and Brasil

At the end of the 19th century, many people emigrated from Veneto to Brazil and Mexico, because our region was very poor.
Very surprisingly, their descendants still speak a dialect of Venetian, with a significant influence from the local language and accent.

There's an entire Youtube channel broadcasting videos in Talian, the Brazilian-Veneto dialect (also called Vŕneto). This language is spoken by up to 1,000,000 people living in Brazilian states of Rio Grande do Sul, Santa Catarina and ParanÓ, and was recently recognized at an official level by some municipalities.
This is a video showing a guy in a radio programme speaking Talian, selling cars and making jokes.



The Mexican-Veneto dialect is spoken by a small group of about 500 people, all living in the town of Chipilo. This is the only video I could find, with a sad poem speaking about Chipilo and the loss of identity and language.



I find these videos very interesting, as I can easily understand everything they're saying (except maybe for 1 or 2 Portuguese loanwords in Talian). I think a Spanish, Portuguese or non-Veneto Italian speaker could understand very little of what they're saying. Am I right?
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