daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Airports and Aviation

Airports and Aviation » Airports | Photos and Videos



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old August 5th, 2007, 05:43 PM   #661
Lee
BANNED
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami
Posts: 1,443
Likes (Received): 15

Quote:
Originally Posted by ailiton View Post
You think labour is cheaper in Japan, Hong Kong, Korea than in Canada?
Yes.
Lee no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old August 5th, 2007, 05:54 PM   #662
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,925
Likes (Received): 18185

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
The Asian sector is also alot more regulated than the US one. This guarantees more profits, and makes it easier for airlines run by the state to succeed. Consider US airlines before deregulation. It was no coincidence that back then they were considered the best in the world.
Depends though, since the 2 best carriers, Cathay Pacific and Singapore Airlines, need to deal with open skies. These markets are pretty much deregulated due to the small local market.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2007, 09:01 PM   #663
Canadian74
Registered User
 
Canadian74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 533
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
DL is installing PTV's on every aircraft, including on domestic planes.
AC is also installing AVOD on every seat on every aircraft with atleast 70 seats (that includes CRJs). No other airline in the world has installed AVOD on CRJs or ERJs.
Canadian74 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2007, 11:55 PM   #664
Lee
BANNED
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami
Posts: 1,443
Likes (Received): 15

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
Depends though, since the 2 best carriers, Cathay Pacific and Singapore Airlines, need to deal with open skies. These markets are pretty much deregulated due to the small local market.
Aren't both financed by the state, and guaranteed routes? Neither has to deal with a cut-through domestic market, which is important.
Lee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 01:09 AM   #665
ailiton
Toffy
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 404
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
Aren't both financed by the state, and guaranteed routes? Neither has to deal with a cut-through domestic market, which is important.
Cathay Pacific is not run by the government. You have asked the same question years ago (and I answered it).
ailiton no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 01:10 AM   #666
ailiton
Toffy
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 404
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
Yes.
The answer is no.
ailiton no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 04:46 AM   #667
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,925
Likes (Received): 18185

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
Aren't both financed by the state, and guaranteed routes? Neither has to deal with a cut-through domestic market, which is important.
Singapore Airlines is owned by the state, while Cathay Pacific is owned by Swire Pacific (40%), a traditional British 'hong' company, CITIC Pacific (17%), and Air China (17%), with shares listed on the local stock exchange.

Unlike Air Canada, Cathay could not rely on government support and regulated markets over the years. The government doesn't subsidize the airline although it is the local flag carrier. Many of the busiest routes Cathay flies to in the region already has a lot of competition, such as Taipei (China Airlines, Thai, EVA), Bangkok (Thai, Air India, Emirates, Kenya Airways, China Airlines, SriLankan, Orient Thai, Ethiopian, PIA, etc.), Tokyo (Japan Air, ANA, Northwest), and Seoul (Korean, Asiana, Thai, Air India).

Hence, a huge portion of the markets Cathay flies to already has a lot of competition - much more than Canada's domestic or international markets. Cathay doesn't have the luxury to face 1 formidable competitor for its short-haul routes.

Internationally, Cathay is subject to a large number of foreign competitors, but the competition is more intense due to the open skies agreements that Hong Kong holds. For example, flying to Europe via the Middle East is now a viable, cheaper, and popular alternative with Emirates and Qatar Airways, in addition to the current choices available (ie. London with British Airways, Virgin, Qantas, Air New Zealand, and Oasis). North America-bound travellers can choose the traditional carriers (ie. Vancouver with Air Canada and Oasis; New York with Continental) flying direct or with connections (ie. Northwest, United).

Although Dragonair is now part of Cathay, there is a lot of competition with lower-cost carriers within Hong Kong and also the cheap mainland carriers as well. There is plenty of competition for the primary cities (ie. Beijing with Air China, China Southern; Shanghai with China Eastern, Shanghai Airlines) and secondary cities (ie. Qingdao with China Eastern, Wuhan with China Southern, Chongqing with Air China, Hong Kong Express, Guilin with Hong Kong Airlines, China Southern, and Hangzhou with Air China, Hong Kong Express, China Eastern).

Thus, Cathay and Dragonair both face quite a lot of competition for its regional and long-haul routes, and without government funding or support other than negotiating open skies agreements, they're on their own to achieve profitability. Furthermore, Cathay was never given a duty to serve the people across a vast, underpopulated country. Hence, if the route is not profitable, they're more than welcome to axe it without political repercussions.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 03:37 PM   #668
Calvin W
Canadian eh!
 
Calvin W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,305
Likes (Received): 366

Yet despite all of this, They are still World class where as Air Canada is little better than Third World.

And People wonder why I choose Cathay over Air Canada.
__________________
Really wish you would stop assuming you speak for everyone. On this forum you only speak for yourself.



zyxwvutsrqponmlkjihgfedcba
Calvin W no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 05:56 PM   #669
Lee
BANNED
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami
Posts: 1,443
Likes (Received): 15

@hksky,

What I do know is that if SQ or CX operated in the US, they wouldn't have the service levesl because they wouldn't afford it.
Lee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2007, 06:36 PM   #670
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,925
Likes (Received): 18185

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
@hksky,

What I do know is that if SQ or CX operated in the US, they wouldn't have the service levesl because they wouldn't afford it.
Of course ... with all the labour costs and unions bickering away, it's a recipe for disaster, as seen by so many bankruptcies lately.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 12:47 AM   #671
Lee
BANNED
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami
Posts: 1,443
Likes (Received): 15

If I were to start a US airlines, I would hire all of my labor abroad from low cost countries. I wonder why US airlines don't do this.
Lee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 01:14 AM   #672
urbanfan89
Registered User
 
urbanfan89's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,502
Likes (Received): 67

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee View Post
If I were to start a US airlines, I would hire all of my labor abroad from low cost countries. I wonder why US airlines don't do this.
You would surely run into piles and piles of red tape from Uncle Sam, forcing you to spend all your money hiring lawyers before any planes get off the ground. Not to mention all the bad press the media and unions would give you.
urbanfan89 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 05:28 AM   #673
isaidso
the new republic
 
isaidso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The United Provinces of America
Posts: 29,754
Likes (Received): 10974

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvin W View Post
Yet despite all of this, They are still World class where as Air Canada is little better than Third World.

And People wonder why I choose Cathay over Air Canada.
Kenya Airways is 3rd world. This comparison is insulting. Amenities, safety record, training of crew, computer based reservation systems, airport lounges, business class, lost baggage rate, on time rate, age of fleet, etc. By almost every measure, and there are tonnes more, Air Canada is a very good airline.

Air Canada is not even close to being "a little better than Third World".

Lee: Airlines don't hire foreign crews at low wages because there are probably laws banning it. Why should you receive low prices off the back of what amounts to slave wages? Hell, why not get rid of wages altogether and we can go back to the days of Gone With the Wind or for that matter, present day, United Arab Emirates. Then we can all live wealthier, just like Scarlett.
isaidso está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 05:35 AM   #674
algonquin
Registered User
 
algonquin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Ontario
Posts: 3,010
Likes (Received): 22

I'm not suprised. My only beef with Air Canada is their cancelation policies, or lack therof. The only reason I ever book with WestJet is when I am unsure of my travelling plans. I find often AC is even cheaper than WestJet. And yes, Porter rocks, and they will fly internationally (to NYC) if they survive.

Air Canada apparently has a history of innovation... they were the first airline in the world to computerize their reservation system, back in the 60's (so I've heard). They have their shit together.

To comment on someone's earlier post, Southwest is pretty awesome too. They are incredibly flexible. I love how seats are first-come, first-serve, like a bus. Sometimes airlines have an overblown idea of what it means to fly. When you fly for your commute, you just don't give a damn... you want things to be easy.
algonquin no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 01:59 PM   #675
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,925
Likes (Received): 18185

Air Canada planes flew less full in July

MONTREAL, Aug 6 (Reuters) - Air Canada said on Monday that its planes flew less full in July as passenger traffic growth lagged the rise in its fleet capacity.

Air Canada, which is the country's dominant airline and is 75 percent owned by ACE Aviation Holdings Inc. , said its mainline system's load factor, a measure of how full its planes flew, fell to 82.5 percent in July from 83.6 percent a year earlier.

The airline's passenger traffic rose 1.3 percent, while fleet capacity rose 2.7 percent.

Air Canada said traffic grew in all markets except on U.S. transborder routes, where it fell 4.8 percent from a year earlier, and the U.K. market was weaker, in part because of higher industry capacity.

At Air Canada's regional carrier Jazz Air , 49 percent held by ACE Aviation, the load factor increased to 74.4 percent from 72.7 percent as passenger traffic rose 8.5 percent and it expanded capacity by 6 percent.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2007, 10:41 PM   #676
Canadian74
Registered User
 
Canadian74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 533
Likes (Received): 1

NYC from Toronto is not really international... This survey included airlines flying trans-atlantic and pacific.

But I agree, Porter is awesome. Business class service for the price of Economy.
Canadian74 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2007, 12:46 AM   #677
isaidso
the new republic
 
isaidso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The United Provinces of America
Posts: 29,754
Likes (Received): 10974

Porter is fantabulous. Something very sexy about taking a ferry to that island airport, taking off with the skyline right next to you, and those retro 1950's uniforms! Everything about that airline is sophisticated, stylish, and seductive.
isaidso está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2007, 08:53 AM   #678
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31

AC is switching off 343s for 777s on their Beijing route by late august? AC32 ticket for August 19th apparently shows 777.
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2007, 05:04 PM   #679
irutavias
cerebral fallout
 
irutavias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 447
Likes (Received): 3

Porter is that good? How many planes do they have? Will the airline survive?
__________________
Incredible!ndia
irutavias no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 8th, 2007, 08:37 PM   #680
Canadian74
Registered User
 
Canadian74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 533
Likes (Received): 1

They have 10 Q400s on order, I think. 5 or 6 have been delivered. 10 more options.
I read a article recently that said they are going to more than double their fleet to 20 or 30 aircraft.

And yes, they are that good.
Canadian74 no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
air canada, canada, north american airlines, star alliance

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium