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Old October 17th, 2014, 06:39 PM   #321
CCs77
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Originally Posted by Ivan the Immigrant View Post
What are they actually building in mid town west side? I still don't get it. Hudson yards, Hudson spire, two towers, some more two towers, different hights, some more towers,...30 hudson yards, 50 hudson yards, some more hudson yards, what are they actually building here...?

The area above th Yards, plus the first block north belong to developer Related, taht is building the Hudson Yards development. The first fase oh Hudson Yards, on the eastern portion of the yards and the first block north, includes 4 office buildings, 10HY, 30HY, 50HY, 55HY and two residential plus the culture sheed. In the second fase, over the western yards, they will build more building, mostly residential.

The five blocks to the north of Related site, the city is building the Hudson Boulevard, a linear park in the middle of those blocks, where different developers than related also will build massive office towers (such as the ex-Hudson Spire, among others, but most haven't been proposed yet)

On the superblock east of the yards, there is another mega-development called Manhattan West. There they are already building another platform above the tracks.


I think it is unlikely that Related will sell the sites to Chase, after all, their business is to build buildings and then sell or rent them. What could happen, if Chase finally goes there, is that Realated completely redesign those buildings according to Chase wishes and needs.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 07:32 PM   #322
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Looking forward to this!
Also if the deal does go ahead, I wonder how long things will take to get off the ground?
Chase lease is up in 2017 at the Park Ave tower. The former Bear Stearns tower located within the Vanderbilt corridor lacks the trading floor space for JPMC, so I would think Chase is looking to close the deal quickly with both Related and the City so they can start. Worst case scenario, Chase moves in the Bear Stearns building as a stop gap until their campus is completed.

Obviously, they plan to consolidate all their operations in NYC in the Hudson Yards for their planned campus to accommodate 16k employees. According to the Post article today, they want to also build an underground passageway to connect both towers but that would require a reconfig of the #7 station.

Although, Chase is asking for a hefty $1B plus concession which it seems initially the city was not interested in doing is apparently having major 2nd thoughts as negotiations has heated up because the city is now seeing the financial benefits it may ultimately reap.

Dimon is one brilliant cookie and I’m sure he can make the city realize his vision and see how much the city can gain from this deal. The benefit for Related would be the selling units of both phase 1 and 2 of the residential projects in the Hudson Yards because that is how they will make money. The benefits would be a buzzing Hudson Yards full of people which I’m sure many of the workers there would consider buying to live there.

I would think if this deal goes through… the current designs for both sites will most definitely be obsolete. I just hope both towers end up taller than the current proposals for their respective sites, which I’m certainly sure it will.

I mean how great of a scenario could this be? One corporation anchoring and taking fully 2 towers in the Yards instead of finding 2 separate anchors to get 2 towers going and fill out the rest of the space. This would certainly fast rack the build out of the Hudson Yards/ Boulevard.

According to the article, they are looking to build to what is equivalent of 2 Empire State Buildings worth of floor space. That is over 5m sf at the same time buying additional developmental rights from the city in order to build these.

Next up!!! Tishman Speyer and 3 Hudson Blvd for News Corp, DB, Saleforce, UBS, Skadden and RL and more to consider.

Finally, I hope it goes like this… News Corp to 2 WTC, Skadden to 3 Hudson Blvd and Salesforce to the Hudson Spire and there is still some corporations out there that we may not be fully aware of looking for large space.

Cheers.
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http://i.imgur.com/FVrYwpy.jpg
(click again once inside to enlarge the map)

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Old October 17th, 2014, 07:55 PM   #323
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Dimon is one brilliant cookie and I’m sure he can make the city realize his vision [...]
Dimon's vision consists of one thing only: maximizing JPM's share price.

The idea of giving an additional $1B in concessions to the nation's biggest bank makes me feel physically ill. I hope there's a more equitable solution.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 08:23 PM   #324
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I mean how great of a scenario could this be? One corporation anchoring and taking fully 2 towers in the Yards instead of finding 2 separate anchors to get 2 towers going and fill out the rest of the space. This would certainly fast rack the build out of the Hudson Yards/ Boulevard.
It's a bank, not a corporation. I know that seems like a silly distinction - I'm basically saying 'it's ebola, not smallpox' - but it's an important one to make because New York is still wrestling with the legacy of the financial meltdown, and when a bank wants a shitload of cash/subsidies to build a new edifice to its own sense of self-importance, it's politically dangerous to be in support. Cuomo might go for it, but the mayor wouldn't. Not without some huge distance placed between him and the deal. It would undermine his whole platform.

Although, saying that: JP Morgan's current headquarters was previously owned by Union Carbide. So if they moved out of there and into the Hudson Yards area, we'd see someone else move in. And going by its history of hosting the world's most deplorable scumbags, it would probably be Comcast that moved in. Or literally Hitler.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 08:35 PM   #325
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And going by its history of hosting the world's most deplorable scumbags, it would probably be Comcast that moved in. Or literally Hitler.
Is Monsanto in the market for some NY office space?
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Old October 17th, 2014, 08:37 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
Chase lease is up in 2017 at the Park Ave tower. The former Bear Stearns tower located within the Vanderbilt corridor lacks the trading floor space for JPMC, so I would think Chase is looking to close the deal quickly with both Related and the City so they can start. Worst case scenario, Chase moves in the Bear Stearns building as a stop gap until their campus is completed.

Obviously, they plan to consolidate all their operations in NYC in the Hudson Yards for their planned campus to accommodate 16k employees. According to the Post article today, they want to also build an underground passageway to connect both towers but that would require a reconfig of the #7 station.

Although, Chase is asking for a hefty $1B plus concession which it seems initially the city was not interested in doing is apparently having major 2nd thoughts as negotiations has heated up because the city is now seeing the financial benefits it may ultimately reap.

Dimon is one brilliant cookie and I’m sure he can make the city realize his vision and see how much the city can gain from this deal. The benefit for Related would be the selling units of both phase 1 and 2 of the residential projects in the Hudson Yards because that is how they will make money. The benefits would be a buzzing Hudson Yards full of people which I’m sure many of the workers there would consider buying to live there.

I would think if this deal goes through… the current designs for both sites will most definitely be obsolete. I just hope both towers end up taller than the current proposals for their respective sites, which I’m certainly sure it will.

I mean how great of a scenario could this be? One corporation anchoring and taking fully 2 towers in the Yards instead of finding 2 separate anchors to get 2 towers going and fill out the rest of the space. This would certainly fast rack the build out of the Hudson Yards/ Boulevard.

According to the article, they are looking to build to what is equivalent of 2 Empire State Buildings worth of floor space. That is over 5m sf at the same time buying additional developmental rights from the city in order to build these.

Next up!!! Tishman Speyer and 3 Hudson Blvd for News Corp, DB, Saleforce, UBS, Skadden and RL and more to consider.

Finally, I hope it goes like this… News Corp to 2 WTC, Skadden to 3 Hudson Blvd and Salesforce to the Hudson Spire and there is still some corporations out there that we may not be fully aware of looking for large space.

Cheers.
I agree, VG. Don't forget about Ralph Lauren and Sitheby's!
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Old October 17th, 2014, 08:53 PM   #327
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It's a bank, not a corporation. I know that seems like a silly distinction - I'm basically saying 'it's ebola, not smallpox
I take offense to that comment.

Why do you compare banks and corporations to two terrible diseases? Banks and corporations help people. They provide loans, GIVE YOU MONEY for keeping your cash with them, and employ tons of people. Corporations employ people and provide products and services that make life easier for all of us.

You sound like you are envious of the people at the top- the Jamie Dimons of the world- who make these banks and corporations tick.

Envy is not a good look on anyone.

Quote:
to build a new edifice to its own sense of self-importance
This is mere gibberish. If JPM wanted to "build an edifice to its own sense of self-importance", it'd be taller than the Burj Khalifa. They are an extremely important company simply looking to house their workers.

Quote:
And going by its history of hosting the world's most deplorable scumbags, it would probably be Comcast that moved in. Or literally Hitler.
Again, I take offense to that. Bankers and corporate types aren't "scumbags." They're trying to make a living like everyone else.

Last edited by The Lion; October 17th, 2014 at 08:58 PM.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 09:20 PM   #328
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JP Morgan Chase has just been defended as 'making life easier for all of us'.

This is the end of civilization.

I can only hope you're old, Lion. If you're under, say, 45, then there is no hope for America.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 09:44 PM   #329
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And going by its history of hosting the world's most deplorable scumbags, it would probably be Comcast that moved in. Or literally Hitler.
I'm not saying your view point is wrong because you may have different experience to hold those views.

I mean maybe you got denied credit to be able to have a dream home, or failed to get a loan for school or maybe you lost your home to foreclosure therefore you blame the banks and you rightfully have strong views towards the banks. Whatever your reasons are, you made ur point and move on.

Just know there are people in here that has very different experiences and may not feel as strongly as you therefore no need to jam it down everyone's throats and offend people unless that is ur true intentions.

Ur point was made very clear and is not really the place to go into a heated debate on it & hijack a thread. There are many forums you can buddy up with the same views as you such as:

occupywsllstreet.org or antiG8.org

Let's just discuss the possibilities for the respective projects. The possibilities for this amazing mega development... The Hudson Yards.

Cheers
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Hudson Yards mega development Map: June 2015
http://i.imgur.com/FVrYwpy.jpg
(click again once inside to enlarge the map)

Last edited by Vertical_Gotham; October 17th, 2014 at 11:44 PM.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 09:49 PM   #330
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According to the Observer, the 2 Hudson Yards sites are already getting aprox $600m in concessions from the city. JPMC is asking for 400m more and so I suspect ultimately the city may give $100m more for each property for a deal that is acceptable for Chase.

You ask for the moon and eventually you end up with a figure you could be happy with.

The Hudson Yards Mega Development would ultimately be full of campuses.

Related Cos, Brookfield Manhattan West, JPMC corporate campus. Lol.

The Hudson Yards would also be massively expensive. I estimate the total cost between the major players between, Related, Brookfield, Tishman Speyer and JPM amounts to an estimated $35 Billion not including 3 HB and all the other smaller projects.

Est. Figures

$20 B | Related Phase 1 & 2
$6.5 B | JPMC Campus (2 towers)
$4.5 B | Brookfield Manhattan West Campus (3 Towers)
$3.2 B | Hudson Spire (1 Tower)

Unverified and not included in est. figure.

$3B | McCourt/ Hines (1 Tower)
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Hudson Yards mega development Map: June 2015
http://i.imgur.com/FVrYwpy.jpg
(click again once inside to enlarge the map)
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Old October 17th, 2014, 10:03 PM   #331
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35 billion dollars. Has there ever been another privately financed construction project in the United States that was more expensive than this? That's an epic amount of money. And yeah I know some of the money is coming from the city but 35billion is a lot more than a lot of military projects and massive airports cost.
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Old October 18th, 2014, 01:16 AM   #332
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So much money that one could build several megatalls. But instead we don't even have a 400m+ tower @HY. What a shame.
I got a bad feeling we won't see an epic tower here, what a wasted opportunity ...
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Old October 18th, 2014, 01:24 AM   #333
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UBS surely will return from Stamford too.
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Old October 18th, 2014, 01:47 AM   #334
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So much money that one could build several megatalls. But instead we don't even have a 400m+ tower @HY. What a shame. I got a bad feeling we won't see an epic tower here, what a wasted opportunity ...
The unknown is certainly a scary prospect
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Old October 18th, 2014, 01:53 AM   #335
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So much money that one could build several megatalls. But instead we don't even have a 400m+ tower @HY. What a shame.
I got a bad feeling we won't see an epic tower here, what a wasted opportunity ...
What we need is for someone like Prince Alwaleed to purchase some land here in NYC and build the world's tallest tower!
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Old October 18th, 2014, 04:40 PM   #336
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What we need is for someone like Prince Alwaleed to purchase some land here in NYC and build the world's tallest tower!
No we don't need that
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Old October 18th, 2014, 08:13 PM   #337
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So much money that one could build several megatalls. But instead we don't even have a 400m+ tower @HY. What a shame.
I got a bad feeling we won't see an epic tower here, what a wasted opportunity ...
NY will have an epic cluster instead. Much more valuable than just 1 icon IMO
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Old October 18th, 2014, 10:04 PM   #338
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NY has scores of icons. No city has as many 300m towers that are actually rising .
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Old October 18th, 2014, 11:52 PM   #339
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http://m.wsj.com/articles/j-p-morgan.../new-york-main

The Wall Street Journal

October 17, 2014 9:25 P

J.P. Morgan Seeks Tax Aid on New York City Buildings

Bank’s Request for Incentives May Still Result in Local Job Losses

By ELIOT BROWN and LAURA KUSISTO
As a mayoral candidate, Bill de Blasio denounced city tax breaks for large corporations. Now he is considering a pitch by an employer for fewer New York jobs instead of more.
J.P. Morgan Chase & Co., one of the city’s largest employers, has approached New York City with a request for tax breaks and other incentives valued at hundreds of millions of dollars to help build a new two-tower headquarters on Manhattan’s far West Side, according to government officials and real-estate executives familiar with the talks.


As part of the deal, which also is being negotiated with the administration of Gov. Andrew Cuomo and requires a land purchase from developer Related Cos., the bank would agree to maintain a corporate head count of at least 16,000 in New York City, people familiar with the discussions said. That would be less than the roughly 20,000 corporate employees the bank has in New York today. However, if the bank didn’t receive the incentives, its total headcount could shrink even further as it seeks to cut costs.
Talks about the tax incentives were reported Friday by the New York Times.
Jobs-for-tax-breaks deals typically are intended for employers that are expanding, or at least retaining their existing workforce. But since the economic downturn New York’s big banks have been moving thousands of jobs to places where wages and real estate costs are far lower than Manhattan. That, in turn, has left empty offices and strained a sector that has long been an engine of the city’s economy.
To help press its case, J.P. Morgan has retained the lobbying firm Ickes & Enright Group, according to a public filing. The firm is headed by Harold Ickes, a onetime Clinton administration official with ties to Mr. de Blasio.
Even with tax incentives, the bank has told government officials the deal would generate more revenue for the city than if no towers were built at the West Side site.
J.P. Morgan’s other options include moving additional jobs out of the city or renovating its existing towers on Park and Madison avenues, people familiar with the discussions said.
If the other pieces of the deal fall in place, a decision on incentives creates an awkward choice for Mr. de Blasio, given his past rhetoric. “New York City spends too many dollars in one-off deals for large, well-connected corporations, while too many industry sectors and small businesses are neglected—especially those in outer-borough neighborhoods,” Mr. de Blasio said in campaign literature.
Deputy Mayor Alicia Glen said that while the city wouldn’t entertain very large subsidy requests, it has been “willing to engage with them in a dialogue about how we could be helpful in making a move more feasible.”
Mr. Cuomo said on Friday that there were continuing discussions between the bank and the city and state. He declined to elaborate.
Related Cos. owns the site between 10th and 11th avenues north of 33rd Street and is eager to strike a deal with J.P. Morgan or move on and try to build the towers itself for other tenants, people familiar with talks said.
Some observers are already criticizing the prospect of an incentive deal.
“Job creation is the whole point of economic development, not just blackmail. Especially in today’s economy people expect growth,” said Greg LeRoy, executive director of Good Jobs First, a group critical of incentives.
Write to Eliot Brown at [email protected] and Laura Kusisto at [email protected]

Laura Kusisto
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Old October 19th, 2014, 12:09 AM   #340
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Threathening to leave to get a good tax deal?
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