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Old May 23rd, 2016, 09:47 PM   #481
lkstrknb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyridgeline View Post
That's too bad.

I think it's the longest and fastest in operation (https://www.dcc.at/references/oaklan...ort-connector/).
At 30mph speed its not exactly fast. I didn't include this on my video, but there is a 30 second stop half way down the line which is not for a station, but only to change cables. This is very strange for any transit system. I believe this is the first Doppelmayr system to have switches.
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Old May 23rd, 2016, 11:11 PM   #482
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nanar View Post
and



It's absolutely not a new idea : Built more than forty years ago,
https://www.google.fr/search?q=aerob...w=1023&bih=515



Used in just one city, during a short period. Ask why no more, no in others places ?
It don't suceed to solve traffic problems, it was no low cost, and finally it was not a good idea

Public transport is serious thing, not playing with 3D drawing

Haters, Haters Everywhere.....

If it was built 40 why isn't it use worldwide? because it had many safety and structural deficiencies from the track not being solid, something that the emonorail.com solves.

What do you suggest to solve traffic in big cities? building underground subways at a billion+ per line?

Public transport IS a serious thing, and yet "some" people do nothing to solve it , but are dedicated to just trash other people's ideas.... SMH
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Old May 23rd, 2016, 11:13 PM   #483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyridgeline View Post
It's only an idea and it's not perfect? .

This one is in use and it looked much better than that imperfect idea.

That Oakland system has a lot of problems, I live in the Bay Area and I've ride it myself... it only has 2 stations and constantly malfunctions, can you imagine in a city-wide line?
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Old May 23rd, 2016, 11:23 PM   #484
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2 View Post
If you want to see something really cool take a look at www.skytrolley.com
The Cables and pylons are unsightly? maybe, with with the emonorail.com system, those pylons can be located one in every block, as oppose to 5 or six with regular systems...

What do you propose to solve traffic in big cities? build underground subways at a one billion+ per mile? that would bankrupt most cities...

The Skytrolley doesn't solve the main problem of an elevated monorail, which is the structure negatively impacting the street, it is just a big elevator moving people up and down which means they don't need an elevator or escalator, but that's it.

I think the main problem here is how to squeeze a track or two in narrow city streets, and emonorail.com solves that with intercrossing suspension cables...
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Old May 24th, 2016, 01:12 AM   #485
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There are numerous problems I can find on emonorail's site.

1) The grammar is atrocious. I can easily find numerous misspellings and word-order confusions. English is the only language available, and it isn't well done. I don't expect Hemingway or JK Rowling, but at least some professionalism is wanted.

2) There is no information available on who is proposing it. As far as I can tell, there is a single name listed at the bottom, and that is it. What is this person's education and background? Who else is working with them? We don't know that.

3) The renderings show absolutely no sense of street design. If this system were built as shown, it would cause unacceptable levels of chaos and safety hazards for drivers. While I'm reasonably sure that it could in fact accommodate such changes in road width, there are no images available to show this critical fact. I personally can't see how it could accommodate a center-line pole, at least not without very complex wire arrangements. Wider roads would mean pulling additional stunts to pull the cables over to the curb. And those anchorages would be annoying to everybody around them.

4) The system has additional complexity. Every new piece that you add to a system is something that can go wrong. More parts have to be inspected and maintained. The additional web of cables also increases the visual impact. Regardless of how much is actually in shadow, the more complex shape creates greater visual intrusion.

5) The pillars aren't actually farther apart than on conventional monorails and with the cable anchors actually occupy almost as much room. They can be spaced "four car lanes apart", which is less than exists on monorails in Japan. This negates a major selling point and points to an amateurish lack of research into the field.

6) The cars are deliberately designed not to connect to each other. This would create difficulties with traffic flows, in that it prevents people from spreading into more space, which leads to crowding. This is why rapid transit systems are trending towards more "contiguous" trains.

7) The issue of intellectual propriety is huge. Even normal monorails have this to an extent, but you can bet that this takes it to an extreme. Everything about this system is guaranteed to be patented as best as the inventor(s) can. That means that any time you want to get new equipment, you can only go to one vendor, or to vendors that have expensive licenses. That is going to drive up the cost a lot.

8) The sources are not entirely scholarly. I'll single out a particular annoyance here. The "reason foundation" gets almost all its cites from the "heritage foundation", which in turn gets almost all its cites from, you guessed it, the "reason foundation". In other words, this isn't a source of independently verified scholarly work, especially since the same oil-company executives fund both "foundations". While some of the sources are indeed reputable, and include some government sites, the overall quality is not sound.

9) If the issue is to try and get a track down a narrow city street, then I'll point either to traditional streetcars (which can squeeze into alleys), or the Shonan Monorail in Japan, which gets up to some pretty amazing antics above some rather narrow roads. This doesn't have a monopoly on getting into tight places at all. In fact, I don't think it does as good a job as the alternatives, given the need for bulky anchorages.

10) The renders don't even all show the same design. Where are the "critical" triangular stays that are specifically mentioned on the guide-way page? They don't appear at the stations.

11) The stations are much more massive and bulky than others. The renders don't even include handicapped accessibility, which would makes matters worse. The overhead bridge idea would lead to a much larger infrastructure, especially since it would require elevators. It also makes transfers and access from different neighborhoods to different directions more difficult. That is why most modern systems have a central area below the actual vehicles. This would mean either putting only the stations on the third floor, and dealing with the shenanigans of having the suspension systems climb (which isn't covered either), or running everything at the third floor, and dealing with bigger towers, especially since you need to maintain the proper catenary curves.
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Old May 24th, 2016, 06:57 AM   #486
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The SkyTrolley is itself is nothing new...........it's just a suspended monorail.

What is clever is the station ideas. They are thin enough to fir in a single car lane and the idea of having the entire station platform elevated is also quite innovative. The stations would quite small and cheap to build so I can see a business building a station in exchange for exclusive advertising rights.

As with most rapid transit systems, the biggest expenses is not the route/tracks/road itself but rather the stations and this design helps to address that.
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Old May 24th, 2016, 04:57 PM   #487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2 View Post
The SkyTrolley is itself is nothing new...........it's just a suspended monorail.

What is clever is the station ideas. They are thin enough to fir in a single car lane and the idea of having the entire station platform elevated is also quite innovative. The stations would quite small and cheap to build so I can see a business building a station in exchange for exclusive advertising rights.

As with most rapid transit systems, the biggest expenses is not the route/tracks/road itself but rather the stations and this design helps to address that.
No, this "station design" is fundamentally flawed and downright impractical and unsafe.

Here's the scenario why:

1) A large group of people get on the elavator/platform at the bottom and ride to the top.

2) A large group of people get off of the monorail at the same stop.

3) CHAOS.

Even during normal operations, this is going to be problematic, since there is no immediately available exit for the out-going passengers to disperse to. This means that they are going to be stuck trying to muddle their way through the embarking crowd. At the very least, this will be a noticeable increase in station dwell times. And that's the least of the problems-having two crowds in close proximity to each other trying to move in opposite directions is a recipe for injury.

Then there is the issue of disaster. In the event of a fire, people would be trapped on the platform. If there is a problem on the train, it needs to be able to reliably enter a station and immediately evacuate, even in a power outage.

These are just the issues that occur to me off the top of my head, and I'm pretty sure there are others.

It really bothers me when I see these "revolutionary" ideas for improving transportation that are full of shiny gadgets and the like. Half of them seem to assume that the people already in the industry are complete morons, and the other half are either naive or maliciously fraudulent.

If you want to see a good minimalist monorail station, look at Okinawa, Tama, or Shonan in Japan.
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Old May 24th, 2016, 05:23 PM   #488
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@00Zy99, thanks for your clear points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 00Zy99 View Post
If there is a problem on the train, it needs to be able to reliably enter a station and immediately evacuate, even in a power outage.
And if there's a problem with one or more elevators, there will be no platforms, passengers will be trapped on the train!
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Old May 26th, 2016, 01:22 AM   #489
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I just eyeballed it, and I think that the Shonan Monorail (which is a generation old and in a quake zone) has thinner columns than that "emonorail" thing.

Also, I note that very short trains are shown. Sure, more cars could be added, but longer trains means more weight means thicker/more cables and bigger/more towers. And any "lightness" claims (spurious as they already were) go out the window.
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Old May 26th, 2016, 07:52 AM   #490
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Originally Posted by 00Zy99 View Post
That systems has had quite a few problems. It pulls the cars along with a cable attached to a fixed motor. Unfortunately, the cable keeps breaking.

Maybe it's better now.


Shortly after its start, the airport connector had two breakdowns that had critics saying “I told you so” and riders questioning whether the connector would be worthwhile. Dopplmayr must run the service on time at least 99.5 percent or it faces financial penalties. So far, Trost said, the operator has met the standard. Last quarter, BART reported, the airport connector had a 99.7 percent on-time record. ...

Passengers riding the connector Wednesday seemed happy with the ride and accepting of the fare, perhaps begrudgingly. Heading toward the airport in the morning, they repeatedly filled all three cars of each train. Several said the connector was still better, and possibly cheaper, than taking a taxi or ride service or hassling with parking.


- November 26, 2015 , http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/a...ut-6659132.php


Quote:
Originally Posted by lkstrknb View Post
At 30mph speed its not exactly fast. I didn't include this on my video, but there is a 30 second stop half way down the line which is not for a station, but only to change cables. This is very strange for any transit system. I believe this is the first Doppelmayr system to have switches.

From their specification, the top speed at 30 mph is the fastest for this type of cable car. Its running/average speed is not the fastest but it is the longest.

The main objective for this system is to be competitive with other modes of transport in that particular area. I think the roads there are often congested.
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Old May 26th, 2016, 12:48 PM   #491
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkbytes View Post
What do you suggest to solve traffic in big cities? building underground subways at a billion+ per line?
More walking, biking, public transport at ground level on reserved lanes (bus rapid transit) or reserved tracks (modern tramways and LRT),
Changing urbanisme to create "short distances cities" : it's traduction of french terms to say "walk oriented development" + "bike oriented development" + "transit oriented development".

I think that building aerial or subway public transports just to avoid to take the place of the cars on the ground level is bad policy.

I must say : I live in a city with more than 1 000 000 inhabitants, where modal split is around 49 % for walk and bike, 26 % for cars (it was 35 % ten years ago and it still lows), and 25 % for public transport, growing more and more. We get more and more bike lanes, pedestrians zones, ground level public transport. And all that is solving traffic.
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Last edited by nanar; May 26th, 2016 at 04:18 PM.
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Old May 26th, 2016, 06:22 PM   #492
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Originally Posted by nanar View Post
More walking, biking, public transport at ground level on reserved lanes (bus rapid transit) or reserved tracks (modern tramways and LRT),
Changing urbanisme to create "short distances cities" : it's traduction of french terms to say "walk oriented development" + "bike oriented development" + "transit oriented development".

I think that building aerial or subway public transports just to avoid to take the place of the cars on the ground level is bad policy.

I must say : I live in a city with more than 1 000 000 inhabitants, where modal split is around 49 % for walk and bike, 26 % for cars (it was 35 % ten years ago and it still lows), and 25 % for public transport, growing more and more. We get more and more bike lanes, pedestrians zones, ground level public transport. And all that is solving traffic.

Imagine 26% of the people in this area drive to work.

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Old May 26th, 2016, 06:51 PM   #493
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Your video shows a BRT system (first initiated in south America), which can be very efficient, without being hanged under steel beam as emonorail(.com)

Also we could see videos about Tokyo transport, where a large part of people use commuters trains, sometimes on bridge, but very often at ground level,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTBiY6h5SXc

and very rarely under steel beam.

I think : if one country in the world knows a lot about efficient mass transit, it's precisely Japan
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Last edited by nanar; May 26th, 2016 at 06:57 PM.
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Old May 28th, 2016, 02:47 PM   #494
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China's First Permanent Magnet Monorail Train Completes Successful Test Run

China's first permanent magnet straddle-type monorail train has recently completed a successful test run in the city of Qingdao, Shandong Province.

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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:03 PM   #495
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The motors also enable the transit system to save 10 percent in energy as well as drastically cut noise levels during operation. "The train will produce even less noise than a car, even as it goes speeds of 70 km/h," Zhong said.

He added that the train meets the highest fire prevention standards and is equipped with water sprinklers that will automatically activate in the event of a fire. ...

The Beijing city government announced in 2014 a plan to build a straddle beam monorail in the capital's eastern areas. However, the plan was scrapped last year due to residents' concerns about the potential effect of light pollution on communities.


- 2016-05-30 07:57, http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2...t_25523189.htm


I think the rails for these trains will be less obstructive and more pleasing to the eyes ( less or no catwalks).
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Old June 4th, 2016, 05:06 PM   #496
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Originally Posted by Woonsocket54 View Post
It looks to be real. There are even photos online now.







Source: Krasnogorsk information portal (http://news.krasnogorsk.name/print:p...m-grafika.html)
This is taken from the Moscow Surface Public Transit thread. This monorail is very similar to the suspended monorail at Dusseldorf International Airport and the H-Bahn in Dortmund Germany.
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Old June 4th, 2016, 05:07 PM   #497
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More information from Moscow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dimlys1994 View Post
I don't know how real this news is, but in Krasnogorsk, Moscow's satellite city, it is reported that works are underway on suspension urban rail (similar to one in Wuppertal):
http://www.mk.ru/mosobl/2016/02/08/k...d-golovoy.html
http://www.kp.ru/daily/26367/3248434/



First section will be ready for tests by July with only 1 km to be completed by that time In total, 13 km of this system is planned with interchange at Krasnogorsk railway station and Myakinino metro station. It is claimed that Strela suspension rail will be built in cooperation with H-Bahn company - manufacturer of suspension rail:





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Old June 4th, 2016, 09:44 PM   #498
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Just realized-Moscow already HAS a monorail. Why are they going for another, incompatible system?
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Old June 4th, 2016, 10:48 PM   #499
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Just realized-Moscow already HAS a monorail. Why are they going for another, incompatible system?
Chongqing China has two monorail systems using Hitachi design which appear to be compatible, although I'm not sure if the station platform screen doors would match up. (I'm pretty sure they would though.)

Sao Paulo is currently building two separate monorail lines using two different manufacturers, Bombardier and Scomi, with two different beam sizes, so they are completely incompatible.

The two monorail systems in Moscow will probably never meet so building using the same technology doesn't give many advantages.
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Old June 4th, 2016, 10:52 PM   #500
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Just realized-Moscow already HAS a monorail. Why are they going for another, incompatible system?
It's an independent local connector line. They don't need the larger capacity and the overall costs are likely lower. If it's automated, even better. Here is a working example from Singapore (looked more expensive but maybe safer) :


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