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Old March 24th, 2008, 06:12 PM   #21
rheintram
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Vienna got both. A real subway and a tramway system that is partly pre-metro like.
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Old March 25th, 2008, 12:38 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rheintram View Post
The problem is that the Pöstlingbergbahn is technically unique and not compatible with the tramways. Hence they will destroy the PB in its current form and make it another tram line. All old vehicles will be heavily changed.

In the end all PB will use the tram network and will start at the main station. Unfortunately they will still require a special ticket, which is nonsense in my opinion.
Tramways use the strange 900 mm gauge, and the Pöstlingbergbahn 1000 mm with double flanged wheels.

That's why switches have more moving parts than elsewhere:

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Old March 25th, 2008, 02:15 AM   #23
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but unfortunately this unique tram will cease to exist soon and will become a regular tramway
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Old March 25th, 2008, 04:47 PM   #24
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It had been closed...yesterday. If only knew that one month ago...I had time to visit it.
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Old March 26th, 2008, 05:02 AM   #25
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I think a few meters will remain, as some sort of museum railway. Of course it will never be the same.
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Old March 27th, 2008, 12:44 PM   #26
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I don't think it is a good idea to transform the existing line.

The old line was a little attraction itself.
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Old March 27th, 2008, 05:06 PM   #27
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yes it was. unfortunately it's too late now.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 03:22 PM   #28
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Vienna has a real subway system, but underground light rail as well.
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Old June 3rd, 2008, 11:17 AM   #29
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Old September 1st, 2008, 05:35 PM   #30
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New underground line to be constructed:

Quote:
Straßenbahn von Linz bis Aigen-Schlägl
Eine neue Straßenbahnlinie statt der Mühlkreisbahn - diesen Vorschlag haben am Donnerstagabend der Verkehrsminister und die zuständigen Landes- und Stadtpolitiker in Linz präsentiert.

Die Mini-U-Bahn soll vom Hauptbahnhof am Allgemeinen Krankenhaus vorbei, unter der Donau durch bis nach Urfahr und von dort oberirdisch auf der Trasse der bisherigen Mühlkreisbahn bis nach Aigen-Schlägl verkehren.

Diese Vision einer neuen Straßenbahnlinie haben Verkehrsminister Faymann, der für den öffentlichen Verkehr zuständige Landeshauptmann-Stellvertreter Haider und der Linzer Bürgermeister Dobusch präsentiert.

Sieben Jahre für zehn Minuten
Planungs- und Bauzeit liegen bei rund sieben Jahren, für eine. Zeitersparnis von mindestens zehn Minuten.

550 Mio. Euro Kosten
Die Kosten werden auf 550 Millionen Euro geschätzt, also doppelt so viel wie die sogenannte City-S-Bahn zwischen Mühlkreisbahnhof und Hauptbahnhof, über die seit Jahren geredet wird.

Kein Wahlkampf-Gag
Verkehrsminister und SPÖ-Chef Werner Faymann betont, dass es sich dabei nicht um einen Wahlkampf-Gag handle.

"Es ist deshalt kein Wahlkampf-Gag, weil ich eigentlich in meinem Leben immer dafür gesorgt habe, dass Dinge, die ich ankündige, auch einhalte." so Faymann.

"Völlig neuer Weg"
Landeshauptmann-Stellvertreter Erich Haider spricht von einem völlig neuen Weg. Er sieht darin eine Lösung, an der alle interessiert sind. Diese neue Form der City-S-Bahn ist für Haider die innovative Lösung schlechthin.

Noch nicht im Budget vorgesehen
Die Kosten für die neue Straßenbahnlinie soll zur Hälfte der Bund übernehmen, 40 Prozent das Land und zehn Prozent die Stadt. Im Budget vorgesehen seien die 550 Millionen Euro aber bisher nicht, heißt es.
English translation with google:
http://translate.google.at/translate...hl=de&ie=UTF-8
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Old September 1st, 2008, 07:56 PM   #31
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Are there any maps out there to show what this is about? And will it be an additional line or replace the existing line from Hauptbahnhof to the main square?
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Old September 1st, 2008, 08:22 PM   #32
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I found a standard article. It seems everything else then certain that this will get built. I would also like to know it in more detail why the greens are opposed to it. After all there is usually no party which is more in favor of PT in general.

Quote:
Schwarz-grüne Skepsis an der Mühlviertel-Bim
ÖVP-Klubobmann Stelzer: "Nur eine weitere SPÖ-Seifenblase"

Linz - Alles andere als auf Schiene sind die Pläne für eine neue Straßenbahnlinie von Linz nach Aigen-Schlägl. Nachdem Verkehrsminister Werner Faymann (SPÖ) gemeinsam mit den zuständigen (roten) Landes- und Stadtpolitikern am Donnerstagabend überraschend die Idee zu dem 550-Millionen-Euro-Projekt präsentierte, stiegen am Freitag ÖVP und Grüne erwartungsgemäß auf die Bremse.

Grünen-Chef Rudi Anschober vermutet hinter dem Ausbau der Straßenbahn - geplant ist eine Mini-U-Bahn vom Hauptbahnhof am AKH vorbei, unter der Donau durch bis nach Urfahr und von dort oberirdisch auf der Trasse der bisherigen Mühlkreisbahn nach Aigen - einen "SPÖ-Wahlkampfgag". Aber man sei "gesprächsbereit" und warte auf ein entsprechendes Konzept. Der Linzer ÖVP-Klubobmann Thomas Stelzer vermutet "nur eine weitere SPÖ-Seifenblase".

SPÖ-Chef Erich Haider bleibt unbeeindruckt: "Es kann kein Wahlkampfgag sein, da wir bereits ein Jahr planen." Jetzt müsse man rasch gemeinsam an einer Umsetzung arbeiten, so Haider. (Markus Rohrhofer, Der Standard Print-Ausgabe, 30./31.08.2008)
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Old September 1st, 2008, 08:24 PM   #33
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I really like the look of the landscaping.

Makes me feel like a....child.

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Old September 2nd, 2008, 03:58 AM   #34
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here is a pdf explaining the project, including maps, etc.
http://www.land-oberoesterreich.gv.a...8_Internet.pdf

The reasons why many people oppose the project:
- it would replace the City-S-Bahn project which many people prefer
- Mühlkreisbahn is a standard gauge electrified heavy railway, while the Linz lightrail operates on 900mm narrow gauge with DC electrification

Which means the whole Mühlkreisbahn as it currently exists would be replaced which in the eyes of some would have the following disadvantages:
- No chance that cargo transport would ever be reactivated on Mühlkreisbahn
- DC is more problematic on long tracks with steep acclivity
- Bombardier Cityrunner lightrail vehicles would replace the current heavy rail ÖBB rolling stock on Mühlkreisbahn

The green party prefers the City S-Bahn and so do I. Compare the pdf above with this website and judge yourself: http://www.linz.gruene.at/citysbahn/index.php
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Old September 4th, 2008, 11:48 AM   #35
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Hm. Thank you for that good information.

To compare both scenarios:

Stadtbahn:
#costs around 500 mio €
#the Mühlkreisbahn will be integrated into the Stadtbahn which leads right into the central city
#dense frequency
#track is located a bit more inside the city which seems to increase the number of people living nearby.
# Mühlkreisbahn will be downgraded to a Stadtbahn with a different gauge than main lines, cargo railway will be outruled (would there be potential for it?)
# DC is more problematic on long tracks with steep acclivity

S-Bahn:
#costs around 200mio €
#Mühlkreisbahn remains as it is, (would the S-Bahn extend partially into the Mühlkreisbahn or not at all)
#People have to switch the train in Urfahr?
#track is on the brink to the industrial area, hence less people living in its vicinity (maybe more attractive for workers?)
#frequency of service might be less than the one of the Stadtbahn?


Have I missed something? Aren't ther also plans for another S-Bahn routes as well? I remember having read that the expanded Westbahn makes free some capacity to establish an S-bahn service there. Do you know something about it?
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Old September 6th, 2008, 02:40 PM   #36
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City S-Bahn would of course also use the Mühlkreisbahn tracks. If you compare the routes of the new stadtbahn project with those of the city s-bahn you will see that they are almost identical.

Concerning frequency keep in mind that the stadtbahn would only have a dense frequency on the inner section of the project and only half an hour and hourly service on the outer section.

About Westbahn: From what I've heard cargo and long distance traffic will grow rapidly in the next few years. Hence it is very uncertain whether or not the new westbahn (including the old tracks) will be able to handle additional increased commuter/s-bahn traffic. From what I've heard commuter services will be the first ones to suffer, as they are low priority services despite the fact that the public institutions invest millions into it.
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Old September 7th, 2008, 10:12 PM   #37
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I see.
I would call higher central frequency of a possible Stadtbahn still an important plus point. After there are people living in eastern-central Linz as well

I feel however not informed enough to support one project over the other. The S-Bahn probably could achieve the most with the smallest costs.
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Old September 7th, 2008, 10:43 PM   #38
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I've hearrd Graz and Salzburg have similar plans. Any truth to it?
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Old September 9th, 2008, 08:13 PM   #39
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Plans for what? S-Bahn or Stadtbahn or something else?
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Old September 10th, 2008, 05:43 AM   #40
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Plans for underground sections. Salzburg already has one underground station, and there's been talk for some time about extending it. Graz has been talking about doing what Linz did but so far I suppose it is just talk.
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