search the site
 daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > European Forums > UK & Ireland Architecture Forums > Projects and Construction > Irish Architecture Forum > Republic of Ireland

Republic of Ireland For projects and construction in Dublin and the South



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 15 votes, 5.00 average.
Old July 30th, 2014, 11:03 PM   #1
PeteC
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,246
Likes (Received): 643

Ma and Da Developers

Taking the concept of 'Mom and Pop Developers' from America, DCC now want to replicate this here in an effort to create more family friendly apartments in the city centre.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/consu...-000-1.1872721

What think you of this?

I think it is a decent idea but I don't think implementing it in this way will work. I think it would be better to redevelop existing properties using this model rather than going for new builds. Developing a new build 6storey apartment block on an infill site in the city centre would not be advisable for those with no experience. Sure they can hire experts but the entire project is likely to be too challenging and too expensive for a group of would-be developers. Also, there would seem to be a lack of schools and other such services for families in that area.

This could work if DCC took an existing but neglected building in, say, Mountjoy Square, and offered it to Ma and Da. There are many period properties around the city which could make great family homes which are laying unused and falling into disrepair. This could be a good way to provide good quality family homes, protect said building and revive areas.
PeteC no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 31st, 2014, 02:53 AM   #2
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,814
Likes (Received): 2107

I think that was tried in Mountjoy Square itself before but it was perhaps a Housing Association that was the model rather than a management company and owners. Henrietta Street may have been another.

Worth rattling the tree and seeing what comes out of it I think. Hopefully a few schemes move forward on brownfield, of which there is much in Dublin, as well as a refurb or two

I'd hope that architects are de riguer, they are rather cheap nowadays.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2014, 05:24 PM   #3
PeteC
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,246
Likes (Received): 643

Quote:
Originally Posted by sponge_bob View Post
I think that was tried in Mountjoy Square itself before but it was perhaps a Housing Association that was the model rather than a management company and owners. Henrietta Street may have been another.

Worth rattling the tree and seeing what comes out of it I think. Hopefully a few schemes move forward on brownfield, of which there is much in Dublin, as well as a refurb or two

I'd hope that architects are de riguer, they are rather cheap nowadays.
Do you think something like the proposed DCC scheme was tried before or was it something else to promote regeneration?

My point was that the Fishamble Street site is not suitable for novices to develop for several reasons. It will scare off potential participants and those who put their names forward will likely be biting off more than they can chew. Works to the envelope of an existing building and reworking the inside is much more appropriate for the average Joe Soap who they want to attract with this initiative.
PeteC no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2014, 09:32 PM   #4
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,814
Likes (Received): 2107

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteC View Post
Do you think something like the proposed DCC scheme was tried before or was it something else to promote regeneration?
Cant remember save that it was 40 years back and Mountjoy was preserved against the wishes of the corpo I'd have thought. The corpo wanted to bulldoze and concrete over all of Dublin until the late 1980s or so.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2014, 01:01 PM   #5
Catmalojin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dublin, Galway & New York
Posts: 3,914
Likes (Received): 847

Seems there hasn't been too much interest in the idea yet, though there's still a few weeks to go.
Quote:
No offers from ‘citizen developers’ to build six-storey apartment complex

Monday, August 04, 2014


Dublin City Council has confirmed there have been no bids to date for the site on Fishamble St, near Christ Church Cathedral

By Fiachra Ó Cionnaith
Irish Examiner Reporter


A local authority plan to rejuvenate an inner-city area by offering young families the chance to build a six- storey apartment complex on an empty plot of land for a knockdown price has yet to receive any takers.

Dublin City Council has confirmed there have been no bids to date for the site on Fishamble St, near Christ Church Cathedral, more than a week after the opportunity was launched as part of a wider inner-city regeneration programme.

Under plans announced last month, the local authority put the currently empty 29-30 Fishamble St plot of land up for sale at a knockdown €150,000 price.

Under the complicated deal, the plot of land can only be sold to between two and four families who apply for the site as part of a combined bid, who agree to build a six-storey building containing large multi-bedroom family apartments, and who confirm they will live in the facility for the next 10 years.

The deal was announced in order to replace traditional developers, who will build on the site before selling the facility, with “citizen developers” who will, the local authority has argued, build with the intention of living there themselves.

While the expected cost of building the complex is expected to be in the region of €1.2m — up to €300,000 per family — Dublin City Council said it is still an enticing deal, both for interested parties who can build to their own specifications, and the local area.

However, a spokesperson for the council said that a week after it was launched there has yet to be any interest from anyone keen to snap up the site.

“The project just launched on Monday, July 21. We have received no formal applications yet.

“Depending on the success (or otherwise) of the Dublin House project at Fishamble St, Dublin City Council may make other small sites available,” she added.

Interested parties must show they have the resources to build the facility after buying the plot of land, and that they intend to live in it for the next decade.

*Applications for the Fishamble St plot can be made until September 19, with further details available at www.dublincity.ie

© Irish Examiner Ltd. All rights reserved
Catmalojin no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2014, 01:10 PM   #6
belfastuniguy
Subliving
 
belfastuniguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Belfast
Posts: 20,049
Likes (Received): 7369

Finance availability is likely the issue. Families with access to that sort of money likely don't want to live there and are happy in their current location.

Be good to see an Irish equivalent of an organisation like Habitat NI securing the site and assisting with funding to allow families the first step onto the ladder and then take it from there. Building a development when you have no experience is I'm sure pretty daunting to many people, particularly families.
__________________
Anyone that lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

:: Northern Ireland Forum : Republic of Ireland Forum ::
belfastuniguy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2014, 03:35 PM   #7
dubshee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 88
Likes (Received): 25

Dublin City Council should develop this site themselves and build exactly what they would envision for such a development. It could be used as a template and a "show unit" to generate public awareness and interest in the scheme.

A lot of potential developers have probably not even heard of this scheme or would be interested but might not have the where-with-all to go about it. Rather than offer it as a scheme with a small window of time for people to take up on it and expecting a flurry of takers, why not take the lead and develop a perfect example of what they want and use that as a benchmark for these type of developments.
dubshee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2014, 04:40 PM   #8
odlum833
Registered User
 
odlum833's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Dublin
Posts: 9,982
Likes (Received): 2070

I think the concept is a good one. The implementation has to be right though. There are many little sites like this that could very easily be redeveloped if this proves in any way popular. It could be a fast solution to filling gaps.

Be interesting to see if it gets any takers.
__________________
Ireland forum is here

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1596

dubshee liked this post
odlum833 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2014, 05:30 PM   #9
dubshee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 88
Likes (Received): 25

It really is a great concept, I just wonder if they're going about it the right way.
dubshee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2014, 01:44 AM   #10
odlum833
Registered User
 
odlum833's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Dublin
Posts: 9,982
Likes (Received): 2070

I don't see what else they can really do. It seems like a generous offer.
__________________
Ireland forum is here

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1596
odlum833 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2014, 01:57 AM   #11
dubshee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 88
Likes (Received): 25

Quote:
Originally Posted by odlum833 View Post
I don't see what else they can really do. It seems like a generous offer.
Without a doubt, I think it's a brilliant offer and potentially a brilliant scheme. I just think the council should consider developing the first one themselves and use it to promote the concept. They'd more than get their money back and would be a great tool to sell the idea or maybe they just need to provide more information and publicise it more.. I find it hard to believe that they've had no interest in it so far.
dubshee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2014, 02:44 AM   #12
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,814
Likes (Received): 2107

Nope, they should look at letting a Housing Association do it. DCC is not in the business of providing what is essentially private housing.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2014, 09:33 PM   #13
Replicate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 98
Likes (Received): 15

Perhaps looking at the idea of Reverend Hall? We live in one of the houses he built and even got the plaque on our door from the unveiling of the scheme. (Hope the link comes across ok)

http://staff.spd.dcu.ie/mcmanusr/Per...4CN4GAZ62KH5lQ
Replicate no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2014, 09:36 PM   #14
Replicate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 98
Likes (Received): 15

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&sourc...4CN4GAZ62KH5lQ
Replicate no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 6th, 2014, 01:48 AM   #15
sponge_bob
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,814
Likes (Received): 2107

Quote:
Originally Posted by Replicate View Post
Perhaps looking at the idea of Reverend Hall?
Indeed or else Fr Harry Bohan and his Rural Housing Organisation which built a lot of estates in small towns , particularly in the MidWest. Basically a sort of Housing Association with the right to buy. It was also designed to deal with recalcitrant building societies, who would not lend, in that era.

http://catholicjournalist.com/harry_...547f36f3a255b8

Apart from building 100s of houses a year from around 1975 to 1985 he also managed the Clare Hurling team for years. Fr Harry Bohan wrote a book on this I think, he is still alive and well and I'm sure he would be a great mentor were he asked nicely...he is that sort of guy.
sponge_bob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 7th, 2014, 10:43 PM   #16
PeteC
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,246
Likes (Received): 643

The question I have is do a group of four people have to present themselves to DCC for the application or can individuals apply and DCC put them together? If it is the lattern then it is not surprising that they have no responses as the number of people willing to undertake such a project would be quite small, nevermind them having to find a sufficient number of others willing to do so from their friends and acquaintances. While people here suggest it is a great deal, there are huge risks for those involved, both in terms of the construction and potential for costs to increase without having to factor in potential issues with their co-developers.
PeteC no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 03:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu