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Old February 3rd, 2014, 10:07 AM   #3341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by siamu maharaj View Post
Thai has a habit of owning every possible widebody.
Sure, but for some reason, it skipped the B767... yet, it owned DC-10s and MD-11s for some time too, as well as the B707 a long time back.

But back to the B787: now that TG ordered six of those, which of its current aircraft can be retired so that it can become a mainstay with the airline?
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 10:28 AM   #3342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
I would say, first of all, congratulations to Thai Airways for selecting the Dreamliner as one of its long-haul aircraft (along with its existing suite of wide-body aircraft in service). And by the way, TG has never used a B738; it uses the B734 and recently got the A320.
Thanks for pointing this out to me, I was convinced TG operated a sub fleet of B738's but that could've been NOK Air.
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 10:38 AM   #3343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EK413 View Post

Thanks for pointing this out to me, I was convinced TG operated a sub fleet of B738's but that could've been NOK Air.
It is indeed Nok Air, a competitor to Thai Smile and Bangkok Airways.

And by the way, I wonder if TG's B787s will feature two- or three-class cabins...? So far, most of the airlines operating it have up to three cabins (J, Y+, and Y).
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 11:01 AM   #3344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EK413 View Post
Congratulations TG
One thing I'll never understand would be their unusual fleet choices. From what I see politicians have played a big role considering the vast amount of sub types; B734, B738, A320, A300-600, A333, A345, A346, B772ER. B773, B77W, B744, A380, & now B788. Any plans to simplify such a complex fleet??? (I know the A345 fleet is currently in storage)
And to make the picture complete, they have twelve A350s on order as well.
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 11:34 AM   #3345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
It is indeed Nok Air, a competitor to Thai Smile and Bangkok Airways.

And by the way, I wonder if TG's B787s will feature two- or three-class cabins...? So far, most of the airlines operating it have up to three cabins (J, Y+, and Y).
Hmm strangely enough TG own both NOK Air & Thai Smile!
I've searched & no success concerning TG's B787 configuration. More than likely to have F, J & Y considering the existing fleet don't have Y+.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XWB View Post
And to make the picture complete, they have twelve A350s on order as well.
TG management love complexity!

[IMG]http://i59.************/5dukxv.jpg[/IMG]
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 12:36 PM   #3346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
Sure, but for some reason, it skipped the B767... yet, it owned DC-10s and MD-11s for some time too, as well as the B707 a long time back.

But back to the B787: now that TG ordered six of those, which of its current aircraft can be retired so that it can become a mainstay with the airline?
Looking at their phase out plan, I'm quite happy: By 2017, all A300-600s, a340-600s, B737-400s will be gone. 4 more 747s, the first batch of A330 (8 of them) and a few 777-200s will be phased out also as part of that plan. But still, they will have too many different types even after that.

The real issue is that Thai really has a weird way of buying aircraft. They kind of choose them based solely on their popularity. That is why they end up owning a handful of almost each variant of all popular widebody. And the worst, they keep on doing so as besides those 787-8s, they have 2 787-9s and 12 a350-900s on order.

Since the a350 and 787 will mainly be used for regional flights (especially flights to North Asia, Oceania) as reported by CAPA , I'm very confused which type will become the mainstay of their regional fleet in the future. Look! By 2017 they will have:
- 19 a330-300 (which they will retire progressively)
- 12 a350-900
- 7 787-8
- 2 787-9 (might be used for long haul)
- 6 777-300
- 4 to 8 777-200
- 6 777-200ER (used for thin long haul flights too)

If I were them, I would have gone for either 787 or a350, not both, because the difference in terms of capacity is not much and they will be mainly used for the same purpose.

Regarding the long haul sector though, there is a slight improvement:
- the 777-300ER is becoming the mainstay (they will have 14 of them)
- the a380 is used for premium flights (together with some 747s which will remain in the fleet until the end of the decade)
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 12:38 PM   #3347
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Quote:
I've searched & no success concerning TG's B787 configuration.
Thai has yet to reveal the 787 cabin configuration. In the meantime, the airline has debuted a refreshed design for its forthcoming jets:

http://www.ausbt.com.au/thai-airways...ncept-interior
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 12:56 PM   #3348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
It is indeed Nok Air, a competitor to Thai Smile and Bangkok Airways.
Nok air is not a head to head competitor to Thai Smile and Bangkok Airways.
Nok is positionned as a (premium) low cost carrier (mainly compete with Thai Air Asia) whereas Thai Smile is a light premium carrier (the same as SIA's Silk Air). Moreover Thai Airways is the largest shareholder of Nok :-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
And by the way, I wonder if TG's B787s will feature two- or three-class cabins...? So far, most of the airlines operating it have up to three cabins (J, Y+, and Y).
As I saw on a thai forum, the 787 will feature 2 cabins ( J and Y), J seats will be B/E Aerospace's diamond as seen on United's 787. The seats will likely be customized by Priestmangoode though.

Here is a pic taken from the forum (this is the non-customized seat I think)
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 01:17 PM   #3349
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Some more info I found. As per this article, the a350 will feature 3 classes. I think the lower right pic is the a350's first class.



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Old February 3rd, 2014, 01:26 PM   #3350
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Might add this here as everyone is talking about TG

Quote:
During the week of 03FEB14′s OAG Schedules Analyser update, THAI has listed planned Boeing 787 operation, due to start from 01JUL14. Initially the 787 aircraft would operate service on Bangkok – Perth daily flight, followed by Bangkok – Tokyo Haneda from 01AUG14.

Note these flights are currently displaying in OAG, and not reflected in the GDS, therefore reservation for service to Perth continues to display Airbus A330 while Tokyo Haneda (new 2nd daily flight) is not listed in the inventory.

Proposed Boeing 787 schedule as follow.

Bangkok – Perth
TG483 BKK2359 – 0745+1PER 787 D
TG484 PER0915 – 1515BKK 787 D
AirlineRoute.net
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 02:11 PM   #3351
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Update as of 03FEB14: Kenya Airways Planned S14 Boeing 787 Operations

As of 03FEB14, Kenya Airways’ planned Boeing 787 operation from 14APR14 as follow. The Skyteam member plans to operate the Dreamliner aircraft on Johannesburg operation in April and May 2014, which was not reported on Airline Route on 30JAN14.

eff 18APR14 Nairobi – Johannesburg 3 weekly (until 01JUN14)
KQ762 NBO0830 – 1145JNB 788 567
KQ763 JNB1415 – 1925NBO 788 567

On Nairobi – Paris CDG route, where Boeing 787 aircraft scheduled to enter operations from 01JUN14, the airline’s planned 787 operation (departure days from NBO) as follow:
01JUN14 – 06JUL14 Day x1
07JUL14 – 04AUG14 Daily
05AUG14 – 10SEP14 Day x7 (Day 7 operated by 767-300ER)
11SEP14 – 25OCT14 Day x13

Planned Boeing 787 operation on following routes remain unchanged:
Nairobi – Mombasa 14APR14 – 29MAY14 4 weekly
KQ900 NBO0730 – 0830MBA 788 13
KQ904 NBO1430 – 1530MBA 788 13

KQ901 MBA1100 – 1200NBO 788 13
KQ905 MBA1800 – 1900NBO 788 13

Nairobi – Dar es Salaam 15APR14 – 30MAY14 4 weekly
KQ910 NBO0900 – 1025DAR 788 24
KQ912 NBO1655 – 1820DAR 788 24

KQ911 DAR1255 – 1420NBO 788 24
KQ913 DAR2050 – 2215NBO 788 24

As a reminder, planned Boeing 787 operation remains subject to change. The configuration of Boeing 787-8 is C30Y204, with 2-2-2 layout in Business Class, 3-3-3 in Economy. For additional information on worldwide Boeing 787 operations, please refer to this report, which updates on regular basis.
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 06:12 PM   #3352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EK413 View Post
Hmm strangely enough TG own both NOK Air & Thai Smile!
I've searched & no success concerning TG's B787 configuration. More than likely to have F, J & Y considering the existing fleet don't have Y+.



TG management love complexity!

[IMG]http://i59.************/5dukxv.jpg[/IMG]
Having so many sub-fleets is terrible. They don't get economies of scale on any fleet. Some sensible person should consolidate that into 2 or 3 types.
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Old February 3rd, 2014, 09:39 PM   #3353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Male View Post
Nok air is not a head to head competitor to Thai Smile and Bangkok Airways.
Nok is positionned as a (premium) low cost carrier (mainly compete with Thai Air Asia) whereas Thai Smile is a light premium carrier (the same as SIA's Silk Air). Moreover Thai Airways is the largest shareholder of Nok :-)


As I saw on a thai forum, the 787 will feature 2 cabins ( J and Y), J seats will be B/E Aerospace's diamond as seen on United's 787. The seats will likely be customized by Priestmangoode though.

Here is a pic taken from the forum (this is the non-customized seat I think)
Ah I see... Well, now I understand what's going on. It's interesting that TG owns a majority of Nok's shares, and that it is a premium low cost carrier competing with Thai Air Asia (FD). What makes Nok different from FD then? And what's the difference between a light premier carrier (like Thai Smile) and a full-fledged premier carrier (like Thai Airways)?

As for the B787 J class seat design, it gives me an impression that the seating configuration on J might be the staggered version instead of the herringbone, is that correct? And by the way, if you wish, you can share your image governing Thai's upcoming A350 interiors on this thread to avoid confusion.
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Old February 4th, 2014, 12:43 AM   #3354
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Air India is going to take delivery of two 787s by March:
http://atwonline.com/airframes/air-i...87-performance

So these have to be LN25 ZA230 VT-ANA (ready for delivery) and LN28 ZA233 VT-ANC (probably still inside EMC, but it is repainted, so they probably move it out to the flightline in few days).
---------
and about owner of LN143 ZA586 N28MS:
Quote:
I believe you will find that Boeing 787 N28MS is owned by Michael Dell
https://twitter.com/royalscottking/s...30525212205056
---------

Quote:
787 assembly problems in Charleston drag on Everett

Boeing is struggling to complete 787 fuselage sections in South Carolina since a production rate increase, and sections are arriving in Everett more unfinished and problematic than before.

Since late last year, Boeing 787 Dreamliner fuselage sections from North Charleston, S.C., have arrived at the Everett final assembly line seriously incomplete with wiring and hydraulics lines missing, according to multiple sources in the factory.

The poorly done work out of Charleston threatens to undermine the company’s plans to deliver 10 Dreamliners a month and fulfill the much-delayed jet program’s original promise.

“It’s snowballing. The planes are getting worse out of Charleston,” said one senior Everett employee who oversees the production status of the airplanes.

Another Everett employee, a quality inspector, said the work out of Charleston had been very slowly getting better until late last year, but that “now the curve has gone the other way, big time.”
[...]
http://seattletimes.com/html/busines...lestonxml.html

Last edited by PiotrG; February 4th, 2014 at 08:01 AM.
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Old February 4th, 2014, 10:33 AM   #3355
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First, more info regarding configuration here : J 24 seats, Y 240 seats.
So IMO, it's gonna be similar to Ethiopian's (24 J + 246 Y).


Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
Ah I see... Well, now I understand what's going on. It's interesting that TG owns a majority of Nok's shares, and that it is a premium low cost carrier competing with Thai Air Asia (FD). What makes Nok different from FD then? And what's the difference between a light premier carrier (like Thai Smile) and a full-fledged premier carrier (like Thai Airways)?
When flying with Nok, you still get free snack + free baggage allowance. Those are the differences. Nok's ticket price is still almost as low as FD's though.

Thai Smile is the regional unit of Thai Airways. They mainly use Thai Smile where it is not profitable to send a widebody. There is still a considerable gap between their J and Thai's J, that's why they call it a light premium carrier.

I hope I answered your questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
As for the B787 J class seat design, it gives me an impression that the seating configuration on J might be the staggered version instead of the herringbone, is that correct? And by the way, if you wish, you can share your image governing Thai's upcoming A350 interiors on this thread to avoid confusion.
I really wish they install the same seats too but as I read on the forum, Sogerma's Soltsys (the staggered one) is not yet certified to be installed on 787s. To verify that claim, I checked out Sogerma's website and unfortunately it's true (it says 'qualification under process' for 787). Moreover, the one shown in the pic is not in herringbone arrangement. It's a flat bed in a 2-2-2 configuration.

And IMO, with this very dense configuration, I do not think it is going to be the staggered seats since 6 rows are needed for that. It's highly likely that it features a 2-2-2 configuration in J to accommodate all those 24 seats (that means 4 rows).

Last edited by Le Male; February 4th, 2014 at 01:59 PM.
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Old February 4th, 2014, 03:47 PM   #3356
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787 assembly problems in Charleston drag on Everett:

http://seattletimes.com/html/busines...lestonxml.html
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Old February 4th, 2014, 06:28 PM   #3357
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United Airlines N45905 at Los Angeles International
4th January 2014
Link: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...ner/2388469/L/
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Old February 4th, 2014, 08:21 PM   #3358
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Matt twitted this photo:

with description:
Quote:
ANA 787 line 11 at the Everett Modification Center this morning
https://twitter.com/mattcawby/status.../photo/1/large
But I see there LN13, not LN11. LN11 should be inside EMC now. It should be cleared when he will post better photo.
----------
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...130Z/KSKF/KSKF
unidentified flightplan from KSKF on flightaware again. RC021 (747-8I 2nd test frame) is now parked in PAE, ZB021 3rd test 789 is in Roswell. This could be LN6 ZA006 first flight after change incorporation/re-work.

Last edited by PiotrG; February 4th, 2014 at 10:48 PM.
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Old February 4th, 2014, 11:40 PM   #3359
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Quote:
unidentified flightplan from KSKF on flightaware again. RC021 (747-8I 2nd test frame) is now parked in PAE, ZB021 3rd test 789 is in Roswell. This could be LN6 ZA006 first flight after change incorporation/re-work.
It seems LN6 was put back into storage.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...=2&output=html
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Old February 5th, 2014, 01:17 AM   #3360
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I know this, but Ureshs said he doesn't know anything more. Status of this frame is unclearly now.
//flightplan disappeared from flightaware.
------------------------
JAL 1st flight to YVR. Plane was LN21 ZA176 JA823J.














source: http://bc.ctvnews.ca/more/photo-gall...uver-1.1668925


Last edited by PiotrG; February 5th, 2014 at 02:23 AM.
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