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Old January 17th, 2013, 04:18 PM   #1501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pedro EM View Post
I think they made the right decision in grounding them- I just hope the grounding won't last too long.
BTW how many airlines who decided to grounded their 787?
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Old January 17th, 2013, 05:42 PM   #1502
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emyrr3096 View Post
BTW how many airlines who decided to grounded their 787?
Airlines didn't decide it, the FAA being american and Boeing aswell, they can decide to ground all the 787s in service, that's what they did.
That's the second time they do that in the history, last time was for the DC-10.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 10:11 PM   #1503
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At this rate the 787 will go down in the history books as the plane with the greatest number of successful emergency landings. Kudos Boeing!
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Old January 18th, 2013, 02:33 AM   #1504
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lol what a complete failure
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Old January 18th, 2013, 02:57 AM   #1505
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Quote:
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lol what a complete failure
It is definitely not a failure; it is just a precautionary measure. If it was a complete failure, then Everett and Charleston would have made a statement today or in a few days that the 787 production will be over. But no such word exists; in fact, Boeing still keeps making them... But they definitely need to look at the Li-Ion battery problem and see if any improvements are needed to avoid such incident repeats in the future. It will take time, but it's not time to say it is a complete failure.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 03:05 AM   #1506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
It is definitely not a failure; it is just a precautionary measure. If it was a complete failure, then Everett and Charleston would have made a statement today or in a few days that the 787 production will be over. But no such word exists; in fact, Boeing still keeps making them... But they definitely need to look at the Li-Ion battery problem and see if any improvements are needed to avoid such incident repeats in the future. It will take time, but it's not time to say it is a complete failure.
You're right, even cellphones stumble into li-ion batteries problems at times... but wait, phones do not carry people...humm... ok, it's a partially complete failure then
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Old January 18th, 2013, 03:09 AM   #1507
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You can view it that way, but I think the 787s will resume its services soon. Hopefully, all the minor tweaks and adjustments can be made to make sure all will work smoothly in the future.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 03:59 AM   #1508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space Invader View Post

Airlines didn't decide it, the FAA being american and Boeing aswell, they can decide to ground all the 787s in service, that's what they did.
That's the second time they do that in the history, last time was for the DC-10.
Oohh so FAA and Boeing. Co. Whose ask to all airlines who operate 787 to ground its? Woah what happend?
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Old January 18th, 2013, 08:36 AM   #1509
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The FAA can only ground the 787s of US operators or operators flying to the US. But they normally advise other national aviation agencies to do the same who usually follow their advise.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 11:35 AM   #1510
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I didn't explain myself really well, I meant I believe the FAA is the only one able to send a emergency airworthiness directive for Boeing and same for the EASA with Airbus.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 11:56 AM   #1511
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To say the 787 is a complete failure is a stupid thing to say!
You only need to look through history to see many new aircraft have had their flaws or initial service problems.
The DH Comet,DC10,Concorde and more recently A380 have all had problems but soon settled down to give many years of great service.
I am sure Boeing and the airlines will sort out the problems and the Dreamliner will become one of the most important developments in aviation history.One that many future designs will be based on.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 04:20 PM   #1512
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Sourcehttp://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-cance...er-for-jetstar:
Quote:
Qantas trims Boeing 787 Dreamliner order for Jetstar
By John Walton

Qantas has trimmed the Boeing 787 order for its low-cost arm Jetstar, cancelling one of the 15 Dreamliners headed to the airline to bring the JQ 787 fleet down to 14.

However, the airline's move is said to predate the current spate of Dreamliner problems which resulted in this week's grounding of the revolutionary Boeing jet, with Qantas remaining confident that Jetstar will begin its first commercial Dreamliner flights in the later half of this year.

The decision to cancel this one Dreamliner – with a list price saving of some A$196 million – reportedly sees Qantas hedging its bets against a projected slow-down in Jetstar's international traffic.

On top of the 14 787s remaining on order for Jetstar, Qantas retains the option to buy up to 50 more Dreamliners in either the 787-8 or stretched 787-9 variant for delivery from 2016, to be shared between the Jetstar and Qantas fleets.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 08:29 PM   #1513
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Left: 787 burned-out battery
Right: 787 battery as it supposed to look like

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Old January 18th, 2013, 08:55 PM   #1514
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The Japanese investigators have released some initial findings on the 2nd battery fire.
Quote:
Japan Probe Suspects Excess Voltage in 787 Battery

(TOKYO) — The burned insides of a battery in the Boeing 787 at the center of a worldwide grounding of the aircraft indicate it operated at a voltage above its design limit, a Japanese investigator said Friday, as U.S. officials joined Japan‘s probe into the incident.

....


GS Yuasa Corp., the maker of the lithium-ion batteries used in the 787s, said Thursday it was helping with the investigation but that the cause of the problem was unclear. It said the problem could be the battery, the power source or the electronics system.

Read more: http://world.time.com/2013/01/18/jap...#ixzz2IM2LO0LG
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:34 PM   #1515
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"The burned insides of a battery in the Boeing 787 at the center of a worldwide grounding of the aircraft indicate it operated at a voltage above its design limit"

Can you say "faulty design"? Also, a clear sign that tests were made in a rush. Again, this could be unacceptable even if it was a brand-name smartphone. But we're talking about a would-be milestone airliner, go figure...
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:40 PM   #1516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
The Japanese investigators have released some initial findings on the 2nd battery fire.
I think with that overcharging issue, perhaps Japanese manufacturers and Boeing can come with a battery charging mechanism that would allow airlines to determine whether a battery is fully charged or not so that such problems of overcharged batteries (which led to such bad fires) can be lessened, if not totally prevented. It is called a trial and error process: it may not be fool-proof to start, but a charging regulator will be needed so that batteries will be charged perfectly and allow them to charge faster soon.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 10:15 PM   #1517
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldsofdreams View Post
I think with that overcharging issue, perhaps Japanese manufacturers and Boeing can come with a battery charging mechanism that would allow airlines to determine whether a battery is fully charged or not so that such problems of overcharged batteries (which led to such bad fires) can be lessened, if not totally prevented. It is called a trial and error process: it may not be fool-proof to start, but a charging regulator will be needed so that batteries will be charged perfectly and allow them to charge faster soon.
Whoa. A charging regulator... who would have thought that THAT was needed?
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Old January 18th, 2013, 10:46 PM   #1518
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Too bad for 787.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 02:03 AM   #1519
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A battery problem seems like a limited parts issue that should be easy enough to fix.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 02:16 AM   #1520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
It's the Li-ion batteries that are the cause for the grounding, not any other incident.

Issues with such batteries are widely known, not just in the aviation industry. What makes it difficult is that they are very unpredictable, this makes it impossible to test them for longevity. During the testing there where no incidents like this, there was another electrical fire but that had a completely different cause. These kind of issues only pop up when they happen and that can happen when they are already in service.
If the batteries are that unpredictable then thats actually reason enough to find an alternate.
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