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Old May 11th, 2004, 03:25 AM   #81
huaiwei
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I suppose your friend has every right to be pissed.

Do you have any news articles from the Indonesian side on this issue which might offer some clues?
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Old May 11th, 2004, 03:32 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
Hmm i dont think its from Indonesian side, just checked with my mate and CGk is fully ready and it has the permission for valuair....i suspect their management maybe try to think twice before joining the very massive competition between sg-jkt. Even airasia, who already well known is considering Johor Bahru - jakarta instead of sg-jkt.

If it has problem with the permission, they should settle down long before their maiden flight to jakarta and 2004 is year of indonesian open skies, so they would get the permitt easier, Yet...the big advertisements of valuair in many indonesian newspapers are already there since 5 days ago, the authority of CGK of course will notice that.

My friend is on the 1st flight from sg to jkt with Valuair, i think hes pissed off with it.

cheers
I don't think Valuair is thinking twice about joining the Sg-Jkt route.....if so why would they even advertised in the first place??? If they were to think twice, perhaps they might not even annouce the route in the first place???

Let's see what they say.....
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Old May 11th, 2004, 03:47 AM   #83
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Damn, cant find any news from jakarta about Valuair, but many
news about Badminton and presidential candidate !

@babystan09 , Yeah good thinking, but hopefully it wont damage their reputation though

cheers
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Old May 11th, 2004, 03:49 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
Damn, cant find any news from jakarta about Valuair, but many
news about Badminton and presidential candidate !

@babystan09 , Yeah good thinking, but hopefully it wont damage their reputation though

cheers
Oh badminton....Indonesia got a lot of fine players......

Yeah....I hope this won't be detrimental to their reputation too....
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Old May 11th, 2004, 04:04 PM   #85
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Missing administrative process grounds Valuair's flights to Jakarta

Time is GMT + 8 hours
Posted: 11 May 2004 2054 hrs

By Asha Popatlal, Channel NewsAsia

SINGAPORE : Valuair's maiden flight to Jakarta on Monday was grounded by a missing administrative process in obtaining landing rights.

But Singapore's first budget carrier hopes to ride through the turbulence and take off by next week.

It looked like all systems go for Valuair when they received their Operations Certificate from the Jakarta authorities on Sunday morning basically allowing them to operate into Jakarta.

Then on Sunday night - turbulence hit.

Valuair was told there were further administrative requirements to complete the full process of clearance.

That meant Jakarta became a "No Fly" zone and so passengers on its inaugural Monday morning flight had to be transferred to Garuda.

A team is currently in Jakarta to resolve these issues.

But why was not the problem spotted earlier?

Mr Lau said: "Meetings were going on all of last week and there were no hints that anything was amiss. The Valuair team is in Jakarta to address these issues because we have to try and find what is the missing process which at this moment is unclear to us."

Meanwhile, Valuair says it will refund or offer alternative seats on Garuda to those who have already bought Jakarta tickets.

The question is: What will this delay cost Valuair?

Financially, Valuair's tickets cost $138 while comparable fares on Garuda at the lowest promotional rates is, at the lowest, $180.

Then, there're the intangible costs. Just how forgiving will their passengers be?

"It's okay - It's only a matter of time," said one passenger.

"They should have sorted out everything, logistics and all before tickets are sold to the public," said another.

"I will still try it because it's a new airplane."

Valuair is suspending all ticket sales to Jakarta until they get their clearance but even then it will not take off immediately.

Mr Lau said: "Even if we get our approval and get over this missing administrative process, what we'll probably do is to take a further few days to re-evaluate the ground situation before we begin."

Valuair estimates the Jakarta flights will take off at the beginning of next week, at the earliest. - CNA


Copyright © 2004 MCN International Pte Ltd
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Old May 11th, 2004, 04:26 PM   #86
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Hmm interesting.....I wonder what administration problem is that?

Quote:
Mr Lau said: "Meetings were going on all of last week and there were no hints that anything was amiss. The Valuair team is in Jakarta to address these issues because we have to try and find what is the missing process which at this moment is unclear to us."
Weird, why the heck until now they still think its unclear? they should know the problem once they got the "no fly zone" messages from Jakarta, isnt ?

Many indonesian spotters were in the airport and ready to get valuair 1st flight picture


cheers
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Old May 11th, 2004, 04:30 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
Many indonesian spotters were in the airport and ready to get valuair 1st flight picture
I guess they can try their luck next week......
"Valuair estimates the Jakarta flights will take off at the beginning of next week, at the earliest. "
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Old May 11th, 2004, 05:04 PM   #88
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Ya ! lets hope they really fly next week, its such a great looking airplane and its brand new jetliners too !


cheers
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Old May 11th, 2004, 06:34 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
Hmm interesting.....I wonder what administration problem is that?



Weird, why the heck until now they still think its unclear? they should know the problem once they got the "no fly zone" messages from Jakarta, isnt ?

cheers
Hmm..it seems to say in the article that the airline only knew about the "no fly zone" thing on Sunday night...one day before its flight the next day! I suppose by the time they knew it, its too late!
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Old May 11th, 2004, 06:42 PM   #90
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Yup, i noticed that but why until now they still unclear for what is it the problem?
I supposed when they got the messages from jakarta, it would contain explanation on why the denied the flight, right? or wasnt?

cheers
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Old May 11th, 2004, 06:52 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
Yup, i noticed that but why until now they still unclear for what is it the problem?
I supposed when they got the messages from jakarta, it would contain explanation on why the denied the flight, right? or wasnt?

cheers
The thing is...we dont know if they were so inexperienced that they didnt know proper procedures, or they do not know that they have to get certain kinds od clearence, or was it the message from Jakarta was sent too late, or was it a combination of both?

If valueair staff are that unfamiliar with the procedures, I hope they learn a hard lesson now. They jolly well be thankful it happened on their shortest and cheapest route so far...imagine it happening to a longer-haul one!
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Old May 12th, 2004, 08:25 AM   #92
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The owner of valuair is ex-SIA CEO right? did he resign from SIA or got fired?

cheers
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Old May 12th, 2004, 09:22 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David-80
The owner of valuair is ex-SIA CEO right? did he resign from SIA or got fired?

cheers
Should be job-hop..or being "hunted"....haha.....besides valuair, he's also the chairman of Singapore Press Holdings(the largest newspaper company in Singapore)
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Old May 12th, 2004, 10:25 AM   #94
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Big airlines' cheap tactics won't stop budget carriers

Business Times - 12 May 2004

They will not be able to match low-cost airlines on price over sustained period

(SINGAPORE) Major airlines have signalled their intent to try to subdue Asia's growing fleet of low-cost carriers by drastically slashing fares in recent weeks but the budget industry is here to stay, analysts say.

The clearest indication came last week when Cathay Pacific, Singapore Airlines and United Airlines dropped their prices for a return Singapore-Hong Kong flight by more than half in some cases.

Their moves came in the same week Singapore's first budget airline, Valuair, began flying the popular Singapore-Hong Kong route at a promotional rate of $300 for return tickets. From fares previously ranging between $420 and $750, the three airlines are now offering round-trip tickets to Hong Kong priced between $294 and $368.

When asked about the timing of its price cuts, United Airlines' Singapore office general manager Laurence Chin did not give any specific reason but acknowledged competition was one.

'Various factors such as market trends, loads, competition and market opportunity come into play in determining fares,' he said. 'We are all playing in the same market and it is natural for us to move and adjust our prices according to market conditions.'

Singapore Airlines responded even more vaguely to detailed questions about its reasons for dropping prices on the route, with a spokesman referring to the company's goal of being 'competitive in every market'.

Although the major carriers may not want to say so directly, Centre for Asia Pacific Aviation managing director Peter Harbison said the major players wanted to hurt their new competitors while they were starting out.

'They certainly feel threatened by the new budget carrier movement. But it's also a very natural market response - when a new price comes into the market, other airlines will match it,' he said. 'They're also sending out the message to anybody else who wants to come into the market: We're going to make it tough for you.'

The region's pioneer low-cost carrier, Malaysia's AirAsia, said it faced similar competition from heavyweight Malaysian Airlines (MAS) when it first started in 2001.

'When we started there was a price war with MAS,' a company spokeswoman said. 'We started with domestic flights first. When we started the Singapore-Bangkok route (in March this year), MAS lowered their prices as well.'

Mr Harbison said that despite the major airlines' deeper pockets and experience in the industry, trying to crush the budget carriers while they were in their infancy was futile. 'There's no way in the world that the majors will succeed in squashing out the budget industry. It's an irresistible force,' he said.

Another aviation analyst, DBS Vickers Securities' Chris Sanda, said the major carriers will not be able to match the low-cost airlines on price over a sustained period. 'They (no-frills carriers) are able to offer tickets at much cheaper prices, and their main market is the leisure travellers,' Mr Sanda said. 'What (the big airlines) are trying to do is to narrow the perceived discount ... but the budget airlines will still be able to offer tickets at a much lower cost.'

The AirAsia spokeswoman agreed, saying the company's lower operating costs had helped it survive despite the ongoing competition with Malaysia Airlines' SuperSaver offers. 'We have one of the lowest costs in the world. Managing our costs effectively is one of the keys to our success,' she said.

AirAsia began in 2001 with just two Boeing 737-300 jets flying Malaysia's domestic routes, amid scepticism the low-cost concept would not take off with regional travellers. But it now operates a fleet of 14 Boeing 737-300 aircraft throughout Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Brunei and Singapore.

Its success has sparked a slew of other local airlines, with Valuair the first of three that intend to open in Singapore to service the region. AirAsia is also hoping to set up a base in the city-state and Thailand has seen the emergence of intra-nation Nok Air. - AFP

Copyright © 2004 Singapore Press Holdings Ltd. All rights reserved.
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Old May 12th, 2004, 04:22 PM   #95
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Valuair to resolve landing rights problem with Jakarta soon

Time is GMT + 8 hours
Posted: 12 May 2004 1951 hrs

By Asha Popatlal, Channel NewsAsia

SINGAPORE : The mystery over a missing procedure that clipped Valuair's wings and prevented it from taking off on its maiden flight to Jakarta on Monday has yielded some answers.

Indonesian authorities told Channel NewsAsia that a new procedure for foreign carriers flying into the country had just been put in.

And Valuair was the first to apply for landing rights after this development.

Both Valuair personnel and the Indonesian airport authorities have been meeting to go through the documents.

And the problem is expected to be resolved in the next few days.

Meanwhile, Valuair says most of its passengers who had bought tickets for Jakarta have taken up the option to fly on Garuda instead of asking for refunds. - CNA

Copyright © 2004 MCN International Pte Ltd
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Old May 12th, 2004, 06:49 PM   #96
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Good to hear the problem is almost solved !

Anyway from the article.... Hmm i smell fishy here..not from valuair but from The indonesian side...this rules maybe made to protect the market for Indonesian carriers. I assume 24 local airlines in Indonesia are complaining about the influx of foreign carriers in Indonesia, after Airasia put the price between Jakarta - JB from only 15 dollars then Virgin Blue australia is also interested....and now this Valuair...i guess the local carriers just started complaining to the transport minister (cry like a baby ) to ask for tightening the rules on LCC procedures.

I feel sorry though, to the ship/ferry , train and bus industry after the showdown of Low cost airlines, because they lost their market to the airlines industry, so it shows the good and bad side of LLC.
I hope with these new era of air transport industry, these wont means "sacrifice" to many other transports industry too.

Amen to that !

cheers
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Old May 12th, 2004, 07:00 PM   #97
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icic...I just hope that the cheapest mode of transport that can be offered to ordinary Indonesians should prevail, for they naturally would benefit? I suppose when we discuss about protectionaism, sometimes it seems like a tussle between national (and often the upper class) interests and that of ordinary citizens!
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Old May 13th, 2004, 05:36 AM   #98
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Valuair to get Jakarta landing rights... finally

MAY 13, 2004

By Karamjit Kaur

VALUAIR, which was forced to cancel its maiden flight to Jakarta on Monday because it could not secure landing rights, should get its permit today or tomorrow.

The director of air traffic at Indonesia's Ministry of Transportation, Ms Lilin Ambaruyati, told The Straits Times yesterday in a telephone interview: 'All the papers have been submitted and seem to be in order. We're doing the final checks.'

She would not specify what held up the permit, saying only that Singapore's first budget airline had not submitted the full set of documents required for an air-worthiness certificate to be issued.

She added: 'Under the new policy which was introduced recently, all airlines have to file the documents with the Indonesian civil aviation authority.'

On Tuesday, Valuair's executive director Jimmy Lau told The Straits Times that on Sunday morning, the day before the carrier's scheduled flight to Jakarta, the airline received a faxed copy of the air-worthiness certificate. But several hours later, the team was informed there was a 'minor problem'. In the end, all 51 passengers on Flight VF202 had to be transferred to a Garuda Indonesia flight.

When asked about what appeared to be a recall of the air-worthiness certificate, Ms Ambaruyati declined to comment, saying that all was in order now.

Valuair, meanwhile, suspended ticket sales for its Jakarta flights and sent a three-man team headed by executive director Arthur Lim to the Indonesian capital to sort the matter out.

Contacted yesterday, Mr Lau said: 'Our team had a good meeting with the Indonesian authorities this morning. We hope to get the landing rights soon.'

So far, three passengers with confirmed seats to Jakarta have cancelled their bookings and have been refunded the fare, while the rest have opted to fly Garuda Indonesia at no extra charge to them.

He stressed that flights to the airline's two other destinations, Bangkok and Hong Kong, are not affected.

Valuair's round-trip promotion fare of $138 to Jakarta is the lowest in the market, but the airline faces tough competition from the full-service carriers.

There are 489 flights to Jakarta weekly.

According to travel portal Zuji, more than 10 airlines, including Singapore Airlines, Emirates and Cathay Pacific, are offering round-trip tickets at under $200.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Old May 13th, 2004, 06:08 AM   #99
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Coming soon: Budget airfares at a glance

May 13, 2004

Aseanta tie-up with Zuji travel portal will make price comparisons a breeze

By Janice Wong

Good news for air travellers: Soon you will be able to compare the fares of the various regional budget airlines in one integrated website.

Low-cost carriers usually sell tickets directly through their own call centres and corporate websites.

When the integrated website is ready, travellers will be able to plan their travel more efficiently by comparing prices and checking for seat availability on the flights.

The Asean Tourism Association (Aseanta) and Asia-Pacific online travel portal Zuji are developing the site.

Aseanta comprises public and private tourism sectors such as national tourist organisations, airlines, hotel associations, and travel agencies.

Its executive director, Mr Sebastian Lo, told Streats this week that he has engaged a European software company to design the site, expected to be ready by the year’s end.

Mr Lo said: “These smaller airlines created a new cost-conscious market that we can target to promote intra-Asean travel.

“These airlines fly limited routes to niche destinations. So putting them on the same platform will, in a way, expand their network.

“More people travelling means more business for inbound tour operators, airport transfers, hotels and tourist spots. Everybody wins.”

Zuji is also enhancing its site to allow budget airlines to list at a fee that is on par with their direct distribution costs.

Last month, Zuji’s Australian site started displaying Qantas, Virgin Blue and Jetstar domestic fares in a comparison format. Bookings can also be accepted on this site.

Zuji hopes to connect more budget airlines to its global reservation system.

Mr Martin Symes, Zuji’s commercial executive director, said: “This offers low-cost carriers an alternate, cost effective distribution channel.

“Zuji expects to make further announcements later this year.

“One fantastic element to the entry of no-frills airlines is that, through their online booking focus, they are helping to raise awareness of the ability to book and pay for travel securely online.”

These initiatives are indicative of market players eager to respond to the burgeoning budget airline industry.

Mr Robert Khoo, chief executive of National Association of Travel Agents Singapore, said travel agents welcome Aseanta’s initiative.

“Budget airlines usually sell direct to customers because they don’t want to pay commission. We want to work with them to turn the threat into an opportunity,” he said.

When ready, Aseanta’s sales model will be similar to its existing Asean Hip-Hop pass, which offers a discounted package consisting of a hotel pass, a tour pass and an air pass for the budget airlines.

Bookings would still need to be done through a travel agent after the traveller has decided his itinerary from the site.

The intention is to include not only budget airlines such as AirAsia and Valuair but also niche non-national carriers such as the full-service Bangkok Airways.

Mr Lo said that Aseanta is in preliminary discussion with Indonesia’s PB Air, Lion Air and Merpati Airlines.

Valuair executive director Jimmy Lau is keen on Aseanta’s initiative but wonders about the logistics.

“This is an interesting concept that can work, provided all parties cooperate closely,” he said.

Copyright © 2003 Singapore Press Holdings Ltd. All rights reserved.
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Old May 13th, 2004, 09:17 AM   #100
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Yeah, I should hope too the government will protect the other transport industry, not by intervening the business but by limiting the ticket price so it wont get low as bus or train tickets. Its really hard though for government to protect the national interest or the airlines industry, because in Indonesia when you fly within Indonesia you will also pay for the airport tax and national tax which will go to the government and airport authorities.... unlike bus and train industry, so it means government of course will consider in the side of airline industry.
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