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Old March 8th, 2015, 04:03 AM   #21
ThatOneGuy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapece View Post
I'm saying that it doesn't blend at all in my opinion. Nature is very rarely minimalistic, so an object with a minimalist look is in strong contrast with a place full of trees (I can't think of something less minimalist than a tree), and even the color is not taken from the chromatic palette of the place.
I think that was the intention. Contrast is a huge part of architecture.
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Old March 8th, 2015, 04:03 AM   #22
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Ironically, Le Corbusier's skyscrapers were intended for the wealthy
what I've read is that the french government wanted to build popular apartments and commissioned the project to Le Corbusier who built the Unitè d'Habitation.
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Old March 8th, 2015, 04:07 AM   #23
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I think that was the intention. Contrast is a huge part of architecture.
And I have no problem with that (if I like the results), but you should concede that it's the exact opposite of the phylosophy of the organic architecture.
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Old March 8th, 2015, 04:11 AM   #24
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Mill Owners Association Building, Ahmedabad, India (Le Corbusier, 1951-54)

Mill Owners Association Building by mloosley, on Flickr

Mill Owners Association Building by mloosley, on Flickr
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Old March 8th, 2015, 04:17 AM   #25
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Unite D'Habitation shouldn't be compared to the commieblocks that tried to copy it. Corbusier had vision - his building works. The cheaply built knockoffs that followed didn't. It's like comparing the Chrysler Building to the Al Kazim Towers.
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Old March 9th, 2015, 12:32 AM   #26
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excellent comment...
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Old March 9th, 2015, 05:39 PM   #27
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By the way, I wasn't suggesting that the Unitè d'habitation is the most horrible thing ever built (even if I don't like it)... I'm just saying that considering the huge fame of Le Corbusier (basically with Gaudi and Frank Lloyd Wright I think that many consider him the greatest architect of the century) personally I consider him overrated. I can think of hundreds if not thousands of brutalist buildings that I consider more beautiful.
Anyway I like more his buildings in India.

Last edited by mapece; March 9th, 2015 at 05:44 PM.
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Old March 11th, 2015, 01:19 AM   #28
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I need to rant a bit about this.

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Originally Posted by JMGA196 View Post
Le Corbusier was a genius.
I greatly admire the Church in Firminy and the Notre Dame du Haut as well as a few other works. But lets face it, the man was a bit of an ogre. These isolated examples of beauty seem like whimsies compared to his Haussmann-like scheme for Paris, the Plan Voisin, something he would have been universally hated for had he been given the go-ahead. His true posterity is what he didn't do to Paris.

To be fair, Le Corbusier wrote:

"The street consists of a thousand different buildings, but we have got used to the beauty of ugliness for that has meant making the best of our misfortune. Those thousand houses are dingy and utterly discordant one with another. It is appalling, but we pass on our way. On Sundays, when they are empty, the streets reveal their full horror. But except during those dismal hours men and women are elbowing their way along them, the shops are ablaze, and every aspect of human life pullutates throughout their length. Those who have eyes in their heads can find plenty to amuse them in this sea of lusts and faces. It is better than the theatre, better than what we read in novels. The street of to-day can sustain its human drama. It can glitter under the brillance of a new form of light. It can smile through its patchwork of advertisements. It is the well-trodden path of the eternal pedestrian, a relic of the centuries, a dislocated organ that can no longer function."

He was probably correct. But his ideas for a new Paris were even more stale and uninspiring than Haussmann's. Every neighborhood described in his words are now beloved by most modern day Parisians and visitors.

Le Corbusier's Paris, had he succeeded, would have destroyed the 3rd and 4th arrondissements on the right bank of the Seine. This area today is among the most architecturally important neighborhoods in the city, including the Marais district..

He wished to replace all of that with this:
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Old March 11th, 2015, 06:43 AM   #29
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That was only a concept, I don`t think he ever expected it to actually be built. Plenty of famous architects drew up crazy urban plans at some point.

Remember, it was proposed in the 1920s. Completely ahead of its time.
It would have been nice if like four of them were built.
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Old March 11th, 2015, 07:54 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
That was only a concept, I don`t think he ever expected it to actually be built. Plenty of famous architects drew up crazy urban plans at some point.

Remember, it was proposed in the 1920s. Completely ahead of its time.
It would have been nice if like four of them were built.
At the cost of some of Paris? I can't say i agree with Le Corbusier but his urban planning/5 points were revolutionary. For better or for worse....
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Old March 11th, 2015, 03:47 PM   #31
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Cesar Pelli. He keeps coming up again and again with the same design - all his other ones, which incidentally were much more successful, were designed by others in the firm or even in one case, outisde - the exasperated President of Malaysia who sketched out the Petronas Towers for him.

A world of bland - groundbreaking for the 70s, not so much for the noughties:

HK and New Jersey
image hosted on flickr


London and NYC



San Francisco and Santiago




For the Petronas towers, the brief was to have twin towers reflecting the Islamic design and heritage - Pelli submitted numerous proposals of square, blocky towers with an array of bullshit alluding to the forced Islamic-ness of each. Confounded in the end the president sketched out this, and sent it to him:



to create this, 'his' most successful work to date:

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Old March 12th, 2015, 08:07 AM   #32
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Without a shadow of a doubt Gehry.
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Old March 12th, 2015, 09:23 AM   #33
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I think an 'underrated architects' thread would be much more interesting. Calling something overrated doesn't do anything except piss people off.
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Old March 12th, 2015, 12:00 PM   #34
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Agree completely about Libeskind, Gehry and Pelli.

Largely agree about Zaha too. BUT, importantly, her office does undeniably produce some truly beautiful work, and her style has become massively influential worldwide.

The biggest criticism you can level at her is that a fire station in Europe looks like the museum in Africa looks like the opera house in Asia looks like an item of her furniture for sale in Clerkenwell. Shape-making in other words. The fact that they're sometimes beautiful shapes doesn't quite make up for this IMHO.

My favourite practices, other than my own of course , are ones like Snohetta and Zumthor for the spiritual soul of their work at its best, and RSHP (Rogers) for their sheer attention to detail and rigour of design.
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Old March 13th, 2015, 12:23 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
I think an 'underrated architects' thread would be much more interesting. Calling something overrated doesn't do anything except piss people off.
for different reasons:

Carlo Scarpa - actually in Italy is revered by many as a genius, but I don't see him mentioned often in discussions regarding the great architects of the century)

Ray Kappe

Laurie Baker
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Old March 16th, 2015, 02:14 PM   #36
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daniel libeskind
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Old March 16th, 2015, 02:42 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
That was only a concept, I don`t think he ever expected it to actually be built.
So what difference does it make? He considered it to be the best way, that's enough. No matter how feasible it was.

Quote:
Plenty of famous architects drew up crazy urban plans at some point.
Yes, but he was the most influential. That makes him the one to blame the most.

Quote:
Remember, it was proposed in the 1920s. Completely ahead of its time.
'Ahead of its time' doesn't always mean 'good'.

Quote:
It would have been nice if like four of them were built.
It may only seem nice when looking from high above (preferably on a model). From the ground level it would have looked rather differently and enormously far further from nice.
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Old March 16th, 2015, 06:50 PM   #38
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So what difference does it make? He considered it to be the best way, that's enough. No matter how feasible it was.
So what if he did? You weren't anybody as an artist or designer back in those days if you didn't have some sort of outlandish ideals.

Quote:
'Ahead of its time' doesn't always mean 'good'.
It means you can't judge it with hindsight bias. This was probably the first modernist multitower plan ever conceived and knowing Corbusier he would have built it high quality.

Quote:
Yes, but he was the most influential. That makes him the one to blame the most.
Not really. He had a certain set of specific ideas, many planners copying him did not adhere to them. And how could they? They usually had to plan in such short time and very cheaply. You can't blame one man for every problem regarding the complete revolution of the neighbourhood system, which, by the way, would have happened even if Corbusier had never been alive.

Quote:
It may only seem nice when looking from high above (preferably on a model). From the ground level it would have looked rather differently and enormously far further from nice.
Depends on the build quality and the greenery in the area.

Last edited by ThatOneGuy; March 16th, 2015 at 07:03 PM.
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Old March 17th, 2015, 12:20 PM   #39
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So what if he did? You weren't anybody as an artist or designer back in those days if you didn't have some sort of outlandish ideals.


It means you can't judge it with hindsight bias. This was probably the first modernist multitower plan ever conceived and knowing Corbusier he would have built it high quality.
talking for instance of the Ville Savoye, it was built in so high quality that the Savoye family said it was completely unlivable.
http://misfitsarchitecture.com/2011/...-villa-savoye/

"It is raining in the hall, it’s raining on the ramp and the wall of the garage is absolutely soaked [….] it’s still raining in my bathroom, which floods in bad weather, as the water comes in through the skylight. The gardener’s walls are also wet through."

"After innumerable demands you have finally accepted that this house which you built in 1929 in uninhabitable…. Please render it inhabitable immediately. I sincerely hope that I will not have to take recourse to legal action."

is it really ahead of its time something that has problems that a traditional house does not have?
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Old March 17th, 2015, 12:31 PM   #40
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Those comments were from the 1930s. They have renovated the house (even though it was abandoned for many years) recently and now it is perfectly fine while still sticking to the original style.

This is low quality:

Corbusier's stuff was not. At least not visually low quality

Last edited by ThatOneGuy; March 17th, 2015 at 12:37 PM.
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