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Old November 9th, 2005, 05:04 AM   #101
SinCity
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Here are some more pics of the current Split Airport terminal .....











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Old November 9th, 2005, 01:47 PM   #102
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Super!

Ako zbilja budu išli po tom planu bit će odlično!

Slike su ludilo! Ovo je definitivno najlipši aerodrom u HR!
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Old November 9th, 2005, 04:06 PM   #103
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Nice pics !
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Old November 10th, 2005, 04:21 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mate_Balota
Super!

Ako zbilja budu išli po tom planu bit će odlično!

Slike su ludilo! Ovo je definitivno najlipši aerodrom u HR!
Yep. I think so too. I suspected the canopy was light up at night, but I had no idea it looked that colourful. I think its the niciest looking airport in Croatia. It will look heaps cool when it gets enlarged.
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Old November 10th, 2005, 04:23 AM   #105
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Zagreb Airport news

Finally, after much waiting, the Croatian minister responsible for airports and the like has confirmed that pretty much all planning and financing regarding the new Zagreb Airport terminal is complete. The master plan has been ready for ages. Property issues are virtually completed and they are set to commence construction in 2006.

Hopefully we'll have construction pics as this beauty evolves.
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Old November 10th, 2005, 03:34 PM   #106
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OK, just talked to Hrvoje Defar, he is one of the Directors at Zagreb airport, he was quite informative and gave me loads of clues as to what is going on...

First of all, Airport hasn't got new master plan as of yet, the new terminal is in workings BUT nothing is final yet, Feasibility study has just been completed by Manchester based ASM Associates who specialise in traffic and transport studies, first study was made by Rolland Berger (German Consultants) way back in 2003, but this study needed bit of updating, ASM did final feasibility study and Specialist Architects who specialize in Airport Terminals where invited to do architectural Designs, Architects Scott Associates from Toronto Canada, have just finished there designs and currently discussion are taking place about implementation of the design and feasibility study based on new designs... http://www.saai.ca/airframe.htm - they are updating there site...

Consultations should end with in next few weeks, Final works on designs should be complete by the end of this year, (December 15th) and construction should start on new terminal sometimes early in 2006, April being most likely date as start of construction works... New Terminal is slightly larger than NACO proposed Design with 12-15 sky bridges, 58000sqm terminal and ample amount for expansion...

2nd Runway should run semi parallel with current runway some 2.5km away, giving ample amount of land for new terminal and expansion...
New Airport terminal is set to cost about 150€ million but it is going to be a lot larger and have greater capacity than NACO original plans envisaged...

all for now...
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Last edited by mic of Orion; November 15th, 2005 at 03:31 PM.
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Old November 12th, 2005, 04:19 PM   #107
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I want to know how do you exactly calculate the terminal capacity?

The number of jetways,check-in desks,area.......

Is there some forula maybe?
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Old November 13th, 2005, 12:11 AM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mate_Balota
I want to know how do you exactly calculate the terminal capacity?

The number of jetways,check-in desks,area.......

Is there some forula maybe?
it is very simple, sky bridges x 15 hours x 364 days and you should get capacity of the terminal...

Example new terminal in Zagreb (new master plan calls for 15 sky bridges)

Capacity of the terminal should look something like this:

15 Sky Bridges (jetways) 15 hours x364 days x 100 passengers = 8.200 000, absolute maxim capacity should be around 10 million passengers...

A some knowledge of Airport operations and turnaround for each aircraft also helps, example single jetway in 15 hour shift can service 18 aircraft, this is a average... Minimum landing distance between aircrafts is 50 sec (meaning distance between aircrafts when landing can not be lower than 10km)... An passenger aircraft flies about 250m/sec...

An Runway like at Zagreb Airport can land maximum 22 Aircrafts per hour, with same number of take offs, giving it max capacity of 45 aircrafts per hour...

You multiply this with hours airport is open for traffic, you get maximum capacity in terms of airport operations (take offs and landings)...

Example Heathrow Airport in London has only 2 runways, one for take offs and one for landings, Heathrow airport capacity per 15hour day is about 1080 Landings and Take offs, or about 400 000 landings a year... I think Max capacity of Heathrow over 18 hour shift, is about 1300 Landings or about 480 000 Landings per year...

Heathrow desperately needs third runway...
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Last edited by mic of Orion; November 13th, 2005 at 03:05 PM.
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Old November 13th, 2005, 06:28 AM   #109
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I wish Pleso, Zracna Luka Zagreb gets the new terminal soon. Whats the time frame? Any word on the time frame? last time I lived in Zagreb there was talk but that was years ago and since then, no expansion. Is the expansion right now justfied, is there enough traffic?

IMO Zagreb Airport has a huge potential amongst all the other former yugoslav airports. I think there's a greater amount of Croatians living overseas than there are any other former yugoslav nationalities, the numbers are there to be tapped.

Trying to get a flight from Australia, we usually have to transit in Vienna, Istanbul, Frankfurt. If just only there were direct flights, it won't turn out to be 43 hour journey with all these transits, based on my last experience its such a waste of time.

I think Skyservice did a Toronto-Zagreb route this summer, Malaysia Airlines did a Kuala Lumpur-Vienna-Zagreb route some years ago, connecting to flights accross Australia from KL. Both airlines trying to caputure the overseas Croatian market. The market is there, accross the America's and Australia.

I definately think Zagreb Airport has the potential of being a hub to other former Yugoslav destinations.
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Old November 13th, 2005, 03:50 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subangite
I wish Pleso, Zracna Luka Zagreb gets the new terminal soon. Whats the time frame? Any word on the time frame? last time I lived in Zagreb there was talk but that was years ago and since then, no expansion. Is the expansion right now justfied, is there enough traffic?

IMO Zagreb Airport has a huge potential amongst all the other former yugoslav airports. I think there's a greater amount of Croatians living overseas than there are any other former yugoslav nationalities, the numbers are there to be tapped.

Trying to get a flight from Australia, we usually have to transit in Vienna, Istanbul, Frankfurt. If just only there were direct flights, it won't turn out to be 43 hour journey with all these transits, based on my last experience its such a waste of time.

I think Skyservice did a Toronto-Zagreb route this summer, Malaysia Airlines did a Kuala Lumpur-Vienna-Zagreb route some years ago, connecting to flights accross Australia from KL. Both airlines trying to caputure the overseas Croatian market. The market is there, accross the America's and Australia.

I definately think Zagreb Airport has the potential of being a hub to other former Yugoslav destinations.

Good questions and we have been talking about new terminal here a bit, Zagreb is getting new passenger terminal, works start April 2006 and terminal should be open for business sometimes in mid 2008.

NACO a Dutch consultancy made sort of a master plan for Zagreb Airport way back in 1997, and according these plans Zagreb should have had new passenger terminal already... Nothing happened of it, HDZ who where in charge of city council in late 90's where to corrupt, egotistical to make any headways... New plans for Zagreb airport where made again in 2003 and Airforce gave land at Pleso airport for new terminal in 2004...

Only recently did new master plan got made, but was subsequently rejected in favour of new (still in works) master plan and feasibility study... I know only few things, that the terminal will be slightly larger than NACO design about 58 000sqm, and have 15 instead of 11 sky bridges (jetways). Simple design plan is preferred, passenger terminal like in Munich has been discussed and it is most preferred option, but as Canadians are designing the new terminal we can only guess what they going to come with... I'd like to think something spectacular, lol...

Budget of 150€ million has been agreed on for new passenger terminal, if you look at Warsaw new Airport you'd see what you can get for 150€ million... If they got 180€ million and all is spent on terminal than you can build relatively large terminal, say 70-80 000sqm with 20 sky bridges (jetways)....

Would new passenger terminal justify the investment you ask? I hope it does, in 1980 Zagreb had 1.9 million passengers, Vienna had 5 million and Belgrade about 2.3 million... If way back than new terminal was built Airport would hade grew to at least 5 million by 1990 and 7.5-8 million by 2005 (this includes war period)...


Delta, Air Canada at one point planed to restart there Zagreb routes but due to the oil price and other issues they never did..
Many airline today fly to Zagreb but most are only on semi schedule...

Currently Airlines which fly to Zagreb:

Aeroflot x 4 flights per week
Air France x 8 flights per week
Alitalia x 15 flights per week
Austrian Air x 28 times a week
BNS (Brussels based) x 3 flights per week just started last month
CSA x 8 flights per week
German Wings x 24 flights per week
LOT x 7 flights per week
Lufthansa x 32 flights per week
Malev x 8 flights per week
Turkish Air x 6 flights per week...
Tyrol Air x 3 flights per week
Croatian Airlines x 320 flights per week
Sun Adria x 25 flights per week (charter Based at Zagreb Pleso)

irregular service:

British Air (BA) x 1 flights per week, (plans to fly scheduled service quite soon)
KLM x 1 flights per week (plans to fly scheduled service quite soon)
SAS x 3 flights per week (plans to fly scheduled service quite soon)
Adriatic Air x 5 flights per week,
Dubrovnik Airlines x 3 flights per week
Iberia x 2 flights per month (considering full scheduled service)
Air Bosna x 2 flights per week (plans to fly scheduled service quite soon)
Macedonian Air x 1 flights per week (plans to fly scheduled service quite soon)
Adria Airways x 3 flights per week (primarily s a second hub)
El Al x 2 flights per month
all others x 20 flights per week...
freight flights x 20 flights per week...

Ryan Air, Easy Jet, Sky Europe and few other low cost airlines hope to start flights to Zagreb in 2006...

I predict 2006 will bring nearly 1.75 million passengers and 21 000 landings at Zagreb Airport...

Current passenger terminal has maximum capacity of 2 million passengers a year...
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Last edited by mic of Orion; November 18th, 2005 at 03:26 PM.
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Old November 13th, 2005, 05:38 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subangite
I wish Pleso, Zracna Luka Zagreb gets the new terminal soon. Whats the time frame? Any word on the time frame? last time I lived in Zagreb there was talk but that was years ago and since then, no expansion. Is the expansion right now justfied, is there enough traffic?

IMO Zagreb Airport has a huge potential amongst all the other former yugoslav airports. I think there's a greater amount of Croatians living overseas than there are any other former yugoslav nationalities, the numbers are there to be tapped.

Trying to get a flight from Australia, we usually have to transit in Vienna, Istanbul, Frankfurt. If just only there were direct flights, it won't turn out to be 43 hour journey with all these transits, based on my last experience its such a waste of time.

I think Skyservice did a Toronto-Zagreb route this summer, Malaysia Airlines did a Kuala Lumpur-Vienna-Zagreb route some years ago, connecting to flights accross Australia from KL. Both airlines trying to caputure the overseas Croatian market. The market is there, accross the America's and Australia.

I definately think Zagreb Airport has the potential of being a hub to other former Yugoslav destinations.
Does anybody know the number of passengers that are transfering Zagreb-Frankfurt-xxxxxx

I realy think it would be profitable for Croatia Airlines to buy say 2x A330-200s or 2x A350-800s!

They can use them on Zg-NY,Zg-Toronto,Zg-Sidney.......

Are there ANY plans of such actions?

P.S. Are ther plans for a new control tower at Pleso? The old one doesn t have the visibility of the whole area,especialy when they build a new runway!
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Old November 13th, 2005, 09:54 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mate_Balota
Does anybody know the number of passengers that are transfering Zagreb-Frankfurt-xxxxxx

I realy think it would be profitable for Croatia Airlines to buy say 2x A330-200s or 2x A350-800s!

They can use them on Zg-NY,Zg-Toronto,Zg-Sidney.......

Are there ANY plans of such actions?

P.S. Are ther plans for a new control tower at Pleso? The old one doesn t have the visibility of the whole area,especialy when they build a new runway!
I asked one of the Croatian Airlines directors when he was at World Travel Market about plans for long hull aircrafts, he said they have no plans for such aircrafts in short to medium term...

for other questions, sorry I don't know...
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Old November 14th, 2005, 01:48 AM   #113
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Good information Mike

Some of the Serbs have been saying Belgrade might be the new ex. Yugoslav hub, but I have a high hope that Zagreb will fulfil that position.
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Old November 14th, 2005, 04:23 AM   #114
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Zagreb and Belgrade airports are both different for a number of reasons.

Zagreb competes against other international airports in Croatia such as Split, Dubrovnik, etc. Both of which have 1 million passengers each year. Belgrade is Serbia's only significant international airport. There are small airports in Montenegro but they are no where near as busy to similar ones in Croatia.

Therefore if Zagreb was Croatia's sole international airport as to what Belgrade is in Serbia, then passenger numbers would be much more massive than currently in Belgrade.

Secondly, Croatia is a major tourism mecca. Serbia isn't a tourism destination. Therefore Zagreb and all other Croatian airports will continue to grow and grow in the decades ahead. Belgrade's airport will reach a maximum soon and will never likely see any significant expansion in the decades ahead apart from some minor renovations here and there.

Thirdly, both countries have large emigrant communities, Croatia more so than Serbia which of course will help sustain passenger levels equally for both countries.

Lastly, Serbia is planning to turn Belgrade airport into an air transport hub. I'm not sure how this will go as I am unfamiliar with their plans and also what other competion exists in our neighbourhood.

Croatia doesn't have to focus on air transportation as much because the Croatian coast has many large shipping ports. For example the Port of Rijeka which will become the new Rotterdam of the south handling freight to and from Asia and the Middle East. Rijeka and Rotterdam are the top two most deepest ports in Europe which can handle the biggest of the biggest, of all ships.

I think in summary Belgrade airport will continue to be Serbia's sole major international airport with moderate passenger growth in the years ahead before it tops out. Belgrade will most likely develop into a successful air freight airport.

Zagreb, Split, Dubrovnik, Rijeka and Pula airports will continue to grow significantly in the decades ahead to which there will be many airport expansions.

Cheers
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Old November 14th, 2005, 04:37 AM   #115
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Well said mic of Orion and SinCity. Its been informative.

I guess Croatia Airlines flying long haul is a tad far fetched, since now that Croatia Airlines is an regional airline member of Star Alliance, they'll feed from and to long haul flights out of big Star Alliance hubs such as Frankfurt, Munich, Vienna, Copenhagen.

Perhaps there is no need for a Zagreb long haul hub. Just wishful thinking on my part.
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Old November 14th, 2005, 04:57 AM   #116
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Silly me. I forgot to mention that as quality of life improves in this region then no doubt many of the citizens will be able to afford more and more travel abroad especially to more distant and exotic locations.

So therefore it is fair to say that Belgrade, Zagreb and other airports in this region will continue to see some good growth in the years ahead.

On the issue of hubs ... I doubt any of these airports will become a regional hub. Other airports have beaten us to this a long time ago.
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Old November 14th, 2005, 05:06 AM   #117
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Whatever happened to JAT? I remember flying JAT as a child when I was in Croatia on holidays, and afterwards thought it must have stood for 'Jugoslavian Air Turbulence'.
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Old November 14th, 2005, 05:12 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony P
Whatever happened to JAT? I remember flying JAT as a child when I was in Croatia on holidays, and afterwards thought it must have stood for 'Jugoslavian Air Turbulence'.
lol, they are now Serbian based Airline they no longer fly to Zagreb or Croatia, they just bought 6 new Airbus A319 and 2 are on option... They had few problems recently like Mechanic Strike and one of the B737 almost crashing in Tel Aviv, but otherwise they are still flying...

Croatia has its own Airline you guessed, Croatian Airlines, lol and there are new start ups, 4 of them Air Adriatic, Sun Adria, Dubrovnik Airlines and one other, forgot the name...

Croatian Airlines is most successful of all former Yugoslav airlines, with 1.75 million passengers and revenue over 300 million U$, Adria Airways (Slovenia) is also very successful with nearly million passengers a year (2004)...
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Old November 14th, 2005, 05:25 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SinCity
I think in summary Belgrade airport will continue to be Serbia's sole major international airport with moderate passenger growth in the years ahead before it tops out. Belgrade will most likely develop into a successful air freight airport.
Yeh, I agree with you on this, because of that new cargo centre which will be constructed at Belgrade Airport.

I'm not sure either how Belgrade will become a major air traffic hub, but it won't happen anytime soon that's for sure. Budapest, Warsaw, Prague would be way ahead of Belgrade. Also, I'd say Zagreb would be ahead of Belgrade in terms of being a new hub, Croatia's investment ministry is much more flexible than Serbia's, meaning more airlines would prefer to go to Zagreb. I remember, when Ryan Air wanted to come to Serbia, their dickhead of an investment minister said absolutely no low-cost carriers would be allowed to fly to Serbia, because it would stand as large competition against Jat Airways(which is certainly not a value for quality airline). Serbia is concentrating on Jat becoming a bigger airline when they haven't got the proper management team.

All I can say - Keep up the good work Zagreb
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Old November 14th, 2005, 05:27 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mate_Balota

P.S. Are ther plans for a new control tower at Pleso? The old one doesn t have the visibility of the whole area,especialy when they build a new runway!
O yes a new 55m Control tower is planed with new terminal, going to be sort of centrepiece (quoting one of my sources)
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