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Old April 7th, 2013, 08:59 PM   #401
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Typical Dutch butter on your head remark. Who cares where the airline is from as long as they offer clean, cheap and safe ways to go from A to B.
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Old April 8th, 2013, 12:03 AM   #402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SypsiloN View Post
...and what do the English and the Americans do ? do they buy the A380, Yes they do, well then of course we need an A380, Vive La France, Vive La Republique............
Since Air France ordered their A380s before the 2 English orders and the 0 American orders you really can't say that they look at the UK and the USA. Same goes with the A340 and the 777-300ERs as well, Air France also ordered those planes long before any UK or US airline did.

The only non commercial reason why Air France might have bought the A380 is to support Airbus and the French economy. But since they also placed some large Boeing 777 orders around the same time we can conclude that nationalism wasn't the main factor for Air France.

And Air France also have enough routes where they can easily fill up their A380s, it's not like that the A380 or any other planes in the fleet are the reason for their financial troubles. They have the same problems as enough other big French companies in various industries. Those outdated labor laws are not specific for Air France, just to name an example. Having all those low yielding routes to all the overseas territories also isn't helping them with becoming profitable.
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Old April 8th, 2013, 01:42 AM   #403
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Quote:
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I feel AF has suffered in a large part due to an undesirable airport hub and the reputation that came with it.

I'm always amazed by the reputation of Roissy airport. I don't think it's deserved.
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Old April 30th, 2013, 04:32 PM   #404
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The 777th Boeing 777 built operating as AF256 from Paris-CDG.
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Old May 28th, 2013, 11:14 AM   #405
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http://spotters.net.ua/file/?id=79028&size=large
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Old May 30th, 2013, 06:11 PM   #406
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Source : http://pic.feeyo.com/posts/585/5857665.html

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Old June 1st, 2013, 09:01 PM   #407
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PH-BVK "Yellowstone National Park"

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KLM PH-BVK Boeing 777 Bye Bye Flight by moonm, on Flickr

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KLM PH-BVK Boeing 777 Bye Bye Flight by moonm, on Flickr

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KLM PH-BVK Boeing 777 Bye Bye Flight by moonm, on Flickr
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 05:20 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
Since Air France ordered their A380s before the 2 English orders and the 0 American orders you really can't say that they look at the UK and the USA. Same goes with the A340 and the 777-300ERs as well, Air France also ordered those planes long before any UK or US airline did.

The only non commercial reason why Air France might have bought the A380 is to support Airbus and the French economy. But since they also placed some large Boeing 777 orders around the same time we can conclude that nationalism wasn't the main factor for Air France.
Well, never bet on that with the French............

Quote:
And Air France also have enough routes where they can easily fill up their A380s, it's not like that the A380 or any other planes in the fleet are the reason for their financial troubles. They have the same problems as enough other big French companies in various industries. Those outdated labor laws are not specific for Air France, just to name an example. Having all those low yielding routes to all the overseas territories also isn't helping them with becoming profitable.
I like your answer, but don't take my reaction too serious. I'm not that well informed on the subject.

Although it's a fact that when KLM and Air France merged there were doubts on the Dutch side if the French didn't shift, lets say, it's problems and the way they run their business, on the Dutch side.

The French have a reputation, especially when it comes to (partially) government owned businesses.

Last edited by SypsiloN; June 3rd, 2013 at 07:31 PM.
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 06:51 PM   #409
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SypsiloN View Post
Typical French attitude,

In reality though;
- KLM is the modern, efficient, well run, profit making airline
- Air France is the less efficient, loss making, overweight airline

KLM asks itself, from a business, financial point of view, do we need an A380 ?
Air France, like French are, ask themselves; do we need an A380 as a status symbol and what do the English and the Americans do ? do they buy the A380, Yes they do, well then of course we need an A380, Vive La France, Vive La Republique............
sorry but if you are a big company how can yo not have a single A380?
And i don't understand how this company (which is good) from a country which is not touristic at all (netherlands) could perform so well ?
incredible
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 07:37 PM   #410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SypsiloN View Post
Air France, like French are, ask themselves; "do we need an A380 as a status symbol and what do the English and the Americans do ? do they buy the A380, Yes they do, well then of course we need an A380, Vive La France, Vive La Republique............"
Oh and by the way; I forgot to add the "Allo allo" accent to the above part.....
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 08:00 PM   #411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axelferis View Post
sorry but if you are a big company how can yo not have a single A380?
And i don't understand how this company (which is good) from a country which is not touristic at all (netherlands) could perform so well ?
incredible
I think they've chosen not to buy an A380 because it doesn't fit the way they've organized their business, in conjunction with the Schiphol Airport function as an hub-Airport. Air France flying on Paris means that they probably carry more "final destination" passengers, too and from Paris, which means that It probably makes more sense for a large capacity plane like the A380.

And well, does Air France/KLM perform so well ???

I think it's a tough market, I think they feel a lot of competition;

For long and medium distance flights they probably feel a lot of competition from campany's with "oil based" owners like Etihad and Emirates (They can even offord to sponsor a dozen football clubs with ridiculous amounts of money) or low wage/high service carriers from Asia.

and on short range flights (Europe) they probably feel a lot of competition from low costs carriers.

But like I said, I'm not into the subject.
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 10:37 PM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axelferis View Post
sorry but if you are a big company how can yo not have a single A380?
The world's largest airlines do not have them...
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Old June 3rd, 2013, 10:42 PM   #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SypsiloN View Post
Typical French attitude,

In reality though;
- KLM is the modern, efficient, well run, profit making airline
- Air France is the less efficient, loss making, overweight airline

KLM asks itself, from a business, financial point of view, do we need an A380 ?
Air France, like French are, ask themselves; do we need an A380 as a status symbol and what do the English and the Americans do ? do they buy the A380, Yes they do, well then of course we need an A380, Vive La France, Vive La Republique............
Sypsilon, why don't you post your trollish (nearly racist) rants on the Lufthansa thread? AF isn't the only European airline which purchased A380's.

No American-based airlines have bought the A380 so the idea AF did so to do like Americans is beyond silly.

And you dare criticize the "typically French attitude" with such a simple-minded post? Go away you troll.
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Old June 4th, 2013, 12:52 AM   #414
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Quote:
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Sypsilon, why don't you post your trollish (nearly racist) rants on the Lufthansa thread? AF isn't the only European airline which purchased A380's.
Ouch, not too sensitive

Last edited by SypsiloN; June 4th, 2013 at 07:04 PM.
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Old June 4th, 2013, 05:42 AM   #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JiJeLiAnBoY View Post
I'm always amazed by the reputation of Roissy airport. I don't think it's deserved.
I agree, too. Especially for T2E and 2F after visiting it. Not the best airport terminal for sure, but not the worst either. T1 on the other hand, deserves all the bad reputation that CDG has.
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Old June 4th, 2013, 05:17 PM   #416
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I think the terminals 1, 2A, 2B, 2C, and 2D must be refurbished... Has Aerports de Paris any plans about it? Does anybody know if CDG has a thread? xD
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Old June 4th, 2013, 06:44 PM   #417
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Old June 29th, 2013, 06:16 PM   #418
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Some articles in the Dutch Telegraaf and the French La Tribune commenting the (upcoming Q2) results of Air France/KLM which will be fully made public and the end of July. Air France will report a loss and still needs to reduce costs.

So my earlier made comments on the 7th of April, about the typical French (government like) way of running a business, seem to be still true, or to put it better, it's even worse then I already thought.

The last 8 years since the merge of Air France and KLM, KLM made a profit of 3 billion Euro, Air France on the other hand reported a loss of 1 billion Euro.
On top of that Air France reported a loss in the last 5 consecutive years. Since the merger KLM reported just one year of loss.

So Air France is steadliy eating away KLM. The merge of Air France/KLM looks like a farce.

Well done Air France. (tossers)
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Old June 29th, 2013, 07:38 PM   #419
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That's not a typical french way to run enterprises, this is just the way (former) state-owned companies are managed. Fortunately, there are thousands of french companies managed by business minded people and making benefits !
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Old June 29th, 2013, 08:12 PM   #420
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Quote:
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That's not a typical french way to run enterprises, this is just the way (former) state-owned companies are managed. Fortunately, there are thousands of french companies managed by business minded people and making benefits !
You're last sentence is probably right, but;

The French government still has large stakes and/or influence in/on large French businesses, unlike that in most other western country's.

And they don't seem to change there conduct even when it opposes efficiency or things like the European Competition legislation.
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