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Old November 17th, 2015, 03:36 PM   #1
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[Iran] General Urban Discussions

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Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post

Tehran is a very good looking city.

It's probably the best in the Middle East as it's not as Disneyland as Dubai and Doha

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Old November 17th, 2015, 03:50 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
1: You can't compare Tehran to the Persian gulf cities as they are free trade zones and are overwhelmed with foreign investors and companies.
Also the fact that these are coastal cities helps a lot to the image of the city as well...

2: For an Islamic Republic which has very few allies, has been under sanctions and trade embargoes, Tehran is a very good looking city!

Be happy that Tehran hasn't become like Baghdad or something, instead we are progressing day by day.

Doha, Dubai, Abu Dhabi are all wonderful cities, but they lack charm and character... Tehran is real and has that.
That's what I love about my city, even whitout shiny 300m+ skyscrapers!
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:24 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post
1: You can't compare Tehran to the Persian gulf cities as they are free trade zones and are overwhelmed with foreign investors and companies.
Also the fact that these are coastal cities helps a lot to the image of the city as well...

2: For an Islamic Republic which has very few allies, has been under sanctions and trade embargoes, Tehran is a very good looking city!

Be happy that Tehran hasn't become like Baghdad or something, instead we are progressing day by day.

Doha, Dubai, Abu Dhabi are all wonderful cities, but they lack charm and character... Tehran is real and has that.
That's what I love about my city, even whitout shiny 300m+ skyscrapers!
reminds me of ahmadinejad when he said the sanctions have no effect on irans economy

if you like it real i can invite you to this beauty
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:26 PM   #4
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Good one soldier.
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Pics of the most beautiful country

Visit Iran forum

Alitezar's great Tehran thread

The biggest problem with Iranian people is that they don't know just how great their country can be.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:31 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
reminds me of ahmadinejad when he said the sanctions have no effect on irans economy

if you like it real i can invite you to this beauty
Why do you compare everyone to the government... It's kind of pathetic.
Man in'hame neveshtam, to gir dadi be un ye jomle, vaghean motasefam.

+ you can't compare Tehran to an North American city which has a different culture, architecture and standards.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:32 PM   #6
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believe me you would beg for disneyland if you live in a real city
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:33 PM   #7
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Good one soldier.
What is good, the fact that he can not properly answer my post or the fact that he insults everyone when it's not to his liking?
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:34 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
believe me you would beg for disneyland if you live in a real city
Please stay on topic, besides these pictures have nothing to do with Iran or Tehran
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:34 PM   #9
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Seriously, I never agree with you SoldierT, but you got this one right.
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sixty years ago, upon the invitation of the Russian Red Cross, Princess Ashraf Pahlavi, twin sister of the Shah of Iran, went to see Stalin in order to demand the retrieval of Soviet invading forces from Iran. The princess entered the Kremlin where she pleaded with great passion for the liberation of Iran, her motherland. Impressed by her courage, Stalin became all smiles. He said loudly to his rather stern entourage: "Now here is a brave and true patriot." Pravda, June 28, 1946.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:35 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post
Please stay on topic, besides these pictures have nothing to do with Iran or Tehran
Wow Persian_Gulf, you are starting to sound like the IR regime, good job they are getting into your head swiftly.
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sixty years ago, upon the invitation of the Russian Red Cross, Princess Ashraf Pahlavi, twin sister of the Shah of Iran, went to see Stalin in order to demand the retrieval of Soviet invading forces from Iran. The princess entered the Kremlin where she pleaded with great passion for the liberation of Iran, her motherland. Impressed by her courage, Stalin became all smiles. He said loudly to his rather stern entourage: "Now here is a brave and true patriot." Pravda, June 28, 1946.

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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:40 PM   #11
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Wow Persian_Gulf, you are starting to sound like the IR regime, good job they are getting into your head swiftly.
You know what guys, this is just childish! One can not even say his opinion anymore so what's the point of having a discussion and what's the point of this whole forum than?

I am an Iranian citizen who works his butt of in this country to make a living.
It's easy to insult someone behind your screen, I wonder if you would do the same infront of me.

Discussions and disagreements are always good, but only if they happen in a respectable manner!
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Old November 17th, 2015, 05:59 PM   #12
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no one has insulted you
but if you start talking like ahmadinejds baiji scums its our duty to smash that bullshit

you said we are progressing day by day and i said its not like that
you said dubai is disneyland and tehran has charisma cause its real
i posted a real city and said that beeing real doesnt automaticly makes it a better place to live
new chance you choose


















you choose from these citys and please explain why you would live there with your family

and i choose one and explain why i would live there with my family

bebinim in real budan tu che chizi hast
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Old November 17th, 2015, 06:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
no one has insulted you
but if you start talking like ahmadinejds baiji scums its our duty to smash that bullshit
This is not an insult in your opinion?! You have no other duty than respecting other forum members!

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Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
you said we are progressing day by day and i said its not like that
I said our cities are progressing day by day and so are our designers.
I think most of us will agree on that, I was not talking about social welfare and freedom of speech just to make it clear for you.

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Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
you said dubai is disneyland and tehran has charisma cause its real
Dubai is for most people a shopping destination and for business purposes & it's filled with foreign expats.
Cities like Tehran, Istanbul and etc are cities which contain history, charisma, basically it's very diverse.

The reason why Dubai is shiny is because their government is spending all their oil money on a tiny area with a small population.
Other reasons are that Dubai is filled with foreign companies and investors, not because they like Dubai, but because it's a free trade zone, just like Kish is, only we lack the foreign investment and businesess to become a trade hub at the moment.

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Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
i posted a real city and said that beeing real doesnt automaticly makes it a better place to live
new chance you choose
You have posted pictures of one of the worse places someone could live, none of them had anything to do with Iran or Tehran for that matter.
I said we should be glad that Tehran looks like a descent city under the Islamic Republic and not became like Baghdad for example.

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Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
you choose from these citys and please explain why you would live there with your family

and i choose one and explain why i would live there with my family

bebinim in real budan tu che chizi hast
Again, those cities were not related to any of my posts, so there is no point at discussing this with you as it's totally different as what I said.
I would not leave Tehran for another city. Why? The anwser is simple... It's my home!

Last edited by Persian_Gulf; November 17th, 2015 at 06:58 PM.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 07:08 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierT View Post
no one has insulted you
but if you start talking like ahmadinejds baiji scums its our duty to smash that bullshit

you said we are progressing day by day and i said its not like that
you said dubai is disneyland and tehran has charisma cause its real
i posted a real city and said that beeing real doesnt automaticly makes it a better place to live
new chance you choose


















you choose from these citys and please explain why you would live there with your family

and i choose one and explain why i would live there with my family

bebinim in real budan tu che chizi hast
I am not sure if you are on the level SoldierT? Are you seriously comparing an amateur picture of Tehran with a highly stylized one of Hong Kong as realistic? I know Tehran is not the most beautiful city in the world but to rub its nose in the mud like this, to what end? Persian_Gulf is right to point out there are mitigating circumstances and if that is hard to own up to, then how honest is this debate? Or is it just to vent your frustration? And for the sake of condemning the Islamic Government, a realistic evaluation will not do?

Its really true that you can not defeat a dictatorship with propaganda and the only way to gain the upper hand is to make sure your arguments are always factual and honest.

Tehran is real in as much as it has a history of some depth and functions mainly as a living space like London, Mumbai or Tokyo. Dubai is more an investment scheme. Gulf cities are attractive in their own right but they are not mature cities. I believe that was Persian_Gulf's point. It was an obvious point unless one made a point of misunderstanding it. He shouldn't have complained that the debate was going off topic of course, that I guess was exasperation getting the better of him.

BTW I love the last picture of the old lady making bread. Its the most interesting one of your set. I am not even sure why you have Detroit in there, that is Detroit no if I am not mistaken??

The choice is between a make believe Hong Kong, burnt out parts of Detroit, African Village, Iranian Village, Inuit Igloo and Tehran??!!! Really?

If I remember correctly you used to do exactly the same thing before to prove your point? That is not good faith let alone good debating.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 09:29 PM   #15
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Persian Gulf, you said Tehran is the best city in ME, that's not true. Cities like Beirut, Istanbul, Dubai, Tel Aviv, Baku (and even Damascus before the civil war) are way better than Tehran, they have more highrises, their buildings look better, their historic districts are kept in good condition, they have better architecture, they are more attractive, they have more freedom and the list goes one. When it comes to decent capitals, Tehran is probably ranked bottom. Compared to European/North American/East Asian/South American/Southeast Asian capitals, Tehran is quite boring and ugly. Yes maybe it's better than Baghdad, Kabul or some African cities, but i wouldn't consider Tehran as a decent capital. Tehran doesn't have even a "decent" pedestrian or some historic districts to walk at nights, except for some boring restaurants/parks, people don't have a real public space to hang out at nights. The coffee shops are inside the buildings which is boring, contrary to some European cities where people eat and sit in the streets. Even the popular places like Tajrish or Darband, if you've been to other cities they don't look beautiful or attractive enough. I mean can you even compare the Beirut central district to the Laleh Zar or Nasser Khosro in Tehran? And i'm not even going to mention the nightlife which is so boring, because it lacks bars and freedom. Never mind the pollution.

And it's sad, an ancient civilization with immense culture, our cities have nothing to offer compared to other cities in the world.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 10:07 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Persian Gulf, you said Tehran is the best city in ME, it's not true. Cities like Beirut, Istanbul, Dubai, Tel Aviv, Baku (and even Damascus before the civil war) are way better than Tehran
I have never said that Tehran is the best looking city in the Middle East.
What I said, it that Tehran is one of the best looking cities.

I don't consider Istanbul part of the Middle East, but part of Europe, the same goes for Baku.

Cities like Dubai are not comparable to Tehran as they are free trade zones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
they have more highrises, their buildings look better, their historic areas/buildings are generally kept in good condition, they have better architecture, more attractive, they have more freedom and the list goes one.
Tehran has plenty of mid and highrises, it's just very sprawl over a large area. If you go to Velenjak, Elahieh, Farmanieh and etc, you can only find mid and Highrises.

Tehran is attractive for me, because I love the bazaars, urban culture, and the atmosphere, even the trees around vali-asr and no single skyscraper of Dubai could ever replace that for me.

Freedom is not an added value to the looks of a city, but rather to society.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
When it comes to the decent capitals, Tehran is probably ranked bottom. Compared to European/North American/East Asian/South American/South Eastern Asian capitals, Tehran is quite boring and ugly.
This is because you compare Tehran to the wrong cities.

Not a single one of these countries/cities you have mentioned have been through a revolution, war, trade embargoes and sanctions in only 35 years time.

Sure they are good looking, but I am comparing Tehran to cities closer at home.

Iranian architecture has been improved, especially if you take a look at some recent projects which are going on and now that foreign investment will be allowed we will see more of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
Yes maybe it's better than Baghdad, Kabul or some African cities, but i wouldn't consider Tehran as a decent capital.
Tehran has one of the best infrastructures of south west Asia.

It is also one of the most urban ones, how is this not a decent capital?
Having shiny skyscrapers doesn't make a city decent!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
Tehran doesn't have even a "decent" pedestrian or historic neighborhoods to walk at night, except for some boring restaurants/parks, people don't have a real public space to hang out at nights.
This is just nonsense. Tehran has over 2000+ parks, many coffee shops, restaurants, cinemas and etc.

I don't need night clubs as I can attend my parties at my friends.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
The coffee shops are inside the buildings which is boring, contrary to some European cities where people eat and sit in the streets. Even popular places like Tajrish or Darband
This is not true and makes me wonder if you have been to Tehran lately...

We have many public coffee shops which are in open spaces, like cafe Viuna in baghe Ferdows, besides the street culture is not as developed in Iran as in other countries. Iranians don't like this either, except if it's close to the mountains which have a nice breeze and are lovely.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
If you've been to other cities, they aren't beautiful or attractive enough. And i'm not even going to mention the nightlife which is so boring, because it lacks bars and freedom. Never mind the pollution.
Mashhad is a religious destination, Esfahan is already an Unesco site and named as one of the most beautiful cities in the world, Tabriz is developing more and more by day, I agree on other cities with you, but we are talking about Tehran now.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
And it's sad, an ancient civilization with immense culture, our cities have nothing to offer compared to other cities in the world.
I disagree with that.

We might not offer clubs and bars, but are these things the most important factors of a city to make it good looking?? I doubt.

Last edited by Persian_Gulf; November 17th, 2015 at 10:21 PM.
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Old November 17th, 2015, 10:53 PM   #17
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Old November 17th, 2015, 11:38 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post
I have never said that Tehran is the best looking city in the Middle East.
What I said, it that Tehran is one of the best looking cities.
:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post
It's probably the best in the Middle East
...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Persian_Gulf View Post
I don't consider Istanbul part of the Middle East, but part of Europe, the same goes for Baku.
Istanbul is historically part of the Middle East after Ottomans conquered the city, it was culturally an Islamic city for 600 years and it was considered Eastern but the Western architecture influenced the Ottoman architecture.
I mentioned Baku because the soviet Azerbaijan is our neighbor.
BTW, it Seems like you ignore cities like Tel Aviv, Beirut or Ankara as well...

Quote:
Cities like Dubai are not comparable to Tehran as they are free trade zones.
Tehran can be a free trade zone too like Kish, or probably more open to investment to look more interesting.

Quote:
Tehran has plenty of mid and highrises, it's just very sprawl over a large area. If you go to Velenjak, Elahieh, Farmanieh and etc, you can only find mid and Highrises.
Elahiye, Farmaniyeh or Velenjek, they don't reflect the reality of Tehran. Just look at the suburbs in Tehran which probably makes the 80% of houses in Tehran...very bad looking.

Quote:
Tehran is attractive for me, because I love the bazaars, urban culture, and the atmosphere, even the trees around vali-asr and no single skyscraper of Dubai could ever replace that for me.
True, and i also love the atmosphere, however the old buildings there are neglected, the bazaar and the old buildings haven't been renovated, they look ugly and it doesn't have that old-time look or feel there. They should renovate it.

Quote:
Freedom is not an added value to the looks of a city, but rather to society.
You couldn't be more wrong.

Quote:
This is because you compare Tehran to the wrong cities.
That's your problem, you always compare Tehran with Baghdad or Kabul, such mentality has always kept us backward. No offense.

Quote:
Not a single one of these countries/cities you have mentioned have been through a revolution, war, trade embargoes and sanctions in only 35 years time.
Sure they are good looking, but I am comparing Tehran to cities closer at home.
Please, the West imposed brutal sanctions on Iran since 4 years ago, you sound as if Iran was like Cuba or North Korea before. We had sanctions, but it wasn't that tough. Don't be a Mullah apologist.

Quote:
Tehran has one of the best infrastructures of south west Asia. It is also one of the most urban ones, how is this not a decent capital?
Having shiny skyscrapers doesn't make a city decent!
Indeed. Tehran has good infrastructure, but looks ugly.

Quote:
I don't need night clubs as I can attend my parties at my friends.
Not everyone thinks the way you think. Having freedom, a nice relaxing atmosphere without the government everyday meddling in your private life is probably one of the top priorities for the 90% of the world population.
Quote:
This is not true and makes me wonder if you have been to Tehran lately...

We have many public coffee shops which are in open spaces, like cafe Viuna in baghe Ferdows, besides the street culture is not as developed in Iran as in other countries. Iranians don't like this either, except if it's close to the mountains which have a nice breeze and are lovely.
I don't consider Baghe Ferdows or Cafe Viuna as coffee culture. You haven't been to Paris or Rome probably, when you should walk many streets to find only 2 or 3 chairs to sit!
Quote:
Mashhad is a religious destination, Esfahan is already an Unesco site and named as one of the most beautiful cities in the world, Tabriz is developing more and more by day, I agree on other cities with you, but we are talking about Tehran now.
I meant other counties, not Iranian cities. Please don't even mention the other Iranian cities
Quote:
I disagree with that.

We might not offer clubs and bars, but are these things the most important factors of a city to make it good looking?? I doubt.
Yes, Coffee culture is the reason why everyone loves Paris more than any other city in the world. Coffee culture is the reason why everyone loves European cities, what makes Europe unique. Shame Tehran can't offer that.
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Old November 18th, 2015, 12:24 AM   #19
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Istanbul is historically part of the Middle East since Ottomans conquered the city, it was culturally Muslim for 600 years and it was considered Eastern but the Western architecture influenced the Ottoman architecture.
I mentioned Baku because the soviet Azerbaijan is our neighbor.
Neighbours or not... Culture does a lot to architecture.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
BTW, It Seems like you ignore cities like Tel Aviv, Beirut or Ankara as well...
Indeed because I have never mentioned those cities in first place, you did. Beirut is a warzone and never found it that attractive except for the fact that it is a coastal city, Tel Aviv is nice, but doesn't stand out and Ankara is probably the loveliest one out of them, but again not the most urban one.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
Tehran can be a free trade zone too like Kish, or probably more open to investment to look more interesting.
One of the main aspects of a free trade zone is that they have to be located near a border, that could be a coastline or country border.

You have to have good access to those places, cities like Dubai, Hong Kong are ideally located for such.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
Elahiye, Farmaniyeh or Velenjek, they don't reflect the reality of Tehran. Just look at the suburbs in Tehran which probably makes the 80% of houses in Tehran...very bad looking.
Northern Tehran is just as big as the south is, even the south is developing nowadays.

If you want to talk about suburbs, let's not mention the ones of Baku or even Dubai where you find dozens of slums where poor indian and pakistani workers live, I call them slaves, because they have to work in very bad conditions! Even Afghans have better living standards in Iran than them.

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Originally Posted by hey dude View Post
True, and i also love the atmosphere, however the old buildings there are neglected, the bazaar and the old buildings haven't been renovated, they look ugly and it doesn't have that old-time look or feel there. They should renovate it.
I agree, and they will. They have to if they want to boost the tourism industry like they say...


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You couldn't be more wrong.
Freedom does not reflect on how shiny a building looks or how clean the roads are, this is nonsense! Freedom only reflects on society.

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That's your problem, you always compare Tehran to Baghdad and Kabul, such mentality has always kept us backward. No offense.
I compared it to those cities because comparing should be realistic. I can't compare Tehran to Dubai as the social culture and architecture is 180 degrees different. I also don't want Tehran to become Dubai number 2.

Tehran should remain as it is and like you said, many things have to be improved, like renovations of old buildings, bazaars, we have to create proper public places and etc.

cities like Bandar Abbas and Bushehr could be perfect as free trade zones (Bushehr is already one) and ideal to become a Dubai like trade hub.

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Please, The West imposed brutal sanctions on Iran since 4 years ago, you sound as if Iran was like Cuba or North Korea before. We had sanctions, but it wasn't that tough. Don't be a Mullah apologist.
Before we had a war for 8 years, had to rebuild for 10 years and after that we had Khatami and things started going better until Ahmadinejad came and screwed up everything we've built up during Khatami.

Foreign relations began to decrease and investors started to get out of Iran after 2006 when the first EU sanctions came.

The US would block any big investment in Iran.

But now we are going into a new era where international relations will improve and investors are already coming.

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Indeed, Tehran has good infrastructure indeed, but looks ugly.
Ugly?

Tehran has one of the best looking metros in the whole world, Tehran has the largest network of highways in a city in south west Asia and in my opinion, they look very clean and good, especially Hemmat and Moddares.

regarding our airports, I agree... That is ugly and so are our busses, except for some BRT lines.


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Not everyone thinks the way you think. Having freedom, a nice relax atmosphere without the government meddling everyday in your private life is probably one of the top priorities for the 90% of the world population.
Exactly, but again this doesn't reflect on how beautiful a building looks for instance.

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I don't consider Baghe Ferdows or Cafe Viuna as street culture, not at all. You haven't been to Paris or Rome probably, when you should walk many streets to find only 2 or 3 chairs to sit!
Where? In central Tehran which is crowded and polluted?

I agree with you, but with the current situation this is only possible in northern parts of Tehran as the weather is much nicer and is less crowded.

However, it needs good city planning and pedestrian roads to do something like this, which we lack, but will hopefully improve

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Yes, Coffee culture is the reason why everyone loves Paris more than any other city in the world. Coffee culture is the reason why everyone loves European cities, what makes Europe unique. Shame Tehran can't offer that.
That's true... European cities have an own identity, Dubai for instance has not and that's my point. Tehran has it too, at least it has the potential, but we need much more attention and investment in this area.
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Old November 18th, 2015, 01:25 AM   #20
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Persian Gulf, you said that freedom or an open society doesn't make a city greater, but it does. Compare cities like Jeddah, Islamabad and Tehran under Islamist governments with cities like Istanbul, Beirut and Tel Aviv. It does have an impact on the cities. Iran's domestic policy is very important here.

The Iranian government has been spending millions of dollars on mosques, religious places and shrines in Tehran, hundreds of mosques have been built since the revolution to radicalize people, spending millions of dollars on a simple Mosalla, shutting down bars/nightclubs and Islamizing Tehran after the revolution... instead of that, imagine if Iran was spending millions of dollars on historic districts, pedestrians and coffee shops/bars/nightclubs, promoting Secularism and coffee culture instead of going to shrines...not always you can blame the sanctions, Persian Gulf.

This is also an important factor here, i don't understand why the Tehran municipality should spend millions of dollars on a Mosalla when it can simply build more decent towers like the ones in Niavaran with the same money.

BTW, Beirut is not a war-zone anymore, to the contrary, it's a party town. If you don't find Beirut attractive, just take a look at pictures which i posted in the "around the world" thread. It's an amazing city.
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Last edited by hey dude; December 4th, 2015 at 12:56 AM.
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