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Old February 5th, 2016, 05:10 AM   #21
fieldsofdreams
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Building a light rail line is significantly cheaper and easier to maintain than a brand new, underground heavy rail subway, especially given the curvature of the roadways involved. While of course the light rail will be built to pump up this so-called "gentrification", it will also significantly ease commute traffic on some of Brooklyn's and Queens' busier bus lines.
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Old February 5th, 2016, 05:44 AM   #22
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Finally took the time to glance through which bus lines will be impacted once the Brooklyn-Queens Connector light rail service is fully built... and here is the list of bus lines that will be covered by it (from south going north):

Note: bus lines in bold indicate 24/7 service

- B37: Third Street between 59th Street and Hamilton Avenue
- B57: Otsego & Beard terminal (@ IKEA Ferry Dock), Brooklyn Navy Yard (at Clinton Street)
- B61: Van Dyke/Beard & Otsego, Van Brunt Street, Columbia Street
- B25: Brooklyn Bridge Park/DUMBO, Cadman Plaza W, Tillary Street, Jay Street
- Multiple bus lines through Jay Street (B26, B54, B57, B62, B67)
- Multiple bus lines through Atlantic Terminal (B37, B41, B45, B63, B65, B67, B103)
- B67: Front Street, York Street, Brooklyn Navy Yard
- B62: York Street, Navy Street, Park Avenue, McGuiness Boulevard, Pulaski Bridge, 11th Street
- B32: Wythe/Kent Avenue (shared with Q59 between Broadway and Grand Street), Franklin Street, Freeman/Green Streets, McGuiness Boulevard, Pulaski Bridge, 11th Street
- Q32 and Q60: 59th Street
- Multiple lines through Queensboro Plaza (Q32, Q39, Q60, Q67, Q69, Q100, Q101, Q102)
- Q100: 21st Street (shared with Q69 between Queensboro Plaza and 24th Ave terminal)

Use these bus system maps (PDF) for guidance and reference:

Brooklyn
Queens
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Old February 5th, 2016, 07:21 AM   #23
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Why not a BRT then if the existing bus system covers that area. Regular buses could use the bus lanes and stations.

Streetcars are just so not NYC. Their benefits of attracting development and a smoother ride and large vehicle capacity at low frequencies isn't what brkln or Queens needs is it?
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Old February 5th, 2016, 07:43 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaphod View Post
Why not a BRT then if the existing bus system covers that area. Regular buses could use the bus lanes and stations.

Streetcars are just so not NYC. Their benefits of attracting development and a smoother ride and large vehicle capacity at low frequencies isn't what brkln or Queens needs is it?
That would be one, seriously long BRT line spanning two boroughs. It reminds me of the Q44-SBS (+SelectBusService) that operates between Flushing in Queens and the Bronx Zoo via the Whitestone Bridge, which I think should be kept that way since the corridors it serves (Main Street, Archer Avenue, Suthpin Blvd, and Bruckner Blvd) contain so much passenger traffic that it runs every 30 minutes during the overnight and as good as every 8 minutes all day long. And since it will span multiple corridors, it can be a bit difficult to consolidate all those bus lines I named into one, single line name (like B61, B62, or B67 for Brooklyn; Q100 for Queens).

And by the way, there will be involvement from both New York City Transit and MTA Bus in this development since the impacted routes will involve both portions of the New York City Buses division of the MTA. If I were to do a BRT (in this case, SBS) line, I would minimize those turns, use at most five main corridors, and ensure that the service is timed very well to meet up with other buses at certain time points along the line (like Downtown Brooklyn, Queensboro Plaza, and Atlantic Terminal, among others). If we supplement that SBS service with a local bus (like M15 or Bx12), it will take forever for one bus to complete just one leg of the line.
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Old February 5th, 2016, 09:19 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebasepoiss View Post
Wait... $2.5 billion for a 16-mile (25.75 km) light-rail line? That's $156 million per mile or $ 97 million per km. Why is it so expensive?

Also, if the renders are anything to go by, it's not even separated from car traffic.
Just how things are in the states, especially New York. Frankly, my first reaction to the $2.5 billion price tag was "wow, that not bad!"
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Old February 6th, 2016, 10:45 PM   #26
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Also BRT would require the MTA this doesn't and Mayor DeBlasio would like to score a transit victory independent of Gov Cuomo
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Old February 7th, 2016, 07:08 AM   #27
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Politics. A charade? A bad thing for cohesive progress? No way!
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Old February 7th, 2016, 06:38 PM   #28
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I don't see why anyone thinks this is a good idea. Unless you have personal experience with NYC drivers and NY traffic, you're not in a position to advocate this project.
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Old February 7th, 2016, 06:42 PM   #29
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Quote:
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I don't see why anyone thinks this is a good idea. Unless you have personal experience with NYC drivers and NY traffic, you're not in a position to advocate this project.
Its a traffic separated ROW , so it won't get stuck in traffic. The route skirts the traffic congestion neighborhoods...
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Old February 7th, 2016, 07:47 PM   #30
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Um, no? The proposed streetcar is mixed-traffic, as mind-boggling as that is.
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Old February 8th, 2016, 12:31 AM   #31
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I'm not sure if this is the right thread for this, but I would like to know if there are any maps of the various waterfront railroads (Brooklyn Terminal, Jay Street Connecting) in existence. I would like to compare them to this streetcar.

Edit: This is a good site, but I would like more overall maps.

http://www.freightrrofnyc.info/

Last edited by 00Zy99; February 8th, 2016 at 04:02 AM.
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Old February 8th, 2016, 06:57 AM   #32
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If this is to be done full-time, I hope for a few things:

- some sections that see very high automobile traffic would have no railroad crossings and instead bring the rail either overground or under;
- timed transfers between bus lines and the BQ Connector can be done in a way that even with the least frequent bus lines, the transfer buffer shall be enough to allow ease of access for passenger between the two modes, especially for seniors and the handicapped
- service shall be operated at all times to provide coverage for bus lines that run overnight as well
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Old February 10th, 2016, 04:22 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAronymous View Post
Um, no? The proposed streetcar is mixed-traffic, as mind-boggling as that is.
Exactly... I'd like to see some type of official publication stating the system is supposed to be grade separated ROW....
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Old February 10th, 2016, 04:35 AM   #34
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Politics are fickle

Diamond in the clear! Transit legend’s streetcar dreams finally back on track

By Colin Mixson
Brooklyn Paper
Enlarge this image

File photo
Train in vain: Bob Diamond stands with one of his precious streetcars back in 1999, when he had a few hundred feet of track in Red Hook to move along.

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Photo by Tom Callan
Diamond in the rough: Bob Diamond has longed to bring a streetcar to Columbia Street for decades.


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His cable car has just come in!
Mayor DeBlasio wants to bring trolley dodging back to Brooklyn for the first time since the 1950s, and no one is more excited about it than legendary Flatbush engineer and transit geek Bob Diamond, who has been trying to get the city to do just that for more than 20 years.
“I think it’s really important for the future growth and prosperity of New York City that the mayor and other elects work to bring back a streetcar network,” said Diamond, who has been laboring to build a streetcar system linking Red Hook with Downtown since 1989.
Diamond’s dream was originally city-sanctioned, and he lay some tracks in Red Hook and purchased several vintage streetcars to ride them, only for the city to cut off funding in 1999.
The Bloomberg administration became interested again in 2009, but put the kibosh on his fantasy altogether in 2011, following a Department of Transportation study — widely circulated online again in recent days — that found the streetcar would serve relatively few people for the price tag and would be difficult to squeeze into Red Hook’s streets.
Diamond believes the study was set up to fail, however, because the city wanted to fund more buses at the time.
“To be perfectly frank, it’s been a laughing stock in the transit community since it came out,” claimed Diamond, who also poured his efforts into running tours through an abandoned train tunnel he found under Atlantic Avenue, until transportation officials killed that dream in 2010 as well.
The armchair transit expert still contends that streetcars exceed busses in every way that matters — creating less pollution, consuming less energy, accommodating more passengers, and promoting development along their routes.
“Streetcars are superior to busses on every level and in every category of metric,” he said.
...
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Old February 10th, 2016, 04:39 AM   #35
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A Trolley Enthusiast on de Blasio’s Streetcar Plan: Bring Me Aboard

By COREY KILGANNONFEB. 4, 2016



Bob Diamond at his home in Brooklyn, showing a scrapbook of his life as a train historian. Credit Kevin Hagen for The New York Times

Now that Mayor Bill de Blasio has unveiled a proposal to build a streetcar line along the East River in Brooklyn and Queens, the Trolley Man of Brooklyn would like to offer his services.
The Trolley Man — otherwise known as Bob Diamond, an engineer and rail buff from Flatbush, Brooklyn — has spent decades trying to revive trolleys in his borough, and even began construction of a line before he was forced to abandon the project in 2003.
Mr. Diamond, 56, said he was delighted to hear about the 16-mile line that Mr. de Blasio proposed. He wanted the mayor to know that he was available to help and could provide access to volumes of studies and plans related to rail construction that he said could save the city time.
Continue reading the main story Related Coverage


“We even still have a rail car sitting on the tracks behind Fairway in Red Hook,” Mr. Diamond said on Thursday, mentioning one of the Brooklyn neighborhoods that the proposed streetcar line would traverse. “If the mayor want to use it, he’s more than welcome. It has a beautiful paint job.”
The mayor’s $2.5 billion plan envisions a line that would wind through bustling and developing neighborhoods such as Astoria and Long Island City in Queens, and Greenpoint and Dumbo in Brooklyn, as well as Red Hook, where Mr. Diamond’s group, the Brooklyn Historic Railway Association, had begun building a trolley line more than 20 years ago.
Mr. Diamond is enamored of Brooklyn’s history with trolleys, which stretches back to horsecars in the early 1800s and cable cars in the middle part of that century. Electric trolleys became so plentiful that Brooklyn’s baseball team was named the Trolley Dodgers in the 1890s, before the name was shortened to the Dodgers.
Continue reading the main story Related in Opinion


Mr. Diamond’s trolley project began in the 1980s when he decided he wanted to build the first trolley line to run in Brooklyn since 1956, one that would link Red Hook to Downtown Brooklyn.
Relying on public and private donors, Mr. Diamond built tracks on donated private property along the Red Hook shoreline. He restored old trolley cars and erected electric poles.
Mr. Diamond got approvals and financing, bought 15 vintage street cars and installed 1,500 feet of track in Red Hook. But it all fell apart in 2003 when the city, he said, lost interest in his project, scrapped the plan and ripped up the tracks.
His fleet of trolleys included one car from Norway, three Pullman cars from Boston that he bought for $9 total, a locomotive purchased from a New Jersey soybean farmer and a dozen cars from Ohio.
...
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Old February 10th, 2016, 06:07 AM   #36
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According to an article that I read, its going to be 70% segregated and 30% mixed-traffic.
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Old February 10th, 2016, 06:42 AM   #37
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=70% of the distance is Street 30% is intersections
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Old February 10th, 2016, 05:20 PM   #38
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The mixed-traffic sections should be reconsidered, unless they want the whole thing to be ridiculed as a bus on steel wheels.
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Old February 10th, 2016, 09:12 PM   #39
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Not every street in NYC is jam-packed.
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Old February 10th, 2016, 09:20 PM   #40
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The areas the route will run through are mostly quiet in terms of traffic , yet dense to ultra dense neighborhoods.
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