daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Forums > Architecture > Classic Architecture

Classic Architecture Discussions on heritage buildings, monuments and landmarks.



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old July 3rd, 2016, 11:35 AM   #1
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

A new style of classical architecture

I'm very fond of classical architecture and find it far more harmonious and natural than the clean lines and boxes which we find everywhere today. So naturally I am glad to see new buildings in baroque, renaissance revival or whatever, but on the other hand I don't think looking backwards and copying old styles is the way forwards in the long run. So I thought I'd ask if anyone here knows of any attempts to innovate and create new architectural styles based on the classical ones, much like Art Nouveau in the beginning of the last century.
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 3rd, 2016, 08:00 PM   #2
hateman
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 696
Likes (Received): 1798

http://www.bkskarch.com/work/529-broadway/

This building has a terracotta facade with sculptural details that deconstructs and organically transforms into a more modern facade. Without computer modelling such a project probably wouldn't happen.
__________________
We are seeking to follow the type of architecture which is good in the sense that it does not of necessity follow the whims of the moment but seeks an artistry that ought to be good, as far as we can tell, for all time to come. -FDR

We shape our buildings; thereafter they shape us. -Winston Churchill

alyshasmith liked this post
hateman no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 3rd, 2016, 08:10 PM   #3
Tiaren
Registered User
 
Tiaren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,702
Likes (Received): 5550

There is this one house, I think it is in Amsterdam, that is partly build of see-through glass-bricks and transforms into a traditional 18th century townhouse. I forgot it's name but I thought it was absolutely gorgeous and something I never saw before.

Found it:

__________________

skymantle, washiwashi, ashok16, RiseUp liked this post
Tiaren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 3rd, 2016, 11:04 PM   #4
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

Quote:
Originally Posted by hateman View Post
http://www.bkskarch.com/work/529-broadway/

This building has a terracotta facade with sculptural details that deconstructs and organically transforms into a more modern facade. Without computer modelling such a project probably wouldn't happen.
Wow! That's a very interresting piece of architecture. Personally I prefer when there are more ornaments, but combining two styles in this way looks amazing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiaren View Post
There is this one house, I think it is in Amsterdam, that is partly build of see-through glass-bricks and transforms into a traditional 18th century townhouse. I forgot it's name but I thought it was absolutely gorgeous and something I never saw before.

Found it:

I couldn't agree with you more, it is absolutely gorgeous, and not something you see everyday. It is however not a new style of classical architecture in my mind. While the lower part of the building certainly is innovative, it's just a matter of changing building materials and still immitates an established style of architecture. When I said new style of architecture I was thinking about something compareable to the differance between Rennaissance architecture and Baroque.

The buildings are awesome though, both of them
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 4th, 2016, 05:53 AM   #5
MRouchell
MRouchell
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 136
Likes (Received): 235

Quote:
Originally Posted by Notgnirracen View Post
I'm very fond of classical architecture and find it far more harmonious and natural than the clean lines and boxes which we find everywhere today. So naturally I am glad to see new buildings in baroque, renaissance revival or whatever, but on the other hand I don't think looking backwards and copying old styles is the way forwards in the long run. So I thought I'd ask if anyone here knows of any attempts to innovate and create new architectural styles based on the classical ones, much like Art Nouveau in the beginning of the last century.
When designing classical buildings today (or anytime) it is necessary to look back and simultaneously look forward. Any recently built classical building will always be using materials and techniques that are only available today. Despite looking like it was built for a previous time, it will have more advanced sealants, more advanced waterproofing, better fasteners, better engineering, better testing of products and systems. It will have gypsum board walls instead of plaster on lath. It will have plywood decking instead of individual wood boards. The fasteners will be made of corrosion resistant stainless steel, galvanized steel or aluminum, none of which were available 150 years ago. They will be designed to meet the current building codes and they will be designed to meet up to date uses. For example, the kitchen in recent houses are more open to the living rooms so that the homeowner is able to prepare a meal and visit and entertain guest at the same time, and guest can participate in the meal preparation. This is much different than in the past when the kitchen was located in a service area away from where guests were entertained. This is the way classicism has always evolved, going back to when the Romans adapted Greeks' trabeated (post and lintel) classical orders and incorporated it with their arcuated (arch, vault and dome) construction.
__________________

skymantle, alexandru.mircea liked this post
MRouchell no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 4th, 2016, 05:57 AM   #6
JMGA196
Registered User
 
JMGA196's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Guatemala City
Posts: 4,574
Likes (Received): 5148

Quoting what I posted in the "New buildings built in traditional architectural style" thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGA196 View Post
This thread makes me think of how much architecture has devalued over the last 150 years. Back then, other arts like painting and sculpture were auxiliar to architecture. Buildings had tons of paintings in the interior and sculptures in the exterior. They took some time to do, maybe even years, but hey, that's the price you have to pay for quality. Everything was aesthetically pleasing, everything had class and character. We were surrounded by art.

But then abstract and funcionalist movements struck. Everything was meant to be simple and functional. Art could be anything. You don't need to have top skills nowadays to be considered an artist. Nobody cares about art anymore. That negligence is what keeps art in its current state, nobody cares abour art, so there is no need for artists to improve. You can be a monkey with no skills and paint something like Pollock, Mondrian or Rothko and call yourself an artist. Architecture was affected by this and it deviated from the logical straight line of development and evolution it had been following. You could see how architecture was slowly changing and evolving from the ancient Greeks, to Rome, to Byzantium, to Venice, the Gothic style, Renaissance, Baroque, Neoclassicism, and then started deviating, first slowly but nicely, with Art Nouveau-Jugendstil and Art Deco. And then took another completely different direction with no correlation to the other ones with functionalism and minimalism.

I think that us, the present and future generations have the task of taking architecture back to were it belongs. They noticed this in the XV and XVI centuries, and the Renaissance was born. They noticed it again in the XIX century and Neoclassicism was born. We should re direction architecture in the way it should: to a constant and regular development and evolution. Combining classic aesthetics with modern knowledge. We can use the last century as an experimental time. How do we do this? We now know much more different materials that we can use, such as mass produced crystal, aluminium or cobblestone alternatives. We can use steel to make better buildings. We know the structure theories iniciated by Le Corbusier. We now can make curtain walls. We can make taller buildings. We can make different intricated structures, proven by architects such as Gehry (although I hate him), Santiago Calatrava or Frank Lloyd Wright. Combining modern shapes (not that I'm implying that we should make a Gehry's Guggenheim made with marble and using ornaments like gargoyles and with triglyphs for example ), structures and materials but adorning them and making them as aesthetically pleasing as classic architecture used to be. We need to re use and redevelop old techniques and resources such as column capitals and orders, porticos and peristyles, different types of arches, vaults, etc.

And this comes with other important point: Identity. Back then, every town, every nation had its own identity. You can easily see the differences between spanish and italian baroque for example. Homegrown artists generally used to make their work in their own lands. Italian artists for Italy, french artists for France, spanish artists for Spain, turk artists for the Ottoman Empire, chinese artists for the Chinese Empire, and so on. Now, everyone can make any kind of building in any place in the world. You can place a chinese building in the USA or England for example, and it would most likely not look out of place. We need to give each country its identity back. I'm not saying that architects should not make buildings outside of their countries; I'm saying architects should adapt to other countries traditions and culture before making a new design there. The only good example of what I'm saying, I think, is brazilian modern architecture. It started with Oscar Niemeyer and Lúcio Costa, and you can still see it in Paulo Mendes da Rocha. They have an identity. You can recognize brazilian architecture easily, anywhere. Many other big countries fail to have a way of making architecture of its own. I wouldn't like to see some of the buildings in Brasilia, Rio or any other Brazilian city on any place other than Brazil. It just wouldn't feel right. That's why I love the fact that almost all Niemeyer's buildings were built in Brazil. I think he basically started Brazilian architecture and certainly influenced every contemporary brazilian architect. Some aspects and characteristics I've seen are quite usual in Brazilian architecture: Simple shapes, interaction between straight lines and curves, minimalism, bare concrete facade, plain white + crystal facade, contrast between the juxtaposition of bare concrete or plain white with stong basic colours like red or blue, for example, specially in the interiors.

If we manage to merge what I said before, we can make architecture beautiful again. This also applies for other forms of art: painting, sculpture, music, literature...
__________________
follow my new photography account on instagram @miguel_alecio

Mimar Sinan - Sebastian Treese - Sejima - Nishizawa - Pawson - Horia Creangă - McKim, Mead & White - Gord Scott - Peter Pennoyer - Charles Hilton - Annabelle Selldorf - Roman and Williams - Morris Adjmi - Diller Scofidio + Renfro

★★★ MAKE ARCHITECTURE GREAT AGAIN! ★★★
JMGA196 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 4th, 2016, 10:20 AM   #7
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRouchell View Post
When designing classical buildings today (or anytime) it is necessary to look back and simultaneously look forward. Any recently built classical building will always be using materials and techniques that are only available today. Despite looking like it was built for a previous time, it will have more advanced sealants, more advanced waterproofing, better fasteners, better engineering, better testing of products and systems. It will have gypsum board walls instead of plaster on lath. It will have plywood decking instead of individual wood boards. The fasteners will be made of corrosion resistant stainless steel, galvanized steel or aluminum, none of which were available 150 years ago. They will be designed to meet the current building codes and they will be designed to meet up to date uses. For example, the kitchen in recent houses are more open to the living rooms so that the homeowner is able to prepare a meal and visit and entertain guest at the same time, and guest can participate in the meal preparation. This is much different than in the past when the kitchen was located in a service area away from where guests were entertained. This is the way classicism has always evolved, going back to when the Romans adapted Greeks' trabeated (post and lintel) classical orders and incorporated it with their arcuated (arch, vault and dome) construction.
Sure, in that sence modern classical buildings have already adapted and changed, but I was thinking more about the exterior. I was wondering if there are any attempts to make a new style of architecture which would continue the evolution of classical architecture, neo-classical - neo-gothic - art nouveau - ? nouveau art nouveau ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGA196 View Post
Quoting what I posted in the "New buildings built in traditional architectural style" thread:
I agree.
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 6th, 2016, 02:33 AM   #8
MRouchell
MRouchell
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 136
Likes (Received): 235

Quote:
Originally Posted by Notgnirracen View Post
Sure, in that sence modern classical buildings have already adapted and changed, but I was thinking more about the exterior. I was wondering if there are any attempts to make a new style of architecture which would continue the evolution of classical architecture, neo-classical - neo-gothic - art nouveau - ? nouveau art nouveau ??



I agree.
Here's a thought: You can look back at how iron and steel has changed classical architecture, particularly how architects like Henri Labrouste used iron in his work creating a thin, slender version of classical architecture, with thin pipe columns that was suited to the ductility of steel. Or other examples would be the concourse of McKim Mead & White's Penn Station, or the Manhattan or Williamsburg bridges. (Both are very classically designed, just look at the details.)

Now consider structural glass. Think of the Apple Store in Manhattan, that big glass cube, or structural glass stairs, or even a glass curtain wall. These are all products of modernism, but if you look at the development of classical architecture, you'll see that it has the ability to adapt to new technologies and materials. How would a classicist architect utilize structural glass, or a glass curtain wall into a classical building? Perhaps the metal fittings where the glass panels join together become opportunities for expressive ornament, or perhaps the glass panels can be sandblasted with an ornamental boarder around each.

While you consider that, I will leave you with this image below of a really cool building, the Tietz Department Store, a classical building, which may have been one of the earliest uses of a glass curtain wall system. Unfortunately, it no longer exists.

__________________
MRouchell no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 6th, 2016, 05:03 PM   #9
Galro
Humanity through Urbanity
 
Galro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,230
Likes (Received): 9781

We still have the Hallidie Building in San Francisco that shows a similar early pre-modernistic useage of glass curtain walls.


http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...lidie_day.html


http://picssr.com/photos/mdalton/interesting/page2
__________________

AbidM, HURZ, Divagation, erbse, skymantle and 4 others liked this post
Galro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 6th, 2016, 05:25 PM   #10
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRouchell View Post
Here's a thought: You can look back at how iron and steel has changed classical architecture, particularly how architects like Henri Labrouste used iron in his work creating a thin, slender version of classical architecture, with thin pipe columns that was suited to the ductility of steel. Or other examples would be the concourse of McKim Mead & White's Penn Station, or the Manhattan or Williamsburg bridges. (Both are very classically designed, just look at the details.)

Now consider structural glass. Think of the Apple Store in Manhattan, that big glass cube, or structural glass stairs, or even a glass curtain wall. These are all products of modernism, but if you look at the development of classical architecture, you'll see that it has the ability to adapt to new technologies and materials. How would a classicist architect utilize structural glass, or a glass curtain wall into a classical building? Perhaps the metal fittings where the glass panels join together become opportunities for expressive ornament, or perhaps the glass panels can be sandblasted with an ornamental boarder around each.

While you consider that, I will leave you with this image below of a really cool building, the Tietz Department Store, a classical building, which may have been one of the earliest uses of a glass curtain wall system. Unfortunately, it no longer exists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galro View Post
We still have the Hallidie Building in San Francisco that shows a similar early pre-modernistic useage of glass curtain walls.


http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...lidie_day.html


http://picssr.com/photos/mdalton/interesting/page2
Those are some beautiful buildings! I never thought that the two styles could be merged so successfully. If only there were modern examples of this though ...
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 6th, 2016, 08:56 PM   #11
hateman
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 696
Likes (Received): 1798

The steel framed window is a very good bridge between traditional and modern architecture. It works with so many different styles of architecture.
__________________
We are seeking to follow the type of architecture which is good in the sense that it does not of necessity follow the whims of the moment but seeks an artistry that ought to be good, as far as we can tell, for all time to come. -FDR

We shape our buildings; thereafter they shape us. -Winston Churchill
hateman no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2016, 11:56 AM   #12
Rosypeter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 13
Likes (Received): 0

The design and the architecture of the building images given in this blog was really amazing.
Rosypeter no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 11th, 2016, 06:57 AM   #13
benpicko
Registered User
 
benpicko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Leicester
Posts: 74
Likes (Received): 96

Classically inspired architects need to unify and create something entirely new soon. That's why we lose out. The modernists have framed the narrative in such a way to suggest that their philosophy of architecture is the only one compatible with the modern world, and that to take inspiration from the past is to be stuck in it. Something big needs to come, classically inspired, richly decorated, and beautiful, but still a major step forward.

Things like that are what's needed to reframe the debate. Then we're not just people who look into the past, but people who appreciate the artistry of the present and want our cities to reflect that, not reflect a stifling lack of creativity. The amount of brilliant artists in the world right now makes the suggestion that we can only manage to build bland identikit buildings ludicrous.
__________________

Notgnirracen, JMGA196 liked this post
benpicko no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 12th, 2016, 12:09 AM   #14
JMGA196
Registered User
 
JMGA196's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Guatemala City
Posts: 4,574
Likes (Received): 5148

Considering that "contemporary" architecture is based in what Adolf Loos proposed one hundred years ago, and using Mies van der Rohe and Le Corbusier's 70 year old ideas as role models, I think it's time for a change...

I think the last century was a very experimental time, that left us with many interesting ideas and useful resources, specially regarding structures and engineering. But ornaments and art in architecture must make a comeback and be modernized after a 100-150 year hiatus.

I also think we should post in this thread buildings that we consider good starting points for a new style of classical architecture.
__________________
follow my new photography account on instagram @miguel_alecio

Mimar Sinan - Sebastian Treese - Sejima - Nishizawa - Pawson - Horia Creangă - McKim, Mead & White - Gord Scott - Peter Pennoyer - Charles Hilton - Annabelle Selldorf - Roman and Williams - Morris Adjmi - Diller Scofidio + Renfro

★★★ MAKE ARCHITECTURE GREAT AGAIN! ★★★

Notgnirracen, erbse, Bent liked this post

Last edited by JMGA196; August 12th, 2016 at 05:04 PM.
JMGA196 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 12th, 2016, 12:23 AM   #15
JMGA196
Registered User
 
JMGA196's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Guatemala City
Posts: 4,574
Likes (Received): 5148

I specially think that these two are very good looking examples of buildings using classical resources and ornaments that still look modern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hed_Kandi View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hed_Kandi View Post
Photos of the completed 151 East 78th St in New York
http://www.ppapc.com/portfolio/residential-development/










__________________
follow my new photography account on instagram @miguel_alecio

Mimar Sinan - Sebastian Treese - Sejima - Nishizawa - Pawson - Horia Creangă - McKim, Mead & White - Gord Scott - Peter Pennoyer - Charles Hilton - Annabelle Selldorf - Roman and Williams - Morris Adjmi - Diller Scofidio + Renfro

★★★ MAKE ARCHITECTURE GREAT AGAIN! ★★★
JMGA196 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 18th, 2016, 07:57 AM   #16
JMGA196
Registered User
 
JMGA196's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Guatemala City
Posts: 4,574
Likes (Received): 5148

I'd like to see atriums, porticos, halls, vaults and other resources like that in modern constructions, specially if they are done with top quality materials and have amazing artworks, like this mosaic

__________________
follow my new photography account on instagram @miguel_alecio

Mimar Sinan - Sebastian Treese - Sejima - Nishizawa - Pawson - Horia Creangă - McKim, Mead & White - Gord Scott - Peter Pennoyer - Charles Hilton - Annabelle Selldorf - Roman and Williams - Morris Adjmi - Diller Scofidio + Renfro

★★★ MAKE ARCHITECTURE GREAT AGAIN! ★★★

erbse liked this post
JMGA196 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 31st, 2016, 01:32 PM   #17
riniancy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 6
Likes (Received): 1

Awesome Architect creatures. The designs are really awesome and having good creative ideas, it was really useful for my architect business.
riniancy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 9th, 2016, 10:40 PM   #18
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

This is somewhat like how I'd want a new style of classical architecture to look. It's very different from baroque or gothic, and it's something new, but it's certainly not modernist. The buildings are by the hungarian architect Imre Makovecz btw.




What do you think?
__________________

Aster de Gatîne, llerena1127 liked this post
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 10th, 2016, 07:31 AM   #19
skymantle
Registered User
 
skymantle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,796
Likes (Received): 3115

there's nothing classical about that building...traditional perhaps but not classical in the true architectural sense of the word.
skymantle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 10th, 2016, 11:06 AM   #20
Notgnirracen
Registered User
 
Notgnirracen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 640
Likes (Received): 1679

Quote:
Originally Posted by skymantle View Post
there's nothing classical about that building...traditional perhaps but not classical in the true architectural sense of the word.
Well, it's certainly based on, or inspired by classical architecture. But it's reinvented it, and that's what I want. If you're looking for classical proportions and roman collumns though, I can understand that this would not be very satisfying.
Notgnirracen no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu