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Old May 18th, 2005, 07:05 PM   #221
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Here is my favourite render of metropolis, which the music hall of fame will be a tenent in

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Old May 18th, 2005, 09:32 PM   #222
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Every time I see that picture I can't believe how much Toronto has changed... and it makes me remember how if someone from the past in Toronto saw that they would be blown away.
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Old May 19th, 2005, 12:02 AM   #223
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I agree that is an amazing pic lets hope they get started soon
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Old May 19th, 2005, 12:11 AM   #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoonman
Don't be foolish. I'm all for developing highrises and expanding the skyline, but tearing down a charming, bustling retail corner to make way for an uninspiring condo is outrageous, and I'm glad the public outcry made the city think twice about approving the project. There are plenty of parking lots or empty spaces in similarly busy intersections that can benefit from this kind of development, but dammit Jim, I will not stand by as my precious crepe joint gets torn down!
This is what I hate, too many damn NIMBY's
Have you even seen the plans? They aren't just building 2 condo towers, they're building something that would make the intersecrion better. The plans also include a public square, the plans are great!
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Old May 19th, 2005, 04:55 AM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis007
This is what I hate, too many damn NIMBY's
Have you even seen the plans? They aren't just building 2 condo towers, they're building something that would make the intersecrion better. The plans also include a public square, the plans are great!
NIMBYism seems to have taken on an exaggerated, pejorative connotation on these boards, to the point of being a trendy buzzword that everyone likes to just throw around to sound cool.

I wonder ... have you been to Bloor and Bedford? Perhaps, but are you well acquainted with the area (if you are, then I find your reaction even more surprising)? It's easy to be detached from a certain neighbourhood and say "yeah, just tear down those dusty ol' shacks and put up a nice, tall, shiny highrise", but when you're a part of that neighbourhood, those "ol' shacks" are inextricably linked with the community. And although it wouldn't hurt some of them from being sexed up and renovated a bit, they're nonetheless historic buildings that are components of the neighbourhood's historical legacy. And all that nostalgic mumbo jumbo aside, it happens to be a very charming (not to mention bustling) corner. You've got the Bedford Ballroom, the crepe place, the florist, along with one or two chain fast food joints thrown in (that I don't particularly care for, but that's just me).

Just look at the Woodsworth residence. It was a sleeper construction site when I moved to the area so I'm not sure what preceded it, but thus far the retail space for rent on the ground floor has been dead since the building went up (I think another Mercurio bar was supposed to get established there, but those plans fell through early in the game). All I'm saying is why demolish a perfectly tried-and-tested retail corner and replace it with a behemoth that may look good on paper, but could very well fall dramatically short of expectations?

I'm not saying it's a bad proposal per se, but simply that it just doesn't fit in. First of all, it would be disproportionate with its surroundings and just tower awkwardly over everything. Secondly, if the proposal was to be approved, it would set a dangerous precedent for the rest of the Annex, where several developers are already getting hard-ons about prospective large condo projects. This is simply not a neighbourhood to be messed around with. It works, and let's leave it at that.
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Old May 19th, 2005, 05:12 AM   #226
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Also, I just read the Hume article you posted on the TO board (after I posted my previous message). To be honest, the plans I read about were a few months old and I might not be apprised of any revisions, so I don't want to jump on this pre-emptively, but I dunno man. I'd have to see some pretty impressive and convincing plans (along with a render or two) before I'd consider warming up to this project. Until then, I'll continue to be skeptical. I simply don't like the fact that it's replacing a perfectly fine and well-established corner, while other mediocre areas or flat-out parking lots (in areas that could benefit from and sustain density) lay untouched. But who knows, I may be wrong. If it turns out to be a stunning success and be a nice big boost to the community, I'll be eating my words. We'll just have to see what happens.
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Old May 20th, 2005, 01:24 AM   #227
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Looks Amazing!
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Old May 20th, 2005, 02:51 AM   #228
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HVE 3 (CityPlace)
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Old May 21st, 2005, 12:46 AM   #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoonman
NIMBYism seems to have taken on an exaggerated, pejorative connotation on these boards, to the point of being a trendy buzzword that everyone likes to just throw around to sound cool.

I wonder ... have you been to Bloor and Bedford? Perhaps, but are you well acquainted with the area (if you are, then I find your reaction even more surprising)? It's easy to be detached from a certain neighbourhood and say "yeah, just tear down those dusty ol' shacks and put up a nice, tall, shiny highrise", but when you're a part of that neighbourhood, those "ol' shacks" are inextricably linked with the community. And although it wouldn't hurt some of them from being sexed up and renovated a bit, they're nonetheless historic buildings that are components of the neighbourhood's historical legacy. And all that nostalgic mumbo jumbo aside, it happens to be a very charming (not to mention bustling) corner. You've got the Bedford Ballroom, the crepe place, the florist, along with one or two chain fast food joints thrown in (that I don't particularly care for, but that's just me).

Just look at the Woodsworth residence. It was a sleeper construction site when I moved to the area so I'm not sure what preceded it, but thus far the retail space for rent on the ground floor has been dead since the building went up (I think another Mercurio bar was supposed to get established there, but those plans fell through early in the game). All I'm saying is why demolish a perfectly tried-and-tested retail corner and replace it with a behemoth that may look good on paper, but could very well fall dramatically short of expectations?

I'm not saying it's a bad proposal per se, but simply that it just doesn't fit in. First of all, it would be disproportionate with its surroundings and just tower awkwardly over everything. Secondly, if the proposal was to be approved, it would set a dangerous precedent for the rest of the Annex, where several developers are already getting hard-ons about prospective large condo projects. This is simply not a neighbourhood to be messed around with. It works, and let's leave it at that.
I'm sorry over-reacting at first and calling you a NIMBY.
And I have been to the corner of Bedford and Bloor, it's a nice corner with a lot of potential. I agree that there is some nice stores there that probably won't be there if this proposal goes through. But I'm pretty sure that your probably wouldn't mind if these same retail stores would remain if the condo towers get built as ground-level retail, and if it adds to the area. But I would doubt that because condo/residence towers has trouble with retail tenants and most of the time they end up being lousy dry-cleaners and such.
One thing that I would disagree is that I don't exactly find Bedford and Bloor to be very "Annex" because it is facing Bloor which is a busy street compared to the quiet and charming Annex area. Anyways, I hope that the plan ends up satifying both of us.
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Old May 21st, 2005, 12:54 AM   #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoonman
Also, I just read the Hume article you posted on the TO board (after I posted my previous message). To be honest, the plans I read about were a few months old and I might not be apprised of any revisions, so I don't want to jump on this pre-emptively, but I dunno man. I'd have to see some pretty impressive and convincing plans (along with a render or two) before I'd consider warming up to this project. Until then, I'll continue to be skeptical. I simply don't like the fact that it's replacing a perfectly fine and well-established corner, while other mediocre areas or flat-out parking lots (in areas that could benefit from and sustain density) lay untouched. But who knows, I may be wrong. If it turns out to be a stunning success and be a nice big boost to the community, I'll be eating my words. We'll just have to see what happens.
To be honest, that was the first Hume article that I really agreed to.
I agree that the buildings in the intersection shouldn't be demolished, not so much as for being historical, but for it being well established. And the reason for the development being here is Location, location,location, it is close to the subway and is right downtown. But I really can't see any other parking lots in that area though, most of Bloor Street/Annex area is already established. I also don't see that many large condo projects being built in the Annex area. The only ones I can think of is this and Mosaic which is built on Spadina south of Bloor which IMO, really isn't part of the Annex. Either way, the Annex is one of the best neighbourhoods in Toronto and I hope that it stays this way.
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Old May 21st, 2005, 05:02 AM   #231
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"wonder ... have you been to Bloor and Bedford? Perhaps, but are you well acquainted with the area (if you are, then I find your reaction even more surprising)? It's easy to be detached from a certain neighbourhood and say "yeah, just tear down those dusty ol' shacks and put up a nice, tall, shiny highrise", but when you're a part of that neighbourhood, those "ol' shacks" are inextricably linked with the community."


Yes, I'm very well aquainted with the area.

And yes, I'm completely in agreement with the development. It is the perfect example of excactly the smart kind of development the city is proposing. And it doesn't affect the Annex neighbourhood in any negative way at all...so there really isn no down side, which you seem to imply there is.

Harvey's, that dounut shop...the variety store are inextricably linked to the Annex??? That's BS. The BB is just one of a zillion local UofT watering holes...hardly the pillar of the community.








"I'm not saying it's a bad proposal per se, but simply that it just doesn't fit in. First of all, it would be disproportionate with its surroundings and just tower awkwardly over everything. Secondly, if the proposal was to be approved, it would set a dangerous precedent for the rest of the Annex, where several developers are already getting hard-ons about prospective large condo projects."



What do you mean it doesn't fit in...it's disproportionate????

Dude, the residential Annex is one thing...Bloor Street itself is another (between Yonge and Spadina)...Bloor street is lined with highrises in this area. Bloor st downtown is like the #2 main drag in the city...this is where the highrises are, and should be put...no-one is proposing it goes on the residential nabe north of it (although it has it's share of highrises itself).

It's just the most bizarre thing I ever heard...no highrises on Bloor West because it's a bad place to put them, and there aren't any there now????? Sure you aren't refering to another Bloor Street??








"This is simply not a neighbourhood to be messed around with. It works, and let's leave it at that"


The Annex is the place it is now, oddly enough, becasue it has changed considerably in it's history...if it didn't, it would still be another Rosedale.








KGB
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Old May 21st, 2005, 06:13 AM   #232
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Dundas Square is disgusting.
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Old May 21st, 2005, 07:17 AM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoonman
NIMBYism seems to have taken on an exaggerated, pejorative connotation on these boards, to the point of being a trendy buzzword that everyone likes to just throw around to sound cool.
There are NIMBYs, and then there are honest-to-goodness preservationists. Don't confuse the two.
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Old May 22nd, 2005, 12:36 AM   #234
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so i guess construction should be restarting on metropolis soon
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Old May 22nd, 2005, 12:43 AM   #235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbelan
so i guess construction should be restarting on metropolis soon
They should start as soon as possible if they want to open in 2007 as they said so. I guess they've found another building contractor, the crane's been moving around a little bit lately. I hope that they really pick up the pace on construction, I remember about the same time last year when they were still building upwards from the huge hole.
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Old May 25th, 2005, 04:04 AM   #236
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Skyline Update!
May 21, 2005


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Old May 25th, 2005, 04:13 AM   #237
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^Good comparison skybeam. Looking at the built buildings, and comparing to the poster, it looks almost bang on.
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Old May 25th, 2005, 04:25 AM   #238
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It looks pretty close to me and it proves me wrong. I always thought that the original 4 towers looked to short compared to the renders. Cityplace and the other waterfront condos sure are doing wonders for the skyline. But it makes you realize just how far away Cityplace is from completion.
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Old May 25th, 2005, 06:44 PM   #239
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i hope there will b more density on the westend of the ted because density is not great
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Old May 26th, 2005, 02:42 AM   #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KGB
...
Alright, here's the deal. I'm simply inherently suspicious of the proposal. Refer to my post above regarding the retail (or lack thereof) featured on Woodsworth's ground floor. I'm not a terribly huge fan of the architecture (but I admit that beauty is in the eye of the beholder), and the building is essentially dead at street level. Perhaps with time the rental space will see some tenants; I just hope it'll be something with a little more character than a convenience store or two.

Coming back to Bloor-Bedford, the current retail isn't as uninspiring as you claim. For every "generic" store you named, I can name at least another interesting one. I just hope that the proposed development won't become just another laundr-o-mat haven. I'll admit that I haven't seen the new plans, and I'm ready to embrace them if they prove as innovative and "smart" as you insist that they are. Hopefully, they'll also attract some interesting tenants to the area.

We'll see. I sincerely hope you're right and the development turns out to be fabulous. I'd personally like anything that takes some emphasis off the rather drab and unappealing (and currently dominating) OISE building.
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