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Old May 8th, 2013, 10:52 PM   #2261
isaidso
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuantumX View Post
You might make it into the top 10 skylines in the world. Miami will probably make it to over fifty skyscrapers over 500 feet by the end of this decade and I'll be happy with that. We might even make it back into the teens, but I doubt it. Believe it or not though, some people (very few) prefer the Miami skyline over others because it is one of the most modern when you consider nothing over 500 feet tall was built before 1980, just the opposite of your taste. Here are a couple I took just last night.
By 500ft+ buildings Toronto is currently outside the top 10, but that's not necessarily a good way of rating a skyline. Vancouver only has 4 buildings that tall, but it's skyline is certainly more impressive than 4 buildings would suggest.

Regarding Miami, I think Miami has a shot at top 20 in the world. The skyline is bigger than anything in Europe and will still be ahead of anything there in 2020. Besides New York, Chicago, Toronto, Panama City, and Melbourne, Miami's competition is Asia exclusively. Will there be 15 Asian skylines better than Miami?

Hong Kong, Shanghai, Guangzhou, Chongqing, Shenzhen, Nanjing, Tokyo, Seoul, Jakarta, Manila, Singapore, Kuala Lumpur, Bangkok, Mumbai, and Dubai. That's 15 right there so Miami needs to beat 1 of the cities listed above to crack the top 20. Panama City and Melbourne might be the lowest hanging fruit.
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Old May 8th, 2013, 11:58 PM   #2262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
By 500ft+ buildings Toronto is currently outside the top 10, but that's not necessarily a good way of rating a skyline. Vancouver only has 4 buildings that tall, but it's skyline is certainly more impressive than 4 buildings would suggest.

Regarding Miami, I think Miami has a shot at top 20 in the world. The skyline is bigger than anything in Europe and will still be ahead of anything there in 2020. Besides New York, Chicago, Toronto, Panama City, and Melbourne, Miami's competition is Asia exclusively. Will there be 14 Asian skylines better than Miami?

Hong Kong, Shanghai, Guangzhou, Chongqing, Shenzhen, Nanjing, Tokyo, Seoul, Jakarta, Manila, Singapore, Kuala Lumpur, Bangkok, Mumbai, and Dubai. That's 15 right there so Miami needs to beat 2 of the cities listed above to crack the top 20. Panama City and Melbourne might be the lowest hanging fruit.
Ever since I first saw that listing in the World Almanac where New York had nothing less than 500 feet tall, I've been obsessed with that number. I'm glad you feel the way you do though because like Vancouver, Miami has a lot of tall condos that just miss breaking 500 feet. The way the Asian cities are building though, I doubt if we'll make it back into the top 20 by the end of this decade. Anyway, here is another pic I took last night that I just had to share with you. I had to get a break in the breeze to pull this one off.

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DSC_0321 by QuantumX, on Flickr
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Old May 10th, 2013, 08:02 PM   #2263
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^ Nice pic, Quantum


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Old May 10th, 2013, 08:37 PM   #2264
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ONE WORLD TRADE CENTER - topped out!!

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Old May 10th, 2013, 11:33 PM   #2265
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^ Nice pic, Quantum
Thanks! It's just one of the results of my new 24.1-MP Nikon D5200, along with this one. I can get richer, shaper, more vivid images at night, but the tripod has to be perfectly still. The slightest bit of wind will ruin the shot. This is the south end of the Brickell Financial District in Miami, and this scene will fill with skyscrapers on both sizes of the Four Seasons over the next few years.

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Old May 11th, 2013, 12:20 AM   #2266
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Old May 11th, 2013, 06:05 AM   #2267
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Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
By 500ft+ buildings Toronto is currently outside the top 10, but that's not necessarily a good way of rating a skyline. Vancouver only has 4 buildings that tall, but it's skyline is certainly more impressive than 4 buildings would suggest.

Regarding Miami, I think Miami has a shot at top 20 in the world. The skyline is bigger than anything in Europe and will still be ahead of anything there in 2020. Besides New York, Chicago, Toronto, Panama City, and Melbourne, Miami's competition is Asia exclusively. Will there be 15 Asian skylines better than Miami?

Hong Kong, Shanghai, Guangzhou, Chongqing, Shenzhen, Nanjing, Tokyo, Seoul, Jakarta, Manila, Singapore, Kuala Lumpur, Bangkok, Mumbai, and Dubai. That's 15 right there so Miami needs to beat 1 of the cities listed above to crack the top 20. Panama City and Melbourne might be the lowest hanging fruit.
Are you talking strictly quantitatively, or taking into account factors such as height and style? There are some wild-card cities to watch over the rest of the decade. In Europe, there's Moscow, London, and potentially Istanbul who are all building like gangbusters right now. (actually, many European cities are but those are the 3 that should be on top by 2020)

Sydney has a decent construction boom going and still technically has a larger skyline than Melbourne (although I agree that Melbourne's is far superior).

Also look out for Busan, Tianjin, Osaka, Beijing, Dalian, Abu Dhabi, and possibly even Riyadh or Doha. Almost every major Asian city is throwing up supertalls.

Miami is going to have its work cut out for it. It's tough to rise in the rankings when every city of similar size or larger seems to be booming too. Miami has too many cheap looking condo towers that clog the skyline and block the views of the best buildings there, Wachovia and BOA. I bet it's one of those skylines that looks a lot better in real life. Other than scale, it's really underwhelming in pictures. I also have a pretty biased preference towards office towers.

In the US, other than scale, I would still rank Miami behind LA, Houston, Atlanta, Philly, and Seattle. The skyline is missing the "it" factor, something to make it pop. Is there a single spire in the entire city? Look at Gold Coast as an example of a much less massive skyline being notably more dramatic and sleek. Miami needs a new high-quality tallest building to stand out. I actually thought it looked better when I saw it in the late 90's because it had better height variation and the best 2 buildings were head and shoulders taller and able to stand out from the crowd.

Last edited by DZH22; May 11th, 2013 at 06:33 AM.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:53 AM   #2268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
Are you talking strictly quantitatively, or taking into account factors such as height and style? There are some wild-card cities to watch over the rest of the decade. In Europe, there's Moscow, London, and potentially Istanbul who are all building like gangbusters right now. (actually, many European cities are but those are the 3 that should be on top by 2020)

Sydney has a decent construction boom going and still technically has a larger skyline than Melbourne (although I agree that Melbourne's is far superior).

Also look out for Busan, Tianjin, Osaka, Beijing, Dalian, Abu Dhabi, and possibly even Riyadh or Doha. Almost every major Asian city is throwing up supertalls.

Miami is going to have its work cut out for it. It's tough to rise in the rankings when every city of similar size or larger seems to be booming too. Miami has too many cheap looking condo towers that clog the skyline and block the views of the best buildings there, Wachovia and BOA. I bet it's one of those skylines that looks a lot better in real life. Other than scale, it's really underwhelming in pictures. I also have a pretty biased preference towards office towers.

In the US, other than scale, I would still rank Miami behind LA, Houston, Atlanta, Philly, and Seattle. The skyline is missing the "it" factor, something to make it pop. Is there a single spire in the entire city? Look at Gold Coast as an example of a much less massive skyline being notably more dramatic and sleek. Miami needs a new high-quality tallest building to stand out. I actually thought it looked better when I saw it in the late 90's because it had better height variation and the best 2 buildings were head and shoulders taller and able to stand out from the crowd.
Yes, the response was purely from a mathematical pov. The cities I listed above aren't a definitive list, but include practically every city that will likely be ahead or even with Miami over the next 5 years.

I agree with your views regarding Miami's architecture. I prefer office buildings as well and Miami doesn't have too many impressive ones. That said, Miami's skyline is set to change drastically.

London, Moscow, and Sydney are building a lot too, but according to the resource below Miami will still be ahead of those 3 if the proposals (150m+ buildings) on the table in each city get built. You're right about Istanbul though. It would be ahead of Miami.


http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:16 AM   #2269
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4-5 years down the road. How might skylines stack up from a purely quantitative POV if all buildings currently under construction are completed and the inventory of proposals on the table are also realized? I used 150m+ buildings as a bench mark and omitted buildings listed as 'On Hold'. No data was available for Mexico City or Panama City.


Cities with over 50 Buildings 150m+: Built, U/C, Proposed

01. New York: 287
02. Dubai: 195
03. Hong Kong: 188
04. Bangkok: 138
05. Shanghai: 137
06. Tokyo: 135
07. Chicago: 134
08. Manila: 133
09. Shenzhen: 123
10. Toronto: 109

11. Mumbai: 104
12. Guangzhou: 102
13. Seoul: 87
14. Singapore: 87
15. Chongqing: 83
16. Jakarta: 83
17. Kuala Lumpur: 81
18. Nanjing: 71
19. Istanbul: 64
20. Melbourne: 57


http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/
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Last edited by isaidso; May 11th, 2013 at 11:00 AM.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:47 AM   #2270
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The list changes quite a bit if one uses 100m+ buildings instead.

Cities with over 100 Buildings 100m+: Built, U/C, Proposed

01. New York: 792
02. Shanghai: 745
03. Hong Kong: 682
04. Bangkok: 539
05. Tokyo: 447
06. Toronto: 375
07. Manila: 347
08. Dubai: 338
09. Chicago: 338
10. Seoul: 237

11. Guangzhou: 234
12. Kuala Lumpur: 230
13. Singapore: 227
14. Jakarta: 220
15. Mumbai: 197
16. Istanbul: 182
17. Chongqing: 178
18. Sao Paulo: 174
19. Shenzhen: 169
20. Moscow: 149

21. Sydney: 141
22. Melbourne: 139
23. Miami: 126
24. Beijing: 114
25. Nanjing: 108


http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/
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Old May 11th, 2013, 11:53 AM   #2271
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On (Skyscraperpage) many buildings lacking in cities. for example, Hong Kong has, according to CTBUH and Emporis over 290 buildings over 500 ft which is not yet anything but some buildings are listed without altitude but over 50 floors at the end of the list (CTBUH). The same applies to Dubai or Istanbul.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 12:06 PM   #2272
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Edit.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 12:07 PM   #2273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KlausDiggy View Post
On (Skyscraperpage) many buildings lacking in cities. for example, Hong Kong has, according to CTBUH and Emporis over 290 buildings over 500 ft which is not yet anything but some buildings are listed without altitude but over 50 floors at the end of the list (CTBUH). The same applies to Dubai or Istanbul.
There are a few cities where the data is incomplete. The majority of it on SSP is quite accurate though.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 04:10 PM   #2274
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Panama City

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Old May 11th, 2013, 07:34 PM   #2275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
Miami is going to have its work cut out for it. It's tough to rise in the rankings when every city of similar size or larger seems to be booming too.
In the world rankings, of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
Miami has too many cheap looking condo towers that clog the skyline and block the views of the best buildings there, Wachovia and BOA.
Wachovia is now the Southeast Financial Center again, and what was the Bank of America regional head quarters is now simply the Miami Tower. And I agree that even though they were built in the 80s, they are still two of the cities best towers architecturally. They have stood the test of time well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
I bet it's one of those skylines that looks a lot better in real life. Other than scale, it's really underwhelming in pictures. I also have a pretty biased preference towards office towers.
Oh well, I do my best to do it justice in photographs.

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Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
In the US, other than scale, I would still rank Miami behind LA, Houston, Atlanta, Philly, and Seattle.
To each his own. What about San Francisco with it's Transamerica Pyramid or whatever it's called now and how about the bridges and how they compliment the skyline?

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Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
The skyline is missing the "it" factor, something to make it pop.
Yes, this is just about everybody's criticism of the Miami skyline. This is in the works. Far from down here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
Is there a single spire in the entire city?
Brickell on the River North and South have barely perceptible spires as does the Epic hotel and tower. I'm not a big fan of spires myself. To me that look too Flash Gordon and retro-New York.

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Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
Miami needs a new high-quality tallest building to stand out.
This is in the works. The boom of the last decade was driven by a lot of speculative greed with a lot of developers just looking to make a fast buck. Let's see what we get in this decade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DZH22 View Post
I actually thought it looked better when I saw it in the late 90's because it had better height variation and the best 2 buildings were head and shoulders taller and able to stand out from the crowd.
Are you serious? This is the view from my 15th floor South Beach apartment in 1998. I'll take the skyline we have today over this any day, hands down, in a heart beat.

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August 7, 2005 (13) by QuantumX, on Flickr

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Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
I agree with your views regarding Miami's architecture. I prefer office buildings as well and Miami doesn't have too many impressive ones. That said, Miami's skyline is set to change drastically.
Thank you for your contributions, Isaidso. Miami will probably not rise in world stature with everything else going on in the world, but looks like we could have a lock on the third largest skyline in the U.S. Regardless of what any other buildings in any other U.S. city look like, I'll take the Miami skyline as it stands today, along with what's what's coming.

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Last edited by QuantumX; May 11th, 2013 at 09:56 PM.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:42 PM   #2276
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Miami has too many cheap looking condo towers that clog the skyline and block the views of the best buildings there, Wachovia and BOA.
I guess I shouldn't have given this photo to my aunt as a 36 x 24 inch framed enlargement for her 78th birthday then. Wachovia and BOA (now Southeast Financial Center and Miami tower respectively) aren't even in the shot. Oh well, she loved it anyway.

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5325934677_af3d60e4f7_o by QuantumX, on Flickr
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Old May 12th, 2013, 12:37 AM   #2277
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Agree. Hong Kong and Shanghai don't even give me that feeling of massiveness that Manhattan does. It's still unique in the world, imo.
I don't know but Shanghai looks quite massive to me:

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Old May 12th, 2013, 01:12 AM   #2278
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Yes, the Shanghai skyline is pretty massive, but I think Isaidso was referring to how the buildings are closer together in New York, as if they are about to create a volcanic eruption. When I first saw the New York skyline, it was silhouetted against the setting sun, and I swear I couldn't believe what I was seeing. I thought it was mountain range.

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Old May 12th, 2013, 03:15 AM   #2279
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Are you serious? This is the view from my 15th floor South Beach apartment in 1998. I'll take the skyline we have today over this any day, hands down, in a heart beat.

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August 7, 2005 (13) by QuantumX, on Flickr
This is one of the most awful pics you could have possibly chose. Was the skyline *really* this blurry back in 1998? Up close, it looked better in 1998. It also looks better at night. You did a really nice job on that shot that your aunt liked. From further away, it obviously looks significantly better now than it did in 1998. It's just that now my 2 favorite towers are hidden (thanks for the name correction) and they have almost fully lost their impacts on the skyline. However, I will admit I am a fan of the 4 Seasons, Wells Fargo, and Espirito Santo Plaza.

Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
London, Moscow, and Sydney are building a lot too, but according to the resource below Miami will still be ahead of those 3 if the proposals (150m+ buildings) on the table in each city get built. You're right about Istanbul though. It would be ahead of Miami.
http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/
I feel like in cases such as Moscow, you have to step back and say "Hey, Moscow has a ton of supertalls and maybe that should weigh a little bit more heavily." Here's a combination of Moscow and Miami including everything built, U/C, and proposed.

http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?searchID=59314441

The difference at the top is that much larger when we remove proposed

http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?searchID=59314449

Last edited by DZH22; May 12th, 2013 at 03:20 AM.
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Old May 12th, 2013, 04:07 AM   #2280
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This is one of the most awful pics you could have possibly chose. Was the skyline *really* this blurry back in 1998? Up close, it looked better in 1998. It also looks better at night. You did a really nice job on that shot that your aunt liked. From further away, it obviously looks significantly better now than it did in 1998. It's just that now my 2 favorite towers are hidden (thanks for the name correction) and they have almost fully lost their impacts on the skyline.
Just for you, sugarman! Can you make out your two blasts from the past? The Miami Tower is bathed in orange and the Southeast Financial Center is the tallest building in the frame. I'd like to see them light that building the way they have Chase and BOA lit up in Dallas.

(Btw, that old photo is just what I happened to have in my files. I didn't take it and it was photocopied from a photograph somebody took while visiting me. I only use it to compare before and after.)

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