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Old November 12th, 2007, 05:10 AM   #581
hkskyline
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We shouldn't forget the significant amounts of infill that have risen in Midtown over the past decade that has made the skyline 'fuller', and the complementary skyline rising on the Jersey side. New York isn't all about the WTC after all. Midtown has a huge contingent - much wider than Lower Manhattan in fact, and that part of NYC is changing rapidly these days. But the change is evident even along the Hudson shores further up (ie. Trump's series of buildings).
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Old November 12th, 2007, 12:07 PM   #582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
We shouldn't forget the significant amounts of infill that have risen in Midtown over the past decade that has made the skyline 'fuller', and the complementary skyline rising on the Jersey side. New York isn't all about the WTC after all. Midtown has a huge contingent - much wider than Lower Manhattan in fact, and that part of NYC is changing rapidly these days. But the change is evident even along the Hudson shores further up (ie. Trump's series of buildings).
compared to the two Midtown has a more "striking" skyline. I also like the positioning especially the ESB on the centre. It is also the main CBD of Manahttan.
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Old November 12th, 2007, 05:24 PM   #583
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They are going to build a third CBD on Manhattan Island, which will be the 4th largest CBD in America. There will be many new 700'+ I'm sure, and a lot that are much taller. I bet the centerpiece building(s) of this CBD will be at least 1,300', if not much more.
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Old November 12th, 2007, 05:56 PM   #584
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Originally Posted by WANCH View Post
compared to the two Midtown has a more "striking" skyline. I also like the positioning especially the ESB on the centre. It is also the main CBD of Manahttan.
The ESB only is centered from the north-south axis :



However, to fully appreciate the breadth of New York's Midtown skyline, it has to be from an east / west vantage point.



In this more stunning view, the ESB is nowhere at centre, which makes much sense since it's at 34th, and there's a lot more tall stuff going north from there than going south.
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Old November 12th, 2007, 06:05 PM   #585
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Source : http://www.pbase.com/rfcd100/panoramas











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Old November 12th, 2007, 11:25 PM   #586
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^No one can ever beat that, and keep in mind that you only hardly see the west side of Lower Manhattan (w/ the WFC/GS Tower, ect) and east side of midtown (Trump World, UN HQ, Chrysler) in those pictures, except for a little in the last one. With all of the new towers going up south of the ESB, the skyline will be extended even more. Wait for 2020 and jaws will drop even lower.
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Old November 13th, 2007, 04:40 AM   #587
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BTW, x-mas is near so The ESB must have a red/green lighting
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Old November 13th, 2007, 09:24 AM   #588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebola View Post
^No one can ever beat that, and keep in mind that you only hardly see the west side of Lower Manhattan (w/ the WFC/GS Tower, ect) and east side of midtown (Trump World, UN HQ, Chrysler) in those pictures, except for a little in the last one. With all of the new towers going up south of the ESB, the skyline will be extended even more. Wait for 2020 and jaws will drop even lower.
Yep, so in my quest to see how big the New York skyline is, I had to go to several places :

Weehawken / Port Imperial - to see the western Midtown skyline
Jersey City / Hoboken & Staten Island ferry - to see the Lower Manhattan skyline
Long Island City shores & along some of the elevated 7 line stations in Queens - to see the eastern Midtown skyline
Fort Wadsworth, Staten Island - Lower Manhattan, some of Midtown, Brooklyn, Jersey
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Old November 13th, 2007, 10:42 AM   #589
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When I see it, Mid-Town Manhattan including the upper west / east side have the biggest cluster in a particular area. Mid-Town is also considered the largest CBD in North America
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Old November 13th, 2007, 10:59 AM   #590
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH View Post
When I see it, Mid-Town Manhattan including the upper west / east side have the biggest cluster in a particular area. Mid-Town is also considered the largest CBD in North America
Don't think Upper East / West Sides are part of Midtown though, although the skyline does stretch well into both areas.
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Old November 13th, 2007, 11:10 AM   #591
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
Don't think Upper East / West Sides are part of Midtown though, although the skyline does stretch well into both areas.
I was more refering to the skyline. Upper East does have some density with its high-rise apartments.

BTW, I'll be flying to the US this Sat with LA as the first destination. I'm then off to NY a week after that
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Old November 13th, 2007, 11:24 AM   #592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH View Post
I was more refering to the skyline. Upper East does have some density with its high-rise apartments.
I find the Upper East has a lot more density established than the Upper West, although Trump has a major development along the Upper West shores facing the Hudson so that is starting to change.
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Old November 13th, 2007, 11:27 AM   #593
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
I find the Upper East has a lot more density established than the Upper West, although Trump has a major development along the Upper West shores facing the Hudson so that is starting to change.
Trump's development is not much compared to the density of Upper East. Upper East on the other hand is much more upscale than it's counterpart. Upper West to me is more the residential area of NY's bohemian community.
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Old November 13th, 2007, 12:28 PM   #594
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH View Post
Trump's development is not much compared to the density of Upper East. Upper East on the other hand is much more upscale than it's counterpart. Upper West to me is more the residential area of NY's bohemian community.
I'm not trying to argue Trump's redevelopment would triumph over the Upper East Side's density. That's a silly thought to begin with. However, that development marks a change in the area and we expect to see more in the Upper West to fill in the skyline. There are quite a lot of empty lots all along that stretch of the Hudson, with plenty of old warehouse and dock space to raze and rebuild.
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Old November 14th, 2007, 04:26 AM   #595
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
I'm not trying to argue Trump's redevelopment would triumph over the Upper East Side's density. That's a silly thought to begin with. However, that development marks a change in the area and we expect to see more in the Upper West to fill in the skyline. There are quite a lot of empty lots all along that stretch of the Hudson, with plenty of old warehouse and dock space to raze and rebuild.
I wouldn't mind seeing more high-rise developments in The Upper Westside. In fact I would like to see more of these around NY including the outer borough and neighbouring Jersey
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Old November 14th, 2007, 05:24 AM   #596
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Quote:
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I wouldn't mind seeing more high-rise developments in The Upper Westside. In fact I would like to see more of these around NY including the outer borough and neighbouring Jersey
This should fill up the area south of the ESB nicely, and I expect this type of news to slowly move north.

Five Firms Vie for Chance To Build on Far West Side
13 October 2007
The New York Times

Five developers submitted separate billion-dollar offers this week for the right to transform the West Side railyards -- what the Bloomberg administration once called ''a hole in the ground'' -- into a small city of residential and commercial skyscrapers with 12 acres of parks and open space.

One of the bidders, the Extell Development Company, would use ''suspension bridge technology'' to span the two 13-acre yards flanking 11th Avenue between 30th and 33rd Streets, while the trains continue to operate, according to real estate executives briefed on the bids.

Extell would erect a dozen towers over the next 15 years, including one more than 1,000 feet tall, at the northern and southern borders of the sites, leaving parkland and open space at the center. The design for this proposal also incorporates a public park on a defunct elevated railway that runs west along 30th Street and north along 12th Avenue.

The four other bidders would build concrete and steel platforms over the railyards and erect a similar array of towers and open space, as well as a home for a yet-to-be-determined cultural institution.

The railyards, which are owned by the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, represent both a rare opportunity to acquire 26 acres of waterfront property in Manhattan and a daunting challenge to redevelop an industrial neighborhood and make it into a major commercial district over the coming decade.

Tishman Speyer Properties has formed a joint venture with Morgan Stanley, the global investment bank, whose headquarters are at the north end of Times Square; their plan calls for a major skyscraper on the eastern railyard that would be a new headquarters for the bank and perhaps the start of another financial district in Manhattan.

Another bidder, a joint venture of the Durst Organization and Vornado Realty Trust, has a tentative agreement with Conde Nast Publications, publisher of Vanity Fair, Gourmet, The New Yorker and 24 other magazines, to build a new home for the company in a 1.5 million-square-foot tower on the eastern railyard.

The Related Companies, one of the city's biggest residential builders, has formed a joint venture with Goldman Sachs, another major investment bank, and hired three architects -- Kohn Pedersen Fox, Arquitectonica and Robert A. M. Stern -- to design its proposal. And Brookfield Properties, the fifth bidder, used Skidmore, Owings & Merrill and Field Operations to develop a master plan, while Skidmore and the architects Thomas Phifer & Partners, SHoP Architects and Diller Scofidio & Renfro designed the towers.

''This is a massive development opportunity that we may never see again,'' said Anna Levin, a member of Community Board 4, whose district includes the yards. ''It'll be the biggest public-private partnership you've ever seen. But planning for development that we'll need for generations to come is a complex process. It has to take into account a multitude of public and private considerations.''

The transportation authority, which had hoped to reap $1 billion from the sale of the development rights to the yards, confirmed that it had received five offers, but declined to provide any details. The authority said it expected to select the winning bidder, or combination of bidders, by February or March, after conducting a design review that would include an opportunity for public comment.

The Bloomberg administration is keenly interested in the outcome because it views the railyards as a key element in a plan to transform the Far West Side. It hopes to begin work soon on an extension of the No. 7 subway from Times Square to the railyards.

The bidders were loath to comment publicly on their proposals for fear of alienating the transportation authority. But real estate executives who saw the offers said that each developer had made a nominal bid of about $1 billion for the development rights.

Still, it is difficult to determine the true value of the offers because every proposal has a different set of contingencies and involves a series of payments over years. City and state officials will also evaluate how quickly each developer would start construction.

Ms. Levin said she hoped the transportation authority would release the proposals submitted by all the developers, in their entirety, because they might include some good ideas that do not fall within the city and the authority's design guidelines.

Big project proposals in New York can take a torturous and lengthy path to construction, or collapse. A succession of mayors and governors sought futilely to build a baseball stadium for the Yankees or a football stadium for the Jets over the railyards. But in 2005, the city rezoned the Far West Side for high-rise development and the transportation authority sought to sell the development rights over the railyards to raise $1 billion for its capital budget.

Assemblyman Richard L. Brodsky, who heads a legislative committee that oversees the authority, said the railyards should be viewed alongside plans for the subway extension, the expansion of the nearby convention center and proposals for Pennsylvania Station. He questioned whether there had been adequate planning for the related projects. ''The receipt of the bids raises the curtain on a chaotic set of issues that have to be resolved,'' Mr. Brodsky said.

The city and the transportation authority created a conceptual plan for the railyards detailing what could be built there and the general location of the buildings, which could vary between 60 and 70 stories. The yard on the eastern side of 11th Avenue has been zoned for development, but plans for the western yard would have to go through the city's public review process, presumably with the support of the Bloomberg administration and the City Council president, Christine C. Quinn.

Before they build the first tower, however, developers must erect platforms or spans over the railyards while trains continue running. Douglas Durst of the Durst Organization, which has hired the architects FXFowle and Rafael Pelli, has estimated that the platforms would cost about $1.5 billion. But Extell hopes to save money by using bridge-building technology instead.
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Old November 14th, 2007, 07:25 AM   #597
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Wow, some wonderful NYC photos posted here.

Here is a great photo of those two famous NYC skylines...

image hosted on flickr
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Old November 14th, 2007, 08:35 AM   #598
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I really like that aerial shot and it really shows both skylines.
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Old November 14th, 2007, 08:44 AM   #599
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The new WTC will block a bit of that view in a couple of years.
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Old November 14th, 2007, 09:40 AM   #600
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Quote:
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The new WTC will block a bit of that view in a couple of years.
Only the western part of Midtown. Central and eastern Midtown has some of the most notable and tallest scrapers in Manhattan so we will still have a nice view of these parts when shot from this vantage point.
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