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Old March 9th, 2017, 01:21 PM   #1
Ji-Ja-Jot
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HAMBURG | Elbtower | 200m | 656ft | Pro

Masterplan for eastern HafenCity has been changed and finally approved.


Elbtower

District: HH-Mitte
Quarter: Hafen-City
Sub-quarter: Elbbruecken-Quartier


Status and project facts:
  • Building height: has been lifted from 150m to 200m
  • Investment: approx 1.1 bn US€ / 1bn €
  • Usage: Mixed Use
  • Status: Height and construction-mass approved, next week the project will be introduced at the immobile exhibition in Cannes.
  • Investor: Will be announced in 2018. No public money
  • Architect: Competition in preparation. Building shall look "sculptural" with a "unique crown". No investor-box wanted.

Following pictures are only Mass-Studies
to give people an impression of location, height and mass


www.hamburg.de


www.hamburg.de


www.hamburg.de

In following picture all buildings are mass-studies. competitions for all shown buildings are ongoing / in preparation

www.hamburg.de
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Old March 9th, 2017, 01:47 PM   #2
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Wonderful News
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Old March 9th, 2017, 03:50 PM   #3
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what the heck ! thats awesome News
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Old March 9th, 2017, 04:15 PM   #4
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Great news. The design looks quite elegant for a mass study
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Old March 9th, 2017, 04:17 PM   #5
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The mass looks beautiful, hope the actual design reflects that quality.
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Old March 9th, 2017, 05:31 PM   #6
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Is it only going to be one tower though? I remember they initially thought it was going to be 2-4.
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Old March 10th, 2017, 03:55 PM   #7
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That area has been seen various planings.
From none skyscraper at all -
over 360 m Glass-Pyramid
or a bunch of skyscrapers
od just one 100 m Building
to 3 up to 150 m Buildings
and now finally one 200m.

But if you can see from the areial view, they don't place this one in the middle but leave plenty of space for further development-option. I think this is what the respeonsible persons really have in mind - even if the city major and his city development chief say it different. You have to keep in mind that those guys just lost the Olympic Games Referendum and have to avoid of beeing considered megalomaniacs in a city, that has never seen any skyscraper in its boarders at all
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Old March 10th, 2017, 04:30 PM   #8
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Finally a skyscraper in the civilised part of Germany!! Great news!!
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Old March 10th, 2017, 05:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by droneriot View Post
Finally a skyscraper in the civilised part of Germany!! Great news!!
Since Frankfurt is the only german city with skyscrapers (+200m towers), I take it you mean Frankfurt is not civilized.

After years in Germany, I like to think of myself as an insider understanding different layers of peoples thinking, even including some ideosyncratic, regional perspectives.

That Frankfurt is not civilized can only be the perspective of a red, or...?
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Old March 10th, 2017, 05:13 PM   #10
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Is that 1 billion euro just for the tower or the entire area?
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Old March 10th, 2017, 05:33 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELH View Post
That Frankfurt is not civilized can only be the perspective of a red, or...?
A red what? Colours have perspectives? What? English please.

Anyway, our beautiful North has always been a bit slow on development, so I'm quite glad things are picking up a bit. So far the best we've had in terms of towers were the beach resorts in Travemünde and Timmendorfer Strand and of course the new Elbphilharmonie. A 200m skyscraper will be a big step up from those.
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Old March 10th, 2017, 05:49 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by droneriot View Post
A red what? Colours have perspectives? What? English please.

Anyway, our beautiful North has always been a bit slow on development, so I'm quite glad things are picking up a bit. So far the best we've had in terms of towers were the beach resorts in Travemünde and Timmendorfer Strand and of course the new Elbphilharmonie. A 200m skyscraper will be a big step up from those.
Off course colors are associated with perspectives:

"Red is traditionally associated with socialism and communism. The oldest symbol of socialism (and, by extension, communism) is the Red Flag, which dates back to the French Revolution in the 18th century and the revolutions of 1848. All major socialist and communist alliances and organisations used red as their official colour.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_colour

I`m fond of northern germany as well, only didn`t see what made other regions uncivilized! Maybe I`m bad at understanding humor ?!?
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Old March 10th, 2017, 06:41 PM   #13
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Hamburg is pretty much "red". And since skyscrapers are linkend in "red-heads" with captialism-only, it's always big fuzz and screaming, if a building is planned over here with over 7 floors. No joke.

In Frankfurt a new 200m Building is "recogniszed" in Hamburg currently everybody turnes crazy. The mayor kind off "apologized" in an interview for planning "that high" and ensured he is not going for "Frankfurtian conditions". While in German origin language the word "Conditions (Zustaende)" is a very negative term in this case.
That's the situation in Hamburg, and of course not only because of the "Reds".

Quote:
Originally Posted by stofzuiger View Post
Is that 1 billion euro just for the tower or the entire area?
1 Tower. While I think the area is linked to that (square design + Building base).
I am curious, what potential investors in Cannes will say to that. It is a shitload of money for still a second city.
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Old March 10th, 2017, 07:38 PM   #14
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Yeah, gasp, 200m would actually be visible. Elphi is 108 meters and driving through Hamburg it's almost completely lost among church steeples, millions of cargo cranes, Köhlbrandbrücke pylons, etc. It's one of the "busiest" looking cities I've ever been to with so many thousands of different things going on in your line of sight everywhere you look, people must be feeling awkward there could actually be a little bit of a focal point that keeps you from having a seizure from too many visual impulses for two seconds.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 11:55 AM   #15
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I still do not get why they would limit the height to only 200 metres. There is not much in the area that could be impacted by shadows. I think I will send a PDF to the senate of Hamburg and explain to them that 200 metres is not enough for becoming a real landmark tower in the decades to come. Even Sweden - were virtually no people live - is constructing a much higher skyscraper (I think 265 metres). My idea is to use skyscraper models in Google Earth to show how much impact other famous buildings (like The Shard) would have at that exact location. Hamburg is a very rich city. They could easily find tenants for a 300 metre tower and make it financially viable. So why go for just 200 metres? Even if 200 metres seems tall today, we have to keep in mind that the building might stand there for a hundered years or more. By then every small town in China will have a 200 metre tower :-) This really is a chance for skyscraper fans to lobby for a tall tower, as the problem is not the money, but the restrictions of the senate. Hamburg should make the tower at least taller than the tallest building in Frankfurt, which is Commerzbank with 259 metres if you do not count the spire.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 12:58 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twopsy View Post
I still do not get why they would limit the height to only 200 metres. There is not much in the area that could be impacted by shadows. I think I will send a PDF to the senate of Hamburg and explain to them that 200 metres is not enough for becoming a real landmark tower in the decades to come. Even Sweden - were virtually no people live - is constructing a much higher skyscraper (I think 265 metres). My idea is to use skyscraper models in Google Earth to show how much impact other famous buildings (like The Shard) would have at that exact location. Hamburg is a very rich city. They could easily find tenants for a 300 metre tower and make it financially viable. So why go for just 200 metres? Even if 200 metres seems tall today, we have to keep in mind that the building might stand there for a hundered years or more. By then every small town in China will have a 200 metre tower :-) This really is a chance for skyscraper fans to lobby for a tall tower, as the problem is not the money, but the restrictions of the senate. Hamburg should make the tower at least taller than the tallest building in Frankfurt, which is Commerzbank with 259 metres if you do not count the spire.
On the one hand, your are right (that each smaller chinese town will have a taller tower, etc)!

However, that is only an argument if you view tall buildings in terms of status symbols, which you can´t. Maybe one once could, but that has changed.

Actually, it is a sign of wealth and self-confidence, not to build tall. No one doubts that Germany could build tall, technologically and economically (m g, Beirut is turning a skyscraper city). For the worlds 4. biggest economy to say "we want it differently", is sign of great individuality and quirked pride.

In a 100 years, the really unique cities are those where despite being rich both historically and economically, spires and domes are still the skyline carriers. There may be some such cities, for instance Florence, Rome, Dresden, maybe central Prague and central Nuremberg.

Personally, I´m pro building tall as long as there is an "organically growing" local tradition behind it. I don´t like "single standing towers which don´t blend naturally into any urban landscape". The Elbtower is OK because it stands outside og the pre-existing urban landscape, constitutes an extention of it....and....because it is NOT taller than it is. Hamburg couldn´t bear to be associated with one single, all defining Burj.
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Last edited by ELH; March 12th, 2017 at 01:14 PM.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 03:06 PM   #17
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I don't understand why you think that Europe needs to prove its prosperity with more, higher skyscrapers. I'm frankly tired of all this bulls**t.
For example South East Asia will always remain a s**t-hole, even if they build 100.000 skyscrapers per year.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 05:34 PM   #18
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@twopsy

Hamburg is not joining any skyscraperrace in height with 200m, neither with 300m. This project will focus on design and public-usage.

Last edited by Ji-Ja-Jot; March 12th, 2017 at 05:43 PM.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 06:57 PM   #19
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I really hope Hamburg can do it.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 07:05 PM   #20
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I like the shape of the building, but I'm not really keen on these lonely towers being placed all over the place (especially in European cities).
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