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Old May 7th, 2006, 06:50 AM   #221
Clashman
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How do you know that? If the vast majority of people are happy with the government, why can't you let people have free access to information or protest it's actions, or even to get rid of that government if they decide they aren't happy with it anymore?
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Old May 7th, 2006, 06:54 AM   #222
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Originally Posted by Clashman
If you are all willing to do the same, and if discussion of 3 Gorges can also include criticism and disagreement with the ways and methods in which it is being constructed without people resorting to deriding all of those criticisms as U.S. propaganda, then sure.
You can critisize the Three Gorges Dam all you want but it is an engineering wonder. Maybe threatening to the enviroment but considering your so-called-regard for Chinese people, they deserve to live without the constant floods of the Yangze. The Aswan High Dam made the land around the Nile much more fertile, who knows what 3 Gorges Dam can do.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 06:59 AM   #223
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It's been fun everyone, but I think I have to go for now. I hope that if you've taken anything from this conversation, you've learned to look at what I have been saying and respond to the arguments I'm making rather than simply bash my percieved nationality. I also hope that you come to realize that you can be critical of something without being jealous of it or wanting to see a country as a whole fail, but that might be too much to ask at this point. Good day to you all.

"The government needs criticism from its people... We must learn from old mistakes, take all forms of healthy criticism, and do what we can to answer these criticisms."

百华齐放,百家争鸣。

Last edited by Clashman; May 7th, 2006 at 08:25 AM.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 07:03 AM   #224
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It's been fun everyone, but I think I have to go for now. I hope that if you've taken anything from this conversation, you've learned to look at what I have been saying and respond to the arguments I'm making rather than simply bash my percieved nationality. I also hope that you come to realize that you can be critical of something without being jealous of it or wanting to see a country as a whole fail, but that might be too much to ask at this point. Good day to you all.
Yes, I've learned that you need to get some help. Therapist are very easy to get I just don't know if you can afford them.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 07:33 AM   #225
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Originally Posted by Clashman
Beginning in 1979, I believe, and continuing throughout the 1980's and perhaps even a bit into the 90's, China engaged in a secret border war with Vietnam, in part because Vietnam had allied itself more with Russia and not so much with China, who the Vietnamese have been resisting for over a thousand years. It is not formally acknowledged by either government, but thousands, if not 10's of thousands, were killed. It is generally presumed that Vietnam "won" the war.

Now I wanna know how the **** this has anything to do with the premise under the gorge dam construction.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 07:59 AM   #226
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Now I wanna know how the **** this has anything to do with the premise under the gorge dam construction.

it doesn't, clashman is ****ed up in the head from the dope he's been snorting ...
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Old May 7th, 2006, 09:09 AM   #227
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Originally Posted by Clashman
Yeah. Most governments in this world "function" without the consent of most of their people. China is no exception in this regard.
It should be rewritten as "most government in this world function without the consent of most of the Americans or those pro-democracy people. Iran, Iraq and North Korea are no exeption in this regard.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 11:20 AM   #228
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Even though there will be an underwater museum, it still wouldve been better to visit the kool artifacts and visit the villages at the same time.
; (
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Old May 7th, 2006, 01:27 PM   #229
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wow, i am so happy, this thread become hot now. but when i saw what you said i found most words not about this dam at all.
it's just a dam, the only different is the biggest in earth, if people think build dam for get electric power and better ship way but kill fish and destroy the natureal is wrong, every dam in human history is wrong, isn't it? why some people not talk something about dam in Europe US Cananda or Egypt(in my memory Aswan Dam is here), just say something about the No.1? you can ask your goverment to destory your dam, at least,i support this dam, as smart Sen said: we are creating our history. if one day my children want go to other planets to start new live and give up earth, i will admire their capacity never talk something about political, war, economy, democracy or other things, there are useless. i think only science, technology, music and art can be called as human fortune.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 02:27 PM   #230
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economic development isn't human development. China builds a lot of skyscrapers and dams, it's the first manufacturer of watches, mobile phone, PC, LCD Televisions etc.... but the workers of these factories and the most of chinese people don't earn enough money to buy all that.....
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Old May 7th, 2006, 04:28 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rem
economic development isn't human development. China builds a lot of skyscrapers and dams, it's the first manufacturer of watches, mobile phone, PC, LCD Televisions etc.... but the workers of these factories and the most of chinese people don't earn enough money to buy all that.....
I think people from rich countries constantly want to screw poor countries so that they can remain at top for ever. Please take a look at the reality of this world, and compare what China has achieved with other poor countries.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=345718
And think, what is human development???

Last edited by wigo; May 7th, 2006 at 04:54 PM.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 04:54 PM   #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rem
economic development isn't human development. China builds a lot of skyscrapers and dams, it's the first manufacturer of watches, mobile phone, PC, LCD Televisions etc.... but the workers of these factories and the most of chinese people don't earn enough money to buy all that.....
wrong. PC is very common in china, even monk use that which may betray Buddhism's doxy, mobile phone also very cheap(who not have means he is very poor or cool), in fact most people live in countryside use mobile phone but not have phone for cost reason, as there has time on it so most people not use watch at all. LCD Television is very common in cities because it's use much less place, this place more expensive than LCD Television itself. in counteyside few people use it. i think develop technology and output will cut cost, so everyone can have them.
in china most of students have PC, mobilephone but not have TV because few people is interestde in TV program except sports program, we can use software such as TVview see the living in the net or add a TV card into computer to receving TV signal. house, medical treatment and education are very dear, not everyone can offer them, last year a rich man use 1 million dollars in half year to treat his father's disease, but that man dead and people find most money are skimped by doctors. so we need more skyscrapers and more hospital and more schools and more energy sources, enough competation must helpful for cut our spending.
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Old May 7th, 2006, 05:10 PM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metallinestorm
wow, i am so happy, this thread become hot now. but when i saw what you said i found most words not about this dam at all.
it's just a dam, the only different is the biggest in earth, if people think build dam for get electric power and better ship way but kill fish and destroy the natureal is wrong, every dam in human history is wrong, isn't it? why some people not talk something about dam in Europe US Cananda or Egypt(in my memory Aswan Dam is here), just say something about the No.1? you can ask your goverment to destory your dam, at least,i support this dam, as smart Sen said: we are creating our history.
See, the problem is that you assume we don't criticize dam construction in our own countries. People DO in fact rally against dam construction, the displacement, and environmental damage that they often cause. Just to give you a few examples:

http://www.globalexchange.org/countr...xico/2688.html
http://www.irn.org/pubs/wrr/9806/maheshwar.html
http://www.tri-cityherald.com/news/2...03/story1.html
http://www.choike.org/nuevo_eng/informes/3401.html
http://www.time.com/time/asia/magazi...400073,00.html
http://www.mizzima.com/archives/news...April05-36.htm
http://members.aol.com/tagaeri/belize.html
http://www.threegorgesprobe.org/pi/d...ng3G/ch02.html

It isn't just "The big bad west picking on poor little defenseless China".
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Old May 7th, 2006, 06:41 PM   #234
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Quote:
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It isn't just "The big bad west picking on poor little defenseless China".
?????
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Old May 7th, 2006, 06:42 PM   #235
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rgfgfgfg
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Old May 7th, 2006, 07:35 PM   #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metallinestorm
wrong. PC is very common in china, even monk use that which may betray Buddhism's doxy, mobile phone also very cheap(who not have means he is very poor or cool), in fact most people live in countryside use mobile phone but not have phone for cost reason, as there has time on it so most people not use watch at all. LCD Television is very common in cities because it's use much less place, this place more expensive than LCD Television itself. in counteyside few people use it. i think develop technology and output will cut cost, so everyone can have them.
in china most of students have PC, mobilephone but not have TV because few people is interestde in TV program except sports program, we can use software such as TVview see the living in the net or add a TV card into computer to receving TV signal. house, medical treatment and education are very dear, not everyone can offer them, last year a rich man use 1 million dollars in half year to treat his father's disease, but that man dead and people find most money are skimped by doctors. so we need more skyscrapers and more hospital and more schools and more energy sources, enough competation must helpful for cut our spending.
I'm glad to hear that China is now problem free...maybe I'll move there soon
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Old May 8th, 2006, 09:12 AM   #237
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Thanks for the big laugh.
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Old May 8th, 2006, 10:22 AM   #238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clashman
See, the problem is that you assume we don't criticize dam construction in our own countries. People DO in fact rally against dam construction, the displacement, and environmental damage that they often cause.
ok, but you should clear understand that i am nobody, i just care about the NO.1 dam's construction and i support this project, imo, you say something bad about this dam i will against you, you say something need change in china you should find somebody such as ministers, premier, president or you can try to make the top chinese power organization people congress to belive in you, i can't do anything for you because i am not agree with you at all.
in fact, Mr Sun zhongshan (father of latter-day china) wanted built this dam in the early 20th century, many scholar thought that dam had strategic means, but in that time china not had the ability and technology; in Mr Mazo zedong age china need think about the world wide war and others things; during these 20 years, discuss this great dam laso very hot, but in 1998, a flood kill over one thousand chinese, so the build voice win at last. in fact this great dam cost just about china one week GDP, the most important problem is should people can change the natureal just for people's better lives, may be stupid people can't creat their future lives by thier technology but who knows, imo, we need try.

Last edited by metallinestorm; May 8th, 2006 at 10:42 AM.
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Old May 8th, 2006, 11:10 AM   #239
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Originally Posted by Grygry
The real issue seems to me to be the waste management in China. In France, it only took two years for the Leman Lake to be clean again, after the build up of a new sewage system (Leman is roughly 15km*50km*400m). Now it is so clean there are less weed, so there are fewer fish in the lake!!!!
4 : assouan in Egypt is a construction of the same kind, and no one is making apocalyptic predictings about it.
Actually I analyzed the water of the Lac Leman close to shore. We found out it contains quite a lot of seaweeds. Where did you find your info ?
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Old May 8th, 2006, 11:33 AM   #240
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Giant dam to be completed in 2 weeks
2006-05-08

CONSTRUCTION for the giant dam of the Three Gorges hydropower project on the Yangtze River is expected to finish on May 20, an executive with the China Yangtze River Three Gorges Project Development Corporation said yesterday.

"There are less than 3,000 cubic meters of concrete left to be placed before the dam will finally complete nine months ahead of the schedule," said Cao Guangjing, deputy general manager of the corporation.

Construction of the 2,309-meter-long and 185-meter-high dam began in 1998.

Launched in 1994, the Three Gorges Project, including the dam and 26 generators is planned to be completed in 2009 and by then, it will be able to generate 84.7 billion kwh of electricity annually.

Meanwhile, the main part of the underwater museum for the Baiheliang, the world's oldest water survey device which will be submerged once the Three Gorges reservoir is filled, has been completed.

Baiheliang, the 1.6-kilometer-long massive reef important for observing water level changes, has been covered by an elliptical transparent shield so visitors in the future can still see it.

The whole construction project of the underwater museum is expected to be finished by June, 2007.

Located at the upper reaches of the Yangtze, Baiheliang only emerges from the water during the dry season. Therefore, it was a very important marker for ancestors to observe the changes of the water level.

On the massive reef, there are more than 20 fish sculptures, serving as water-level markers. About 30,000 characters of poems are also left on the stone.

The stone inscriptions on Baiheliang recorded about 1,200 consecutive years of the river's water levels during the dry seasons as well as its low water periods.

Xinhua
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