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Old July 12th, 2006, 03:29 AM   #501
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not very likely. Many factors add up to why the area inbetween Midtown and Downtown will probably never fully "connect".
Geological reasons, then there is the fact that ny has zoning laws, there are way too many Nimby's in ny, tons and tons and tonsss of protected buildings.. the list continues.
A decade from now don't expect much difference in that part of Manhattan. I am also waiting for a downtown/ midtown.. boom rivalry of sorts.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 05:06 AM   #502
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From a distance it appears that there is a huge gap between downtown and midtown but, once you are at street level, most of Manhattan feels like one gigantic, continuous CBD. There are countless 12+ story buildings (skyscrapers) between downtown and midtown, and many are much taller than that.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 06:01 AM   #503
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I honestly prefer that gap between Midtown and Lower Manhattan. It would be really chaotic if you have a continious skyline
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Old July 12th, 2006, 06:35 AM   #504
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nygirl
not very likely. Many factors add up to why the area inbetween Midtown and Downtown will probably never fully "connect".
Geological reasons, then there is the fact that ny has zoning laws, there are way too many Nimby's in ny, tons and tons and tonsss of protected buildings.. the list continues.
A decade from now don't expect much difference in that part of Manhattan. I am also waiting for a downtown/ midtown.. boom rivalry of sorts.
Exactly. The bedrock is too deep underground, so it would be too costly to dig a foundation for a large skyscraper. However, if an investor deems it to be a worthwhile investment, that tall building will have very nice unobstructed views of both chunks of the skyline!
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Old July 12th, 2006, 06:42 AM   #505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline
It seems despite intensification in Midtown and the proposed Freedom Tower in Lower Manhattan, the skyline will still remain 2 separate chunks with an empty space in the middle. If only they could spread everything out a bit more, it'll look quite different a decade from now.
hard to say but I can't imagine if the entire island of Manhattan is filled with scrapers.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 07:15 AM   #506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
hard to say but I can't imagine if the entire island of Manhattan is filled with scrapers.
Actually, the middle sections where the gaps are do contain skyscrapers. There are tall buildings along Union Square (14th) and 23rd. There aren't any really tall buildings though like the ESB or 7 WTC.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 07:28 AM   #507
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The never ending debate.

I think it's about time we let the 'big 3' go, and discuss some other skylines.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 07:50 AM   #508
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The never ending debate.

I think it's about time we let the 'big 3' go, and discuss some other skylines.
How about 4,5 and 6
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Old July 12th, 2006, 10:18 AM   #509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline
It seems despite intensification in Midtown and the proposed Freedom Tower in Lower Manhattan, the skyline will still remain 2 separate chunks with an empty space in the middle. If only they could spread everything out a bit more, it'll look quite different a decade from now.
There's a reason for it. As nygirl alluded, it's mainly due to geological factors. New York of course has two skylines. Here's why: Manhattan is composed of very sturdy bedrock at its southern tip, but that bedrock soon gives way to a soft layer unable to support very tall buildings. Then, the bedrock returns again at Midtown. This is why the skyline of Manhattan is so high at Lower Manhattan, only to lower itself significantly, and then rise back up to incredible heights at Midtown.
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Old July 12th, 2006, 10:25 AM   #510
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Old July 12th, 2006, 10:33 AM   #511
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hydrogen
There's a reason for it. As nygirl alluded, it's mainly due to geological factors. New York of course has two skylines. Here's why: Manhattan is composed of very sturdy bedrock at its southern tip, but that bedrock soon gives way to a soft layer unable to support very tall buildings. Then, the bedrock returns again at Midtown. This is why the skyline of Manhattan is so high at Lower Manhattan, only to lower itself significantly, and then rise back up to incredible heights at Midtown.
Yup it's the bedrock. But in the case of HK, some of city's tallest buildings were built o reclaimed land like The 2-IFC or Central Plaza. Does that mean the foundation of the reclaimed land is strong enough to support these buildings?
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Old July 12th, 2006, 04:37 PM   #512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
Yup it's the bedrock. But in the case of HK, some of city's tallest buildings were built o reclaimed land like The 2-IFC or Central Plaza. Does that mean the foundation of the reclaimed land is strong enough to support these buildings?
All tall buildings should have foundations going to the bedrock. The reclamation would fill in the land from the sea bottom and up. Bedrock lies below the sea bottom, so the building's structural integrity won't be compromised.

However, the reclaimed portion settles over time, so the landscaping and staircases on ground level may buckle, but that doesn't mean the building will collapse.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 05:59 AM   #513
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline
All tall buildings should have foundations going to the bedrock. The reclamation would fill in the land from the sea bottom and up. Bedrock lies below the sea bottom, so the building's structural integrity won't be compromised.

However, the reclaimed portion settles over time, so the landscaping and staircases on ground level may buckle, but that doesn't mean the building will collapse.
In the case of 2-IFC, it's still standing despite being built on reclaimed land.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 06:06 AM   #514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
In the case of 2-IFC, it's still standing despite being built on reclaimed land.
Building tall skyscrapers on reclaimed land isn't a problem. The key is the foundation. It doesn't matter if the land is fill above as long as it is feasible to anchor the building onto bedrock. You can have regular land that is not buildable because the bedrock is too deep.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 06:16 AM   #515
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Well it worked for HK even with such buildings like Highcliff or Summit.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 06:31 AM   #516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
Well it worked for HK even with such buildings like Highcliff or Summit.
The big engineering issues for Highcliff and Summit were not so much foundation-reinforcement, but rather a damper system to keep the buildings from swaying too much in high winds. These two buildings are very susceptible to swaying because of their exposed location on the hillsides.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 06:41 AM   #517
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline
The big engineering issues for Highcliff and Summit were not so much foundation-reinforcement, but rather a damper system to keep the buildings from swaying too much in high winds. These two buildings are very susceptible to swaying because of their exposed location on the hillsides.
If that's the case why do they have to build them that high?
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Old July 13th, 2006, 06:57 AM   #518
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
If that's the case why do they have to build them that high?
It's a luxury residential project, and the views are awesome. You can actually see the south side of Hong Kong Island all the way to Cheung Chau from the top levels of Highcliff.

It is that slender height that prompted special engineering to ensure the building wouldn't sway too much in high winds at the exposed location.
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Old July 13th, 2006, 09:27 AM   #519
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline
It's a luxury residential project, and the views are awesome. You can actually see the south side of Hong Kong Island all the way to Cheung Chau from the top levels of Highcliff.

It is that slender height that prompted special engineering to ensure the building wouldn't sway too much in high winds at the exposed location.
I agree with the view but living in the top floors can get scary
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Old July 13th, 2006, 05:46 PM   #520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WANCH
I agree with the view but living in the top floors can get scary
The whole point of the damper system is to reduce discomfort on the higher floors when the winds pick up. Although buildings do sway and that's perfectly normal, people tend to stay home during bad weather, so they'll definitely feel it. Hence a good damper system is especially important for tall residential skyscrapers. On the other hand, swaying is less of a concern for a commercial building such as 2 IFC if there is a typhoon strike because people would be home when the most swaying takes place.
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