daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Development News Forums > General Urban Developments

General Urban Developments Discussions of projects shorter than 100m/300ft. Also, please post all other threads not specified in other Development News subforums here.



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old June 15th, 2005, 04:45 AM   #21
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798





















__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old June 15th, 2005, 07:00 AM   #22
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Single firm for Kowloon mega project
Eli Lau
8 October 2003
Hong Kong Standard

The government will stick to a plan to have only one party develop the HK$24 billion West Kowloon cultural district project.

"We want to ensure that the development will be consistent from its concept to operation," Housing, Planning and Lands Bureau Deputy Secretary Thomas Tso said yesterday. "It's not a development project that simply gives every developer a chance to generate profit."

Tso's comment came after the Real Estate Developers' Association (Reda) had attempted to convince the government to open up the project to small developers as well.

He said it would be time consuming and costly to allow various developers to take part in the mega project.

However, he said small developers would have opportunities, because in Hong Kong, "none of the developers can be solely responsible for such huge projects, but they can join hands with other organisations and professionals to accomplish it".

He added: "We will be glad to see their co-operation."

Under the government's plan, one party will be chosen to be solely responsible for the financing, managing and operation of the project.

The successful company would be given a land grant of 50 years.

"Conflicts will possibly be triggered if too many developers are involved in the construction and management," Territory Development Department project manager Kwan Pak-lam said.

"It's difficult to judge who should be accountable when mistakes occur."

Cheung Kong (Holdings) executive director Justin Chiu said on Monday the project should not be broken into segments and developed by different parties.

This is the first time the government has invited the private sector to run a cultural development project.

The project will cover 40 hectares at the West Kowloon reclamation site, bounded by Canton Road, Austin Road West, the Western Harbour Tunnel and Victoria Harbour.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 15th, 2005, 07:08 AM   #23
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Culture centre envisaged as 'Opera House of East'
Glenda Korporaal
17 October 2003
The Australian

HONG Kong will have a $5 billion waterfront Norman Foster-designed arts and cultural centre as part of its push to become the premier arts centre of Asia.

The centre, to be built on a 40-hectare area of reclaimed land along the harbour on west Kowloon, is planned to become a Sydney Opera House-style landmark for the city.

With a modern, flowing canopy roof design, the centre will contain one 10,000-seat performance venue, three theatres, four museums, an art exhibition centre, a water amphitheatre and at least four piazza areas.

Hong Kong hopes the new centre, which will not be completed until 2010, will become a "cultural icon" that will attract performers from all over the world.

Last month Hong Kong Chief Secretary Donald Tsang called for proposals for the development, which will be built and operated by the private sector.

"We want Hong Kong to be the most vibrant hub for culture, arts and entertainment in the region," Tsang says.

He says the state-of-the-art facilities will "provide residents and visitors with a wide range of cultural and leisure pursuits".

"Our local artists will also have a creative hive in which to further develop their talent," he says.

Tsang made it clear the Government wants the facilities to be "architecturally distinguished".

British architect Foster won the award for the scheme's basic concept last year with a space-age flowing canopy design.

Proposals for the development must be in by March next year, with construction set to start in April, 2006.

Hong Kong Arts Festival executive director Douglas Gautier says the centre has the potential to become a cultural focus for the city along the lines of the Sydney Opera House, the Melbourne Arts Centre or the Barbican Centre in London.

He says it is inevitable that such mega-arts projects will attract some controversy.

"But at the end of the day they do focus the public, the arts community and the business community," Gautier says.

"They provide a focal point and almost an inspirational point for the national companies which perform there."
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 15th, 2005, 07:09 AM   #24
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

ICAC may take part in West Kowloon tender
17 October 2003
Hong Kong Standard

The government will invite the Independent Commission Against Corruption (ICAC) to participate in the tendering process for the HK$24 billion West Kowloon cultural district project.

Chief Secretary for Administration Donald Tsang also promised to submit the master plan to the Legislative Council for approval before taking it to the Executive Council.

"To ensure the decision will be free of political influence, no accountability official will take part in the judging process," Tsang said.

The pledge came on the eve of the deadline for expressions of interest by developers who want to bid for the contract. But the government stood firm on plans to have only one consortium develop the 40-hectare site despite calls to open the project to small developers.

Tsang held a meeting with members of the Real Estate Developers Association yesterday and made it clear to them that the government would not budge on that demand.

"We are doing it for the overall interest of Hong Kong, not for the interests of developers," Tsang said.

He refused to be drawn on what the association's response was, adding: "We don't need their endorsement. This is public interest."

Tsang stressed the objective of the project was to turn the West Kowloon reclamation site into world class culture facilities. The government budget was tight, therefore it was best to leave it to private developers, he said.

Awarding the contract to one developer would ensure continuity and the development would be consistent from its concept to completion, he said. "What is most important is that we will ensure the whole process will be an open and transparent one.

"The team of judges will comprise senior civil servants headed by a permanent secretary. But no politically appointed official will sit on the panel. We want it to be a professional decision, not one which has any political element.

"The government will invite the ICAC to participate and will get Legco's endorsement before it goes to Exco."

Tsang also shot down arguments that it was unfair that a single developer would reap all the benefits of the project.

"This is not a property project," Tsang stressed. "We are not benefiting any developer. The most important thing is we are dealing with the matter in a fair manner.

"Certain developers have proposed that the government should take care of infrastructure facilities, leaving the rest for private development.

"If we do that, we are acting in the developers' interest, not the public's."

Developers who are interested in the project have until today to express their intent to the government.

Under the plan, the successful bidder would be given a land grant of 50 years and be solely responsible for the financing, managing and operation of the project.

This is the first time the government has invited the private sector to run a cultural development project. The development includes three theatre complexes, a concert venue, four museums, a water amphitheatre and at least four piazza areas. Work will start in 2006 to be completed in 2012. The government expects 6,000 jobs will be created.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 15th, 2005, 07:10 AM   #25
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Legco to rule on West Kowloon deal
Chloe Lai
17 October 2003
South China Morning Post

Donald Tsang also says the ICAC will be involved in the tendering process to calm fears surrounding the huge project Legco's approval will be sought before the contract for the massive West Kowloon redevelopment is awarded, the chief secretary said yesterday.

He was trying to calm fears about the amount of power that would be put into the hands of the project's sole developer.

In a move to further calm fears, Donald Tsang Yam-kuen said the ICAC would be invited to join the committee choosing the consortium responsible for the $24 billion West Kowloon Cultural District project. The project, designed by renowned architect Lord Foster, will feature the world's largest roof.

Mr Tsang announced last month that the contract to build a world-class cultural hub would be granted to a single consortium for 30 years. But the proposal has faced strong opposition from architects, planners, artists and academics saying that the area would be turned into a "developer's colony".

Some small-scale developers also objected, saying they would lose the chance to bid.

Mr Tsang said he met representatives of the Real Estate Developers' Association yesterday and told them it would be against the public interest to split up the project.

Approval in granting the contract for such a project would normally be left to the Executive Council alone, but Mr Tsang said that Legco would first have to approve the West Kowloon deal.

He said the one-developer arrangement was the best option as the government was now facing a huge deficit and required the business sector's support to carry out the expensive project.

"Because of the budget deficit, the traditional approach to building such a large-scale project (to be done alone by the government) is not going to work," he said.

Mr Tsang said the selection process had to be fair and transparent. He said no government minister would be involved in the selection process, to prevent the interference of political considerations. The process would be guided by a permanent secretary, together with a number of senior civil servants with different areas of expertise, and officers from the Independent Commission Against Corruption.

Mr Tsang said the government would reveal information about the business proposals received for the project - except for confidential data - and stressed that no favouritism would be shown to big developers.

He said the developers' association had made a counter-proposal for the government to be responsible for the infrastructure on the sites, allowing developers to bid for the residential and commercial parts.

But Mr Tsang said it was not acceptable for "the business sector (to run) the money-making part of the project (leaving) the money-losing part to the government".

He said the continuous nature of the design, stretching for more than 1.5km, made it suitable for a single consortium.

But Hong Kong Institute of Architects spokesman Bernard Lim Wan-fung questioned to Mr Tsang's comments: "Having a selection committee composed of senior civil servants can't resolve the problem. The mechanism set up for this project is still full of flaws."
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 06:40 AM   #26
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

HK Govt: 10 Parties Interested In HK$24B Cultural Project
18 October 2003

HONG KONG (Dow Jones)--The Hong Kong government said late Friday it has received 10 indications of interest for the development of a planned HK$24 billion cultural project.

Almost every blue-chip property developers, including Cheung Kong (Holdings) Ltd. (H.CKH), Sun Hung Kai Properties Ltd. (H.SHP), Henderson Land Development Co. (H.HLD), Wharf (Holdings) Ltd. (H.WHF) and railway-to-property firm MTR Corp. (H.MTH), have indicated their interests to the government.

The exercise was done to gauge market responses for the government. It said actual number of proposals by the submission deadline, before March 19, 2004, may be more than 10 as intending proponents aren't obliged to indicate interest.

The government plans to develop a 40-hectare waterfront site, the so-called West Kowloon Cultural District, into an arts and cultural complex.

While reiterating that the planned development isn't a property project, the government said last month it will allow 70% of the project's total gross floor area be developed for residential and commercial use in order to make the project self-financing.

The government has employed the same financing model before. Construction of the city's railway networks, as well as the Cyberport project, are both being subsidized by income generated from property development.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 06:42 AM   #27
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Architects fear culture will lose out to property
Teddy Ng
18 October 2003
Hong Kong Standard

The Hong Kong Institute of Architects has lashed out at the government over the West Kowloon reclamation, saying it is turning out to be a property development scheme, not the new cultural hub of Hong Kong.

The institute urged the government to set up a West Kowloon Cultural Zone Development Board, which they say should include representatives from the art, cultural and property sectors, as well as legislators and government representatives, to monitor the development of the area.

The government has issued a global tender inviting private contractors to develop the project which covers 40 hectares of land.

Only 30 per cent of the land has been allocated to cultural facilities, while the remaining 70 per cent has been set aside for commercial use to cover the cost of operating the cultural facilities. The government received 10 expressions of interest yesterday. Chief Secretary for Administration Donald Tsang said the government would grant only one developer rights for 50 years to avoid splitting up the project.

However, institute council member Bernard Lim said he was worried that the project would be focusing only on property development as the plot ratio of 1.81 could be altered, allowing contractors to build more commercial premises.

Lim also questioned why the government had decided to award the project to only one consortium.

"This is a large-scale project. How can we be confident that a single developer can handle it well," he said.

Lim said the government could grant the project to several developers in different phases.

To ensure the consistency of the project concept, Lim said a West Kowloon Cultural Zone Development Board should be set up.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 06:43 AM   #28
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Using one developer for cultural hub 'illogical'
Cheung Chi-fai
18 October 2003
South China Morning Post

Architects want an authority to be set up to oversee the West Kowloon project and prevent it becoming a property project Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen has been criticised by the Institute of Architects for his "illogical" refusal to grant the huge West Kowloon redevelopment project to more than one developer.

The group fears the project to transform the area into a cultural hub with museums, theatres and public walkways could simply end up as a cash-driven property project because there are too many ambiguities around the extent of commercial development allowed at the site.

It called for the establishment of an authority comprising all relevant sectors - both public and private - to oversee and scrutinise the $24 billion development of the 40-hectare site.

The institute yesterday said members were unconvinced by the argument put forward by Mr Tsang that it was in the public's best interest to develop the site by a single consortium that will be entrusted to run the site for 30 years.

Mr Tsang cited the need to keep costs down and added that one of the difficulties in splitting the project was the construction of a single roof covering the site.

But the institute said the construction of the world's largest roof, designed by the acclaimed architect Lord Foster, should have nothing to do with the tendering because the roof could be built in phases.

"It is illogical and hard to understand why the project cannot be split. If it is tendered as a single one, there will be just a few competitors bidding for it," said Vincent Ng Wing-shun, a council member of the institute. "The lack of competition will only result in low bids and it is simply equal to selling the bulk of the land at a cheap price. How can we say it is in the interest of the public?"

The institute said the World Trade Centre redevelopment in New York and Docklands in London were both developed in phases by different consortiums.

The group also pointed out that the ambiguities over the scale of residential and commercial developments allowed on the site would affect the eventual size of cultural space available to the public.

It also cast doubt over local developers' expertise in managing world-class cultural facilities.

The government has so far received 10 submissions from consortiums indicating their interest in developing the site.

Bernard Lim Fung-wan, a council member of the institute, said the group did not object to private participation in the project, but the government went to the wrong extreme in its tendering plans for West Kowloon.

"It is such a big swing from the building and running all cultural facilities by the government itself in the past to simply keep its hands off completely," he said. "But there are lots of possibilities in between."

He said the success of the world-renowned Guggenheim Museum in Bilbao, Spain, was the result of both government participation and professional management from art experts.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 07:37 PM   #29
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Cultural hub plans anger lawmaker
Peggy Sito
21 October 2003
South China Morning Post

Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen's efforts to calm fears over the West Kowloon redevelopment have failed to satisfy the legislator representing the real estate sector.

Abraham Razack said Mr Tsang's pledge last week to have Legco and the ICAC involved in awarding the contracts to turn the area into a cultural hub was flawed.

Mr Tsang had been responding to concerns over the amount of control being granted to the consortium that will develop the $24 billion project and be in charge of it for 30 years.

But Mr Razack said: "Legco's role is to monitor the government, but not to award contracts. The government has a central tendering board to select winning bids ... Why should we need ICAC?"

He joined calls for the tender to be split, suggesting separation of the residential and commercial segments, allowing big and small developers to bid. The government could use the proceeds to develop the site's arts, cultural and entertainment aspects, he said.

Mr Razack said he had called a panel meeting for this month in Legco to express his views.

Under Mr Tsang's suggestions, the Independent Commission Against Corruption would be invited to join the committee choosing a sole consortium to develop the project. Developers would meet the government to express their views in December, sources said.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 07:42 PM   #30
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Cultural hub?
22 October 2003
South China Morning Post

Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen has done some tough talking when confronted with property developers opposed to an unprecedented plan to award the multibillion-dollar West Kowloon cultural complex project to a single consortium.

"This is not a real-estate development project. This is not a project for developers, but for public interest," he said.

Mr Tsang was speaking after meeting representatives from the Real Estate Developers Association last week, after the lobby group expressed concern that small-scale developers would be at a disadvantage in bidding for the $24 billion project. It asked the government to consider separating the cultural facilities from the residential and commercial parts of the project.

Last month, announcing plans to invite the private sector to fund, build and operate the project, Mr Tsang said: "We believe if we offer the private sector the chance to finance and build this facility, they will be able to run it more efficiently and with greater flexibility if it is offered as one entire commercial package."

Faced with a runaway deficit, officials have been lured by the idea of giving private enterprise the responsibility of building and operating the cultural complex, meaning the government does not have to dig into the public purse.

In return, the successful bidder will be able to use up to 70 per cent of the 40-hectare site for commercial and residential developments.

Such a move is in line with the goal of the Tung administration to adopt a "small government, big market" approach in running Hong Kong's affairs.

As developers responded with enthusiasm to the lucrative business opportunities which the project will create, the half-empty concert on Monday featuring Jose Carreras and Charlotte Church was disheartening.

The plain truth is that Hong Kong remains a long way from being a vibrant hub of culture, art and entertainment.

Instead, Hong Kong's Canto-pop and film production dominates popular culture in Chinese society. If anything, the disappointing turnout indicates a lack of interest among the populace for classical music.

This is in stark contrast to the heat of the debate over how the $24 billion-worth of contracts should be carved up by private enterprise, which raises fundamental questions about the mammoth project.

With a 30-hectare roof designed by world-renowned architect Norman Foster as its centrepiece, the West Kowloon complex - billed as the "new cultural icon" - is predicted to eclipse even the Sydney Opera House.

The building of first-class infrastructure for cultural events, however, will not necessarily result in an enriched and flourishing arts scene.

Under the self-financing arrangements for cultural facilities, there is also a very real possibility that only programmes featuring popular culture will pass the test of commercial viability.

Defending the idea of a single consortium for the project, senior officials have pledged that the cultural complex will not become "another cyberport". This project has become better known as a property development success, while few people know exactly how it is helping to boost development of information technology in Hong Kong.

Regardless of how contracts are packaged in the future, the West Kowloon cultural complex will be highly valued only when it succeeds in facilitating the development of a rich and diverse arts and leisure scene in the special administrative region.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 16th, 2005, 07:44 PM   #31
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Modern ink painting might get home of its own in cultural hub
Chloe Lai
23 October 2003
South China Morning Post

The world's first contemporary ink-painting museum may be set up in Hong Kong.

Two developers have been holding discussions with Hong Kong's new Ink Society about establishing a museum to showcase outstanding modern and contemporary ink paintings in the proposed West Kowloon cultural district.

Ink Society vice-chairwoman Alice King announced the proposal at a forum of the Arts Development Council, where representatives of the arts community put forward their suggestions for the West Kowloon project.

She said the society had mentioned the museum proposal to Hong Kong's main developers, and two had shown an interest in getting it off the ground. It would be inappropriate to reveal the names of the developers, she said.

"Hong Kong is at the crossroads between the east and west. A museum displaying the best modern and contemporary ink paintings could help people understand the best of their culture while showing them how to embrace the best of western culture," said Mrs King, who is a sister of Chief Executive Tung Chee-hwa.

"Museums are about exhibitions and collections. Holding an exhibition is never a problem, but where do we get the collections? We don't have the resources to compete for Picasso paintings, but we have the potential and advantages to display the best contemporary ink painting from around the world.

"People don't come to Hong Kong to see western paintings. Many collectors from around the world have told us they would donate to our museum if we had one."

Mrs King, who is also director of the Alisan Fine Arts Gallery in Central, questioned whether the government planned to form a board of directors to oversee museums in the cultural district.

"Any museum in the world has a board of directors. This is essential," she said, adding that board members should be government officials or representatives of the community and business sectors.

Hong Kong Arts Centre executive director Louis Yu Kwok-lit urged the government to come up with a monitoring mechanism as soon as possible.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 18th, 2005, 09:44 PM   #32
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Developer lashes out at West Kowloon planning
25 October 2003
Hong Kong Standard

A developer has criticised the government's planning of the West Kowloon project, saying it is not a cultural project but a property project like Cyberport.

Ronnie Chan, chairman of Hang Lung Properties, said the government should develop the cultural side of the mega-project but let developers handle the residential component.

"Cultural development is not a responsibility of the business sector. It is better for the government to develop the amenities centre and leave the remainder to private developers," Chan said yesterday.

He said Hang Lung had not been one of the 10 companies to lodge bids for the HK$24 billion West Kowloon Cultural District project.

Chan also revealed that Chief Secretary for Administration Donald Tsang had told developers not to disclose their views on the project to the media.

Chan said this had angered him as Tsang's words had hampered freedom of speech.

The tendering method was fundamentally wrong, as the content of the tender documents was unclear and the indicated 30-year operation tenure was too long, Chan said.

His comments follow the government's insistence that only one consortium would be chosen to develop the entire scheme.

Smaller developers have been pressing the government to split the project so they can also take part.

In inviting proposals for the project last month, Tsang said only one developer would be granted control to "ensure its concept would be consistent".

Chan suggested the 40-hectare site be broken up and auctioned, which would provide the government with the proceeds to pursue the cultural project on its own. He said he had already expressed his opinion to the government.

Chan is not alone in his protest as fellow developers from the Real Estate Developers' Association had attempted to convince the government to open up the project to small developers as well. The West Kowloon project, to be developed on reclaimed land, will include three theatre complexes, a concert venue, four museums, a water amphitheatre and at least four piazza areas.

It is the second time in a week that Chan has spoken out against government policies.

In the company's annual report released on Tuesday, Chan said Hang Lung Properties might invest more on the mainland if government policies remained unpredictable, a reference to government measures to support the residential property market.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 18th, 2005, 09:46 PM   #33
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Pledge to be tough with arts hub's developer
The official vow is a new attempt to calm fears over the $24b project
Chloe Lai
28 October 2003
South China Morning Post

The government has made another attempt to placate growing opposition to its handling of the West Kowloon redevelopment, saying it will call off the deal if the chosen developer fails to meet its obligations to the public.

There have been calls to divide the massive project among multiple developers, instead of handing it to a single consortium to run for 30 years, as the government proposes. There are also concerns that the goal of the project - to transform the area into a cultural hub featuring museums, galleries and theatres - will be diluted by an all-powerful developer's commercial considerations.

A spokeswoman for the Housing, Planning and Lands Bureau said: "The government can call off the deal even if a provisional agreement has been signed, and there will be very detailed and legally binding requirements on what the project should fulfil in the project agreement so there will be no such thing as the government putting itself in a passive situation in the negotiations.

"The government will only accept a proposal that serves the public interest."

She was responding to the Association of Architectural Practices yesterday, which said the mega-project should be broken down into smaller deals. The association represents half of the 120 architectural firms in Hong Kong.

Association chairman Dennis Lau Wing-kwong said: "I'm not sure if the government has done any homework. It is a very large piece of land and you should be able to break it down into several smaller pieces on construction.

"Imagine how ugly it will be if every building looks the same."

The $24 billion project, due for completion in 2012, will feature the world's largest roof, designed by acclaimed architect Norman Foster, covering most of the site. Would-be developers have until March to submit their ideas, but there is no fixed timetable for the subsequent tendering process.

Mr Lau said the government should form a committee with representatives from the cultural and arts sectors and the community to decide which cultural facilities Hong Kong needs. "The government has the Norman Foster concept, but did it ever consult the artists and people from the cultural sector on what they want it to be? The master plan of West Kowloon has been decided(hellip) But the result may not be what the city wants," he said. "We should start to whole process from the beginning. This is the last major piece of land we have left in Hong Kong - our city cannot afford mistakes on this project."

Earlier this month the government offered to involve the Independent Commission Against Corruption in the tendering process, and said the Legislative Council would have to approve the decision. This was also an attempt to calm fears about the power being granted to a sole developer.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 18th, 2005, 09:48 PM   #34
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Empower the people on land development
29 October 2003
South China Morning Post

Stakeholders must forge a planning process that is more transparent and truly representative As land prices in Hong Kong reach historic low levels, the way land is used is being debated more stridently than ever.

The Hong Kong planning scene is now characterised by confrontation. Long Valley, Route Seven, Route Ten, Wan Chai Reclamation, South East Kowloon reclamation, Central Reclamation and the West Kowloon Cultural District have generated controversy to a level previously unseen in the construction and development sector.

Non-governmental organisations (NGOs), green groups and the mass media have put a stop to developments which are seen as environmentally unsustainable by one side and economically beneficial by the other.

Many NGOs and civil societies are supported by the middle class, who are sympathetic to their values. The same middle, professional and managerial class is getting increasingly vocal, is not afraid of protesting in the streets, and is impatient for what it perceives as mismanagement on the part of the government.

Hong Kong was one of the few colonies which, at the end of the British rule, did not see power delivered to aspiring members of the middle class.

Power to determine land use, arguably still the most precious resource in Hong Kong, is still largely in the hands of the government and the few large land-owning interests.

It is not difficult to understand the anger felt by the professional and managerial class, many of whom are suffering from negative equity in land or property.

This trend for open confrontation and obstruction will worsen. We have seen projects shelved and delayed, writs being served, smear campaigns, criminal intimidation, strong words from the Real Estate Developers' Association, and a rebuttal from Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen.

The gross construction floor area in the private sector being approved by the Building Department has fallen to an all-time low. And in the end we all suffer. What is needed urgently is not only more sensitivity to values such as sustainability and cultural diversity but something deeper, which allows decisions on planning and land policies to be made with consensus in the community.

Can we build platforms on which planning issues are discussed widely, openly and rationally, long before plans are fixed? Many planning professionals were surprised by how many accusations from both sides of the central reclamation camps were based on ignorance or misunderstanding. How did we end up this way after years of so-called public consultation?

Step one, we must change the way planning issues are explained to the people of Hong Kong. The present format of highly technical reports is too complex even for many professionals. Even professional institutes can get consultation fatigue as a result of the heavy tomes being delivered to them constantly.

At the other extreme, the propagandist announcement of public interests (API) and leaflets are strong on rhetoric but too lacking in substance to be credible to anyone. If television channels and museums can explain astrophysics theories to the public in a clear manner, why are we still struggling to clearly explain a waterfront promenade?

If the government blames the green activists for fooling the public, it must act to equip the public to understand for themselves, not as an afterthought or only when there is a crisis, but from day one.

Step two, the government must forgo the colonial habit of talking behind closed doors to a few chosen interest groups, relying on a few organisations to reflect or control community opinion. The events unfolding in the past few months show that many of these organisations, green groups included, are out of touch with the middle class and the grass roots sentiments in Hong Kong.

In the case of the central reclamation, public sentiment moved too fast for traditional institutions and civil societies to catch up.

Many NGOs and green groups remained silent throughout the saga; some of them still cannot believe that the deal they reached with the government could be unacceptable to the public.

Discussions and consensus-building for any major infrastructural and building development must be conducted on a wider scale, proactively inviting and enabling involvement from all the stakeholders.

The government must be prepared to conduct discussions - in forums and in the mass media, on the streets and in the alleys of our city. It should equip its staff in the art of participatory planning and consensus-building.

The Economist last week rated Hong Kong the richest territory in the emerging market, on a purchase power parity basis, with per capita income of more than US$26,800 per annum, higher than Japan, Germany and Britain.

Now the new reality: planning fiascos will not stop unless there is a higher degree of power sharing with the middle class and consensus-building within the community. People of Hong Kong deserve and demand it.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 19th, 2005, 03:51 AM   #35
michal1982
Condom User
 
michal1982's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 712
Likes (Received): 1

come on people lets start building this!!!
michal1982 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 20th, 2005, 07:09 AM   #36
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

West Kowloon bids draw fire
Ernest Kong
31 October 2003
South China Morning Post

A disagreement between developers over the West Kowloon redevelopment project intensified yesterday after Cheung Kong (Holdings) said it supported the government's plan to award the venture to a single consortium.

Small to medium-size developers, such as Hang Lung Group, have criticised the government for its redevelopment plan after Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen said the $24 billion project would be awarded to one consortium rather than splitting it between individual tenders.

A day after Henderson Land Development said it had submitted a proposal for the project, Cheung Kong deputy chairman Victor Li Tzar-kuoi confirmed his company's bid. He said Cheung Kong supported the government's plan for the redevelopment. "It's a government project and we will follow the government's decision," Mr Li said, adding the project would continue regardless. Mr Li said the project, which would have theatres, museums and an art exhibition centre, should not be regarded as a real-estate project.

However, smaller property players are arguing that the project, with a major portion designated for property development, should be treated as a real estate project.

They have urged the government to sell the real-estate portion of the redevelopment through a public tender and use the money to fund the cultural and entertainment facilities.

Legislator Abraham Razack, who represents the real estate sector, said the government had made "no genuine attempt to include small bidders" in the project.

"According to the government's bidding tender, a qualified bidder should have developed at least one project that involves more than $3 billion in construction costs in the past 15 years," Mr Razack said.

"The construction cost for the first phase of the Convention and Exhibition Centre was only $2.7 billion.

"Only Cheung Kong, Sun Hung Kai Properties and Swire Properties would be qualified as bidders under such harsh requirements."
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 20th, 2005, 07:12 AM   #37
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

CS's Speech
Saturday, November 8, 2003
Government Press Release

Following is the speech (English only) by the Chief Secretary for Administration,Mr Donald Tsang, at the First Workshop on a Sustainable Development Strategy for Hong Kong this morning (November 8):

Good morning ladies and gentlemen and friends,

What a way to spend a Saturday morning. I want to thank all of you for taking precious time out of your busy schedules to join together for this morning's workshop. For many of you, coming to the office on a Saturday morning is a regular part of your working week. For others - although I guess not many - a more leisurely Saturday morning may be the norm. But I hope that today's event will be something of a new experience for all of us. I am sure you will find this workshop useful and helpful, and hopefully stimulating too.

Today marks the first step in the process of building a Sustainable Development Strategy for Hong Kong. The task of advising how to put together this strategy has been entrusted to the Council for Sustainable Development, which I chair, in particular to the Council's Strategy Sub-committee, under the leadership of Edgar Cheng.

In a few moments, Edgar and his team will brief you on the background of this task, and on what we hope to achieve at this morning's workshop. But before that, I would just like to take a few minutes to explain why you have been invited here today, and why your commitment is so important to the process of defining how to create a sustainable future for our society.

The concept of "sustainable development" is not easy for many people to grasp. But the core of this concept is simple enough - and that is, a concern for the well being, not only of this generation, but also of future generations. To be sustainable, we must ensure that we provide for a quality of life that will continue to make us proud to call Hong Kong our home.

For Sustainable Development to work, this message needs to be understood and embraced by the whole community. And here lies the big challenge. The principles of sustainability require every one of us to seek ways of living that will enable us to enjoy a healthy, prosperous and just society, where people can balance the aims of creating wealth and pursuing personal development with a respect for the natural environment and pride in our cultural heritage.

To help bring this vision closer to reality, the Council for Sustainable Development has set itself the task of bridging the views of the community and the Government, in such a way as to develop a shared perspective on how to make Hong Kong a truly sustainable city. That is why we have invited you here today, as opinion leaders, as community leaders, as captains of industry and concerned citizens from various sectors, to help us design a process for engaging the community in building a strategy for sustainable development. We believe the object is clear. We believe that we need the help of all of you to tell the best ways to engage the public, to find a way to develop this strategy.

This is not a task that the Government could - or should - perform on its own. We will not be able to build an effective strategy for a sustainable Hong Kong unless we engage the public first-hand in this process. The Council is committed to working in partnership with both the community and the Government departments to ensure that our strategy will not only represent the concerns of the public, but will also be implemented.

Edgar and his team will explain to you clearly and concisely the Council's initial proposals for the engagement process that will form the foundation of this strategy. They will take you through the key steps in the process, and will invite you to debate these processes, and to suggest alternatives and improvements. We do have a completely open mind on this.

But today's workshop is about more than simply defining a participatory mechanism for engaging the community. Rather, it is a crucial first step towards harnessing the views of the community on their priorities for Hong Kong's future, and on how we should address these priorities.

The task before us is to reach out to the various sectors and strata of our society and to identify common concerns that emerge from the debate on our future. Following this workshop, the Council will carefully assess the views expressed here before advising on how best to proceed with the main thrust of the work.

We are very much aware that there is no single set of views or values within the community. As with any other large and economically advanced city in the world, there are differences of opinion and outlook. But a diverse society does not mean a divided society. On the contrary, we must recognise the freedom to express and promote alternative views is one of Hong Kong's greatest enduring strengths. And in the process, everyone must try to ensure all of these competing or complementary views and opinions are discussed in a rational and objective manner, and that there is a mutual respect for different views as well.

There are several issues currently attracting considerable public attention. The reclamation of the harbour, for example, is undoubtedly an important issue that also relates to sustainable development. In this case, it involves striking a balance between two very legitimate societal interests: protecting the harbour on the one hand, and, on the other, providing the infrastructure needed to divert traffic away from the congested Central business district. We have been criticised for sticking to established practices in trying to balance these competing demands. But when we look for solutions, our main concern is to find those solutions that serve the best interests of Hong Kong in the long term.

Similarly, there are times when we have tried a new approach to tackle a particular issue. This, in turn, has led to debate about whether we would be better to stick to old, established practice. Our plan to create a world-class arts, cultural and entertainment district at West Kowloon is a recent example. The government has proposed a new approach, and that is to ask the private sector to design, build and operate these major cultural facilities. Apart from financial resources, the other reason we have chosen this approach is to make good use of private sector experience and innovation in bringing this magnificent project to life. We want an iconic development, and a rich and vibrant cultural district, that is a great asset for everyone in Hong Kong. Not only for now, but for our future generations, were wish this district to contribute towards a sustainable balance in our way of life - a district built and managed in such a way that will not necessarily follow a Government-imposed model, but will represent what the world can best offer. We believe that the private sector has the talent, the creativity and the flexibility to provide this breakthrough.

Understandably, novel architectural and artistic projects always generate heated debates round the globe. Hong Kong is no exception. If I remember, the entrance pyramid at the Louvre, the Opera House in Sydney and close at home, our striking HSBC headquarters, the BOC building, as well as our now-famous international airport suffered intense public criticisms in their early days, without exception. We reckon that to make this project of a cultural district truly sustainable, we must fully engage different sectors of the community. That is why the Government is now taking proactive steps to reach out to a wide cross-section of sectors-planners, architects, arts and cultural groups, estate developers and interested groups in the community. We would like to hear their views and to work with them to make this project the great success we want it to be. And I want to stress that this project does not mean and will not just benefit one sector. It must benefit the community as a whole, and not for this community now, but this community and its future generations. And this will be the overarching consideration when we assess the development proposals submitted by the proponents in the next few months. I hope that all concerned can work together to make this project a great success that will be an enormous asset for the people of Hong Kong for many years to come.

This brings me back to the theme of today's workshop, which is the engagement process that is intended to help us gather and organise the diverse views of our community into a shared vision of Hong Kong's development. As this process unfolds, we will no doubt hear a wide variety of opinions that will challenge established practice and propose alternative ways of improving the quality of our lives. We welcome this input, in the knowledge that it conveys a sense of deep and lasting concern for Hong Kong's future development.

Before I hand over to Edgar, I would like to end by noting that today's workshop offers an opportunity for us all to make a commitment to future generations. That commitment will come through a process of partnership and involvement that will help make Hong Kong a truly sustainable society.

I thank you all for your commitment to this endeavour, and I look forward to working with you in the future to build a Sustainable Development Strategy for Hong Kong.

Thank you.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 20th, 2005, 08:58 AM   #38
panamared
el futuro es ahora
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,040
Likes (Received): 2519

wowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww what a proyect .
panamared no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 21st, 2005, 08:48 AM   #39
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

West Kowloon project may escape scrutiny
Zoning plan will give consortium free hand in development.

Chloe Lai
11 November 2003
South China Morning Post

The government is trying to bypass the Town Planning Board in developing the massive $24 billion West Kowloon cultural district.

In the first case of its kind, the government has put forward a zoning plan that lists most aspects of the proposed cultural district as works that do not require the board's approval. They include hotels, residential blocks, commercial complexes and museums.

If the government effort succeeds, the single consortium that wins the bidding for the project will have a free hand to build whatever it likes, and in whatever manner, without Town Planning Board scrutiny, once it concludes a deal with the government.

The board monitors urban development and normally has an oversight role in all but the most minor aspects of building projects.

Five developers have raised objections to the zoning plan, and they will be heard at a closed-door hearing next month with representatives from the government and the board.

It is understood that the developers, including Sino Land, K. Wah International, Hang Lung and the Real Estate Developers' Association, have vigorously opposed the government's approach to the project.

Chief Secretary Donald Tsang Yam-kuen announced in September the contract to build a world-class cultural hub would be granted to a single consortium for 30 years.

The attempt to bypass the board has faced strong opposition from architects, planners, artists and academics, who say that without scrutiny the project could become a "developer's colony".

The Real Estate Developers' Association and several small developers also oppose the plan. The government gazetted the zoning plan for the 40-hectare site on July 11. It listed most facilities to be built under the category of "column one" of "other specified uses" of the Town Planning Ordinance. Board approval is required for column two, but not column one, items.

Only a few of the works in the West Kowloon project, such as a helicopter landing site and marine and petrol fuelling stations, were put on column two.

In similar developments, such as Cyberport, most of the works are listed under column two, needing board approval.

A board spokesman said 11 objections were received to the zoning plan: five from developers, four from non-government groups and two from individuals.

But the Planning Department said the zoning plan was appropriate since a "tailor-made" approach was needed for the massive project.

The Hong Kong Institute of Planners warns that the plan could enable the project to bypass all statutory monitoring mechanisms.

"This is very dangerous," institute vice-president Roger Tang Man-hung said. "It means the future of West Kowloon will be entirely a deal between the government and the developers. And once they set the deal, nobody can raise any objections."
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 21st, 2005, 08:52 AM   #40
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,491
Likes (Received): 17798

Planners will vet Kowloon contract
Chloe Lai
12 November 2003
South China Morning Post

But they will not be consulted on any changes to the project's master plan The government will seek Town Planning Board approval before signing any project agreement with the consortium that wins the massive $24 billion West Kowloon cultural district bid, government officials announced yesterday.

But the board will not have a role when the consortium amends the project's master plan, if the proposed zoning plan is approved. In that case, developers will need to negotiate only with the government, the officials said. In most projects, developers cannot amend a project's master plan without Town Planning Board approval.

Critics warned of serious and far-reaching implications as the government downgraded a requirement for planning board oversight to a mere administrative procedure, restricting the board's role in the project.

The South China Morning Post yesterday reported that the government is attempting to bypass the Town Planning Board by listing most aspects of the proposed cultural district as works that do not require the board's approval. That includes hotels, residential blocks and commercial complexes.

Eleven objections have been filed with the board, expressing concern over the absence of control and monitoring mechanisms for the project. The deal is twice the size of Cyberport and will be granted to a single consortium for 30 years.

A spokeswoman for the Housing, Planning and Lands Bureau sought to defend the move, saying the planned arrangement for West Kowloon still involved the board but also allowed flexibility.

The controversial project will be raised at Legco this afternoon, and in two weeks Democratic Party lawmaker Wong Shing-chi will table a motion debate urging the government to extend the tendering period and conduct a genuine public consultation on building the cultural hub.

Mr Wong said: "The government's game plan is outrageous. By restricting the role of the Town Planning Board, it can virtually do anything it likes with the developers. It can use the same tactics to hand over the free-trade zone on the Hong Kong-Shenzhen border to a developer so long as someone agrees to take it over.

"With the same tactics, it can actually franchise Hong Kong to a developer. And it is changing the way Hong Kong plans for its development."

The vice-chairwoman of the Conservancy Association, Betty Ho Siu-fong, said: "The role of the Town Planning Board on approving urban planning is a statutory requirement under the Town Planning Ordinance. But the way the government is doing this turns a statutory requirement into an administrative procedure and puts everything under the government's mercy."

The vice-chairman of the Hong Kong Institute of Planners, Roger Tang Man-hung, said: "With a plan as massive as this one and a project that runs for 30 years, there will be many, many amendments. It is impossible to leave it entirely in the hands of the government and the developer alone."

Assistant professor of social science at Hong Kong University of Science and Technology, Ma Ngok, said the government's approach was "very developer-oriented".
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu