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Old June 29th, 2005, 10:27 AM   #21
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Well that is the price Brisbane pays for all that sunshine :-)
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Old June 29th, 2005, 12:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grollo
Well that is the price Brisbane pays for all that sunshine :-)
Its nothing to do with sunshine, the difference between Brisbane and Melbourne are actually quite minimal. Its because Brisbane City Council has a very strict policy on glass buildings. Something which other cities are following with interest - especially in subtropical zones.
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Old June 29th, 2005, 01:58 PM   #23
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^ What about Vision? It's a glass scraper!!
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Old June 29th, 2005, 06:30 PM   #24
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don't forget that Prima is approved @ 223m!! something to watch after Eureka

there's also the proposed 200m Cos on Bourke or 368 lil collins street. i haven't yet made a diagram of this.
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Old July 2nd, 2005, 04:13 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayT
Its nothing to do with sunshine, the difference between Brisbane and Melbourne are actually quite minimal. Its because Brisbane City Council has a very strict policy on glass buildings. Something which other cities are following with interest - especially in subtropical zones.
Glass buildings can be made as environmentally sustainable as any other....it just takes a little money and expertise...perhaps thats what is missing in brisbane....
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Old July 3rd, 2005, 03:28 PM   #26
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^ crap av. 126 Phillip st in Sydney is superior to any new office develpment in melbourne! end of story. All the new melbournes office are great buildings but at end of day there all same construction technique- glass box concrete core or steel framed .nothing out of Ordinary!
Take 126 Philip st, it has a separate floor plate from service cre and 150m high atrium that runs full height of bldg with lifts chamber. Its interior is unique to Australia! Also topped with an incredible 100m architectural feature atop! When Melb gets a an office bldg like this ill get excited.
Also KENS/Westpac is an amazing bldg.
As for residential towers, yes Eureka is excellent (lol at 350m height), and maybe Vic point but rest are same old same old.
also 2 of them have finished construction- 2SBB & QV. youll have to add in Neo 200 & milano.lol

I think World tower is still finest residential bldg in OZ! hey it got 3rd best bldg in world 2004 voted by emporis editors!!!!
its all good! no fights.
Melbourne has one already! The ASX has a massive atrium!
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Old July 3rd, 2005, 04:44 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by wowsim
Glass buildings can be made as environmentally sustainable as any other....it just takes a little money and expertise...perhaps thats what is missing in brisbane....
Given that Brisbane is a world leader in subtropical design and the technology that goes with that I think your probably wrong. Advances in glass and heat sheilding technology are no match for proper design techniques such as use of overhangs, balconies and or other practical devices designed to maximize sustainability. Remember, this is Australia not Europe - we live in a hot country and even though Melbourne designers follow closely behind whats hot in Europe its not really appropriate design for Australia.

I think this is something that will change over time down there, especially given that the world is 'supposedly' heating up due to global warming - Melbourne designers will have to incorporate greater sustainability measures in their designs in order to cut power usage and the huge environmental costs incurred due to large amounts of exposed glass.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 02:08 AM   #28
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Isn't there some new kind of glass that can be manually changed to allow different amounts of light to pass through? Something to do with millions of tiny lenses or something? I thought I heard about them developing it in Dubai. Not sure though.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 03:06 AM   #29
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Melbourne will be awesome by the CGames next year.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 07:32 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayT
Given that Brisbane is a world leader in subtropical design and the technology that goes with that I think your probably wrong. Advances in glass and heat sheilding technology are no match for proper design techniques such as use of overhangs, balconies and or other practical devices designed to maximize sustainability. Remember, this is Australia not Europe - we live in a hot country and even though Melbourne designers follow closely behind whats hot in Europe its not really appropriate design for Australia.

I think this is something that will change over time down there, especially given that the world is 'supposedly' heating up due to global warming - Melbourne designers will have to incorporate greater sustainability measures in their designs in order to cut power usage and the huge environmental costs incurred due to large amounts of exposed glass.

Oh God JayT. i guess you feel that Brisbane not Melbourne is the architectural pioneer in Australia too....If Melbourne is "following" trends in Europe, what is SEQ following? cheap mass produced boxes for Asian investors? I know which i'd rather have...The last i looked it was Melbourne architectural firms in london and dubai designing skyscrapers, not the other way round....
Also, Melbourne engineers and architects have to plan for far more frequent and hotter extremes than those designing in SEQ.
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Last edited by wowsim; July 4th, 2005 at 09:06 AM.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 12:10 PM   #31
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^ who gives a rat's left testicle? ignore it and it'll go away.

good to see that you're consistent in informing all of us about what's happening in Queensland in every thread you post in which revolves around Melbourne Jayt. Here's a tip: we don't care - get over your niggling little insecurities.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 12:19 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AUboy
Melbourne has one already! The ASX has a massive atrium!
yes i know. the atrium is part of 50m podium, not really a match with a 150m void up through a tower with dozens of connecting bridges .but yes ASX is cool though.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 05:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beacon
Isn't there some new kind of glass that can be manually changed to allow different amounts of light to pass through? Something to do with millions of tiny lenses or something? I thought I heard about them developing it in Dubai. Not sure though.
True - they do. I've only seen it in a few places though. There is a pub near me where the toilet doors are clear but when you enter and press the engaged button they go from fully transparent to complete black out - not sure how its done though. Incorporating such technology in a skyscraper would be very expensive.
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Old July 4th, 2005, 05:38 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wowsim
Oh God JayT. i guess you feel that Brisbane not Melbourne is the architectural pioneer in Australia too....If Melbourne is "following" trends in Europe, what is SEQ following? cheap mass produced boxes for Asian investors? I know which i'd rather have...The last i looked it was Melbourne architectural firms in london and dubai designing skyscrapers, not the other way round....
Also, Melbourne engineers and architects have to plan for far more frequent and hotter extremes than those designing in SEQ.
LOL - shows how insular, parochial and completely uninformed you are about things outside your state. I can get laugh at your expense though so please don't change When are you people going to get it into your thick heads that Qld and Vic are very different places and I know that Queensland is a world leader in the field of design with both RMIT and UQ's architecture courses noted for being the best in the country.

@ Tayser - well nobody cares about what you say and thankfully you stay in the Victorian forum and NEVER EVER show your face anywhere else. Its a good thing your so focused on what happens in Melbourne and bury your head with regards to other states because every time you say something in another forum its always in the form of negative and snide remarks - we have all seen it - or is it just in the queensland forums that you do this? Your hate for everything Queensland is obvious - not just to me but to everyone. LOL Tayser we have been discussing it for years on our PM's.

At lease most people on the forum in Queensland participate in discussions in other states and other countries - as I do myself frequently.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 08:09 AM   #35
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could you two (dean and jayt) at least exchange insults in PMs?

thanks.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 08:29 AM   #36
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Having spent a little bit of time in Queensland over the last few months, I must say that there is an amazing positivity about the place. There is a sense that Queensland is on the way to bigger and better things, which is excellent for Australia. Queensland and WA are helping to make the national economy more than just two big southern cities

However, when I come home to Melbourne, I am bombarded by negativity and insecurity. We appear to suffer an inferiority complex when it comes to Sydney, and a defensiveness regarding Queensland. Not on these forums, but in the news and on the street, you're always hearing how 'Melbourne property prices are about to divebomb' or 'soon everyone will move to queensland'. In effect, the more enthusiastic and parochial Victorians tend to become almost obnoxious about our state. This is all despite the fact that although Brisbane is great, and has a big future and an amazing lifestyle, it has miles to go before it can match Melbourne for social maturity and development. I don't mean that to sound arrogant, but Brisbane is just not at the same level as Melbourne yet. I'm sure it will be one day.

Why can't Victorians be a little less parochial, and at the same time, a little more positive about our place in Australia's future? Melbourne is pumping right now - I was walking down Collins Street this morning and it was packed with the affluent and well-dressed, people doing well for themselves. Victoria's best days are yet to come, just like Queensland's.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 08:52 AM   #37
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I would have to agree with you there Beacon, Melbourne is pumping but most Melburnians are oblivous to this. I went to Adelaide over this past weekend, on my return some of my mates happened to be over, and one of them asked how my trip was, I said it was good to see Adelaide, it was nice but small, and he answered back, ".....But isnt Adelaide bigger than Melbourne, I thought we were one of the smallest cities in Australia...." Now he is in third year Commerce at Melbourne Uni, he isnt stupid, he is quite intelligent. Another comment I received at work was, "....Oh Melbourne can't even attract film makers, look at Sydney, with all the movies that are made there...." Hrmmmm he again was from Melbourne, yet knew nothing of our thriving film industry. I would have to say that overall the vast majority of Melburnians still believe we are in great decline, and are very far from parochial, it is some of us 30 and let me state 30 Victorians on this forum out of 5.1 Million that are parochial...now if that is refelected into the greater population I would have to say Victorians and Melburnians, those who have no interest in urbanetics, cities, planning and architecture, would still believe that heaps of VICS are heading north and that our state is quite inferior to others.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 09:47 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by mic
^
I would have to agree with you there Beacon, Melbourne is pumping but most Melburnians are oblivous to this. I went to Adelaide over this past weekend, on my return some of my mates happened to be over, and one of them asked how my trip was, I said it was good to see Adelaide, it was nice but small, and he answered back, ".....But isnt Adelaide bigger than Melbourne, I thought we were one of the smallest cities in Australia...." Now he is in third year Commerce at Melbourne Uni, he isnt stupid, he is quite intelligent.
I find that very hard to believe. The intelligent part.

"I thought we were one of the smallest cities in Australia"?
How long has he been in Australia? At least 2 years right? I wouldn't throw around comments like "most Melburnians" based on the cross section that is your friend.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 11:45 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beacon
Having spent a little bit of time in Queensland over the last few months, I must say that there is an amazing positivity about the place. There is a sense that Queensland is on the way to bigger and better things, which is excellent for Australia. Queensland and WA are helping to make the national economy more than just two big southern cities

However, when I come home to Melbourne, I am bombarded by negativity and insecurity. We appear to suffer an inferiority complex when it comes to Sydney, and a defensiveness regarding Queensland. Not on these forums, but in the news and on the street, you're always hearing how 'Melbourne property prices are about to divebomb' or 'soon everyone will move to queensland'. In effect, the more enthusiastic and parochial Victorians tend to become almost obnoxious about our state. This is all despite the fact that although Brisbane is great, and has a big future and an amazing lifestyle, it has miles to go before it can match Melbourne for social maturity and development. I don't mean that to sound arrogant, but Brisbane is just not at the same level as Melbourne yet. I'm sure it will be one day.

Why can't Victorians be a little less parochial, and at the same time, a little more positive about our place in Australia's future? Melbourne is pumping right now - I was walking down Collins Street this morning and it was packed with the affluent and well-dressed, people doing well for themselves. Victoria's best days are yet to come, just like Queensland's.
I have to agree about the pessimism. After coming back to Vic from Sydney the biggest thing that hits you is how different the media is. While Sydney's is absolutely confident of Sydney's place as a "world city" and often as the greatest city in the world (they REALLY REALLY believe it)
Melbourne's still suffers from a self deprecating twinge. So many columns in the papers, magazines (even the Melbourne Mag) seem to sublty bag out the place, especially on the weather....which is just so absurd. Compared to almost anywhere in Europe and much of North America Melbourne has an ideal climate. It just suffers in Australia because it has a colder winter than the other capitals (14C is positively balmy for a winter average in most of the rest of the developed world) As far as summer goes, its average is essentially the same as Sydney (a little cooler in December, a little warmer in Feb, and drier)
I definately see the insecurity when comparing itself to Sydney, but i dont really think QLD rates in the conciousness of the Melb media or public. How many bizarre tirades has Beattie lashed out against melbourne, completely unprovoked and out of the blue (remember the ripper during the feb storms) that never get a response from bracks or even any of the opinion or commentary branchs of the media. It still has a long way to go to show Melbournians that it is actually a very different place than it was 20 years ago.
As far as parochialism, from my experience there is no difference between the parochialism in the media in Syd and Melb, but Brisbane is on a whole other level. I think it really suffers from not having a Fairfax paper.

@JayT Give up and go back to the QLD forums, almost everything you post is utter rubbish and so heavily biased it doesnt even need to be pointed to (shame on me for continuing to be sucked in)
@Tayser. i should just take your advice and ignore it.
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Old July 5th, 2005, 11:55 AM   #40
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Quote:
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I would have to agree with you there Beacon, Melbourne is pumping but most Melburnians are oblivous to this. I went to Adelaide over this past weekend, on my return some of my mates happened to be over, and one of them asked how my trip was, I said it was good to see Adelaide, it was nice but small, and he answered back, ".....But isnt Adelaide bigger than Melbourne, I thought we were one of the smallest cities in Australia...." Now he is in third year Commerce at Melbourne Uni, he isnt stupid, he is quite intelligent. Another comment I received at work was, "....Oh Melbourne can't even attract film makers, look at Sydney, with all the movies that are made there...." Hrmmmm he again was from Melbourne, yet knew nothing of our thriving film industry. I would have to say that overall the vast majority of Melburnians still believe we are in great decline, and are very far from parochial, it is some of us 30 and let me state 30 Victorians on this forum out of 5.1 Million that are parochial...now if that is refelected into the greater population I would have to say Victorians and Melburnians, those who have no interest in urbanetics, cities, planning and architecture, would still believe that heaps of VICS are heading north and that our state is quite inferior to others.
I blame the media esp the Herald Sun and CH 9 for the very negative focus on Melbourne, when was the last time we had a positive story from these two? All they seem to want to do is bag everything that happens and they always find an angle to make even a good story sound negative.
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