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Old November 23rd, 2012, 03:10 PM   #2221
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And they will update the maps soon. First they update Google Earth (Which has already been updated), then Google Maps.
Updated. They should update more often, it has been 14 months since last update.
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Old December 1st, 2012, 01:19 PM   #2222
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From the motorway opening thread:

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29th November: S9 Chengma expressway Duwen section, Yingxiu to Wenchuan (Sichuan), 48 km.
I think its name the Duwen Expressway (Dujianguan - Wenchuan).

This expressway runs through spectaculair terrain, the mountains are up to 5300 meters high in this area.
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Old December 1st, 2012, 02:43 PM   #2223
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Yeah, but the S9 designation ultimately will run from Chengdu to Gansu border near Maqu, so I named it the Chengma expressway, made up from Chengguan, Duwen and Wenma expressways (The later one planned).

By the way:
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November 25th: From G40 S of Taizhou to G42 NW of Changzhou (Jiangsu, 62 km). I'm sure the Southern half is S39.
And the Northern half is S35. So I found another expressway for my list of things numbered 35, where is the G35 Jiguang expressway among others
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 06:07 AM   #2224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Huo View Post
The newly opened expressways that Google Map hasn't updated yet. Nice work.

https://ditu.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...cfa7,1%3B5,0,1
Interesting! Kashghar-Khotan Expressway seems to be partially openend. I think they should also build a Kashghar-Murghab (TJ) Motorway. That link can easily be developed into a China-Tajikistan-Afghanistan-Iran-Turkey-Europe motorway.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 10:32 AM   #2225
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Quote:
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And the Northern half is S35. So I found another expressway for my list of things numbered 35, where is the G35 Jiguang expressway among others
It seems we have a similar passion (maybe yours could be called "trigintaquintology"). I look forward to the completion of the G42 from Shanghai to Chengdu, and the S42 in Anhui province from the junction of G3/G56 at Huangshan to (and beyond?) Qimen.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 08:16 PM   #2226
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFZANMNIM View Post
Interesting! Kashghar-Khotan Expressway seems to be partially openend. I think they should also build a Kashghar-Murghab (TJ) Motorway. That link can easily be developed into a China-Tajikistan-Afghanistan-Iran-Turkey-Europe motorway.
An expressway from Kashgar to KS border in Irkhestan is planned. It will be the G3013.

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Originally Posted by ForteTwo View Post
It seems we have a similar passion (maybe yours could be called "trigintaquintology"). I look forward to the completion of the G42 from Shanghai to Chengdu, and the S42 in Anhui province from the junction of G3/G56 at Huangshan to (and beyond?) Qimen.
Anhui's S42 will go to Jiangxi border. I'm awaiting for the S35 in Southern Zhejiang, too.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 08:44 PM   #2227
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An expressway to Irkeshtam makes little sense from a traffic-economic point of view. The Kyrgyz side wasn't even paved until 2007. The traffic counts in Kyrgyzstan are only 80 - 160 vehicles per day.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 09:09 PM   #2228
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And in addition, the quicker and easier China <-> Europe connection would run via Ürümqi and the Dzungarian Gate. The days of the Silk Route are over. Historical reasons for a route along Silk Route traces are just that: historical.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 09:21 PM   #2229
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Kazakhstan is currently upgrading the modern Silk Route (see Kazakh thread for that). Much easier considering the terrain in southern Central Asia. Also economically more viable than building roads through the Karakum Desert.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 10:54 PM   #2230
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I still think Kashghar-Murghab-Khurugh-Pule Khumri-Mazar Sharif-Harat-Iran is a better choice and it will boost Afghan and Tajik economy. The route is also convenient during the winter, unlike the Kazakh route.
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Old December 2nd, 2012, 11:04 PM   #2231
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Of course, the Silk road as a link between China and Europe is out of date, but the regional development just has started. The west of China and the central Asian republics still have great opportunities, they are rich of energy and raw materials.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 04:03 AM   #2232
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Quote:
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Of course, the Silk road as a link between China and Europe is out of date, but the regional development just has started. The west of China and the central Asian republics still have great opportunities, they are rich of energy and raw materials.
The case is that transportation from China to Europe is way cheaper and more efficient via sea. The reason for the improvement of roads in Central Asia is that those countries are land-locked, so they need to have good access to sea ports or directly to the trading partners.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 01:19 PM   #2233
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I agree. Which is why there is definite merit in the current approach of a route into Almaty and Central Asia, since traffic into Europe proper will not be sustainable enough to justify expressway construction. Accordingly, China's choice to build the G30 as it did (and not to the Dzungarian Gate) also made sense.

I disagree on the use of the Southern option via Kashgar and the Irkeshtam as being preferable for traffic into Europe. Yes, winters in Kazachstan may be cold, but winters in the mountains that you'll need to cross between Kashgar and Iran are equally cold. The fact that they somehow manage to keep open the Pamir Highway through the winter (while all other major routes east from Dushanbe are closed due to snow) is not to say that that terrain is halfway helpful for a quicker crossing into Europe. Even into Iran, the detour via Almaty, Tashkent and Turkmenistan would appear easier to constuct and keep open during winter. Appreciating of course that the Tajik and Afghan economies would be greatly helped by an improved new trade route via Khorog and Herat, but the countries remain -to put it bluntly- a backwater and have become one for a reason.
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Last edited by -Pino-; December 3rd, 2012 at 03:13 PM.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 03:37 PM   #2234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFZANMNIM View Post
The case is that transportation from China to Europe is way cheaper and more efficient via sea. The reason for the improvement of roads in Central Asia is that those countries are land-locked, so they need to have good access to sea ports or directly to the trading partners.
Its not completely true... there are huge plans with a railroad link from China into Europe through Kazachstan.

This would mainly benefit western China. The further away from the seacoast is the production and the further away from the seacoast is the destination the more reason to go the whole way on the railroad directly from A to B.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 04:45 PM   #2235
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Indeed. Much of Chinese manufacturing is along the coast because of their access to seaborne trade. However, this can shift to western China if land transportation to Europe becomes reliable. Ürümqi - Central Germany is 6.500 kilometer by road or rail and 20.000 kilometers from Shanghai to Rotterdam by ship.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 05:49 PM   #2236
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indeed, railway is more feasible than road transport. The roadway network has a more regional role, rather than an intercontinental one...
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 05:53 PM   #2237
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There already is a small market for trucking between Central Asia and Europe, chiefly from Kazakhstan and sometimes from other republics like Kyrgyzstan or Uzbekistan. Western China is just the next step. It is also known that some central European trucking companies do travel into Kazakhstan.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 05:58 PM   #2238
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Quote:
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There already is a small market for trucking between Central Asia and Europe, chiefly from Kazakhstan and sometimes from other republics like Kyrgyzstan or Uzbekistan. Western China is just the next step. It is also known that some central European trucking companies do travel into Kazakhstan.
In Tehran-Tabriz Freeway, I have seen lots of Turkmen and several Kyrgyz trucks. So yeah that is true, in both corridors. But it is still limited...
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Old December 4th, 2012, 12:53 AM   #2239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Indeed. Much of Chinese manufacturing is along the coast because of their access to seaborne trade. However, this can shift to western China if land transportation to Europe becomes reliable. Ürümqi - Central Germany is 6.500 kilometer by road or rail and 20.000 kilometers from Shanghai to Rotterdam by ship.
Transportation of goods by sea is incredibly cheap. I once heard a figure that merchandise manufactured in China can be shipped to Europe for often as little as 10 cents per piece (it depends on the size of the merchandise of course). No other type of transport comes remotely close to that number. That type of economics means that, even from an inland location in China to an inland location in Europe, shipping for 20,000 km plus connecting transport will typically remain cheaper than chartering trucks or trains for the full 6,000 kilometer journey. You could of course opt for faster means of transport at a higher price, but you'd only do so for specific merchandise.

But if you're in Xinjiang, the sea is almost certainly too far away to remain a real factor in transport. Which is probably where a good railway connection might be of help.
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Old December 4th, 2012, 03:56 AM   #2240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -Pino- View Post
Transportation of goods by sea is incredibly cheap. I once heard a figure that merchandise manufactured in China can be shipped to Europe for often as little as 10 cents per piece (it depends on the size of the merchandise of course). No other type of transport comes remotely close to that number. That type of economics means that, even from an inland location in China to an inland location in Europe, shipping for 20,000 km plus connecting transport will typically remain cheaper than chartering trucks or trains for the full 6,000 kilometer journey. You could of course opt for faster means of transport at a higher price, but you'd only do so for specific merchandise.

But if you're in Xinjiang, the sea is almost certainly too far away to remain a real factor in transport. Which is probably where a good railway connection might be of help.
From Xinjiang's border to a port in Oman sea, for example, Karachi, Gwader or Chabahar, it is less than 3000 km. These are the closest all-year round sea port.
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