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Old August 9th, 2011, 02:20 PM   #2401
modernisti
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My second post! Dresden is absolutely beautiful! But the modern buildings are truly a shame...
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Old August 9th, 2011, 04:16 PM   #2402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modernisti View Post
My second post! Dresden is absolutely beautiful! But the modern buildings are truly a shame...
Well, some people want to have their ideas, no matter what somebody else thinks about it. That┤s the crap in some architects.

~Question~

Why don┤t they rebuild the Sophienkirche? This was also an masterpiece of Dresden, and the only gothic church in the centre of Dresden
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Old August 9th, 2011, 04:19 PM   #2403
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No. Just NO. You obviously have no idea, Skyscraperer. First telling us it's a good thing they've torn down Zerbst Castle and now modernist buildings would be no threat to Dresden's old town.

Just a friendly advice, if you don't know any of the details concerning European classic architecture, it's better for you to stay out of such kinds of discussions.
Why should you torn down the Zerbster Schlo▀?
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Old August 9th, 2011, 04:27 PM   #2404
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Sorry, I meant to say Schwedter Schloss. It was torn down in the 60s and Skyscraperer was trying to tell us that was a good thing to do.
Reference: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...196145&page=27


Back to Dresden's Neumarkt please.
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Old August 9th, 2011, 04:50 PM   #2405
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Quote:
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~Question~

Why don┤t they rebuild the Sophienkirche? This was also an masterpiece of Dresden, and the only gothic church in the centre of Dresden
1) close to the Postplatz, a square which is a architectural desaster and a playground for modernists
2) unlike the Frauenkirche the locals don't have emotional ties to the Sophienkirche, probably since the church isn't baroque
3) reconstructing entire gothic churches goes to far in the current climate. Parts of the society still have to come to terms with the Frauenkirche and the Neumarkt.
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Old August 9th, 2011, 05:06 PM   #2406
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I'm against rebuilding the Sophienkirche at this point of time anyway. There are more important things, such as the connection between both sides of the Elbe through reconstructions at the Neustadt side (city hall), better traffic solutions there, even though this might be unlikely for now.

Besides, they're building a memorial chapel on the Sophienkirche side at the moment.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 11:07 AM   #2407
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Does anyone else think the kulturplast is nice?
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Old August 10th, 2011, 11:13 AM   #2408
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Nooooooo! D:
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Old August 10th, 2011, 12:55 PM   #2409
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You all have to forget about the modern buildings being built amongs the old. Remember...The empty lots are being filled in and at a human scale. It makes for a great streetscape that has been missing in Dresden for 67 years. However I do agree about the plattenbau and for the Kulterpalast....I agree...has no place in the heart of Dresden. That was DDR architecture and there is nothing that can be done about that for years. I am happy with the way it goes now.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 01:53 PM   #2410
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Quote:
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Does anyone else think the kulturplast is nice?
Burn it down, make the ruins explode and dance on the dust. THAT would be nice!
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Old August 10th, 2011, 02:07 PM   #2411
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Old August 10th, 2011, 02:10 PM   #2412
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Aha, just checking... I like it, but I agree it looks bad in the centre of Dresden
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Old August 10th, 2011, 02:55 PM   #2413
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I would go as far as to claim, that the recent reconstruction projects DESTROY the center in a greater way, than the architectural efforts of the Socialist era.
To regain a 'historic' city center with alleyways, squares, cafÚs etc is to a certain extent valuable, attracts tourists and adds social and cultural depth to Dresden. And i wouldn't argue about that.

But there is a heavy downside to it by how the project is carried out.
Virtually all the living-space created in the center is for the upper-class.
By selling the plots, or finished appartments and townhouse units the project is meant to finance itself.
Nevertheless it has horrid consequences for Dresden and it's residents who currently live in the city center (m2-prices reached up to 5000EUR in 2010. 2011 should beat that)

Along Wilsdruffer Strasse or Munzgasse, which is direct proximity, you have GDR-era rented appartments to affordable prices. Not only do those rents rise dramatically, but some appartment buildings are even partially planned to be torn down, only contributing to the fact, that the people of Dresden are driven out of the city center, while the rich, of whom most have no connection to Dresden at all, move in or rent it out to unreasonably high rates.

I'm not from Dresden as well as most of the users contributing to this thread, so i understand how the majority is excited about the reconstruction and doesn't see the downside to it, as they are only tourists at best, and not affected by the demographic change the reconstruction leads to.

Last edited by kamanan58; August 10th, 2011 at 06:04 PM.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 03:42 PM   #2414
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Youa re right about this, but the only answer to this problem is rent regulation in city centres, like in NY or Vienna for example. In Germanys current political climate however there is absolutely no chance for such ideas. Someone, probably WELT, BILD or some Bavarians, would scream "Communism" and kill any rational discussion.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 03:56 PM   #2415
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No, that┤s BS. The wealthy live either in the prosperous parts of the city or the cities surrounding Dresden. Now, if they would move, there still would be new space, now available at lower rates and therefore affordable for more people.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 05:25 PM   #2416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karasek View Post

Youa re right about this, but the only answer to this problem is rent regulation in city centres, like in NY or Vienna for example. In Germanys current political climate however there is absolutely no chance for such ideas. Someone, probably WELT, BILD or some Bavarians, would scream "Communism" and kill any rational discussion.
I agree fully.

@Odoaker: If interested, research to what prices these houses are sold for, to whom they are sold, who sells them and how they advertise it and you will understand, that i'm right about it.
True, that some or even most wealthy Dresdners reside in green villa-style suburbs, and may even today, the point however is, that Dresdners and all-kind of other town people who belong to the wealthy upper class purchase these buildings, and either rent them out to seriously high rates because of the prestige the immobilia holds or reside in them at least some time of the year. Especially Baywobau, which runs all kinds of gentrification projects in Munich, Berlin, Hamburg etc. is deep into the deal. Look i even gave a first hint for your research.

A second thing i can't bear about this project is the faux-facade architecture, where often three baroque-style buildings hold a giant hotel complex behind them. The historic fragmentation of the city becomes a facade itself and that's really not very favorable. People who talk about Disneyland architecture are right to some extent.

A third thing is, that some houses are randomly designed to look historic, but have no real predecessor, therefore adding to the historic falsification of the city.
It may look compelling to the eye, but that's about it, and you can't speak of reconstruction if the majority of the historic buildings has no direct architectural connection to it's pre-WWII predecessor.

As i said before, maybe it looks nice to the eye, the uninterested tourists may buy it, conservative minded people, if they really think of themselfs as conservative should not put up with that scheme and raise their voices, but seem all in favor of the project, and i don't get that at all.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 05:29 PM   #2417
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Lol. Dresden's "city center" that used to be covered by one huge old town is full of commieblocks. Rents won't raise there because of some reconstructions around Neumarkt. In addition, there was just nothing before. Of course, if you increase the land value of this area, the rents of adjacent buildings go up. But hardly many people live there so it affects only a few.

Stop being a drama queen. The positive sides here are immense, while the negative are down to zero.


Anyway: Not everyone agrees to how this project turns out. Many people were engaged in making this a complete valid reconstruction (GHND).
It's not even the investors faults, but the city council's.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 06:02 PM   #2418
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erbse View Post
Lol. Dresden's "city center" that used to be covered by one huge old town is full of commieblocks. Rents won't raise there because of some reconstructions around Neumarkt. In addition, there was just nothing before. Of course, if you increase the land value of this area, the rents of adjacent buildings go up. But hardly many people live there so it affects only a few.

Stop being a drama queen. The positive sides here are immense, while the negative are down to zero.


Anyway: Not everyone agrees to how this project turns out. Many people were engaged in making this a complete valid reconstruction (GHND).
It's not even the investors faults, but the city council's.
It's not some reconstruction, but a whole new quarter, which you claim is virtually uninhabitated lololololol. Do you know how many residents the blocks around Wilsdruffer Str. and Altmarkt hold?
Not intended to cause you butthurt, but there are heavy downsides to the project, most of them allready mentioned by me and surely others before.
Perhaps some are sick of the discussions, but i discovered this project only recently, so there are some things i had to share.
The last thing i want to add after reading through 40 pages today: The Kulturpalast is a great architectural contribution to the city (which can't be said about the rest of Altmarkt) and even fits in with the reconstructed quarters.
If continued to be used for public events and cultural exhibits, the whole city center will gain from it.

And don't get me wrong, i think reconstruction is wrong in the first place. What this geselschaft did, corrupting architectural competitions etc. was unacceptable and i'm amazed how the politicians played ball like this. whatever, you all had this discussions before, no intent to restart them.
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Old August 10th, 2011, 06:30 PM   #2419
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Burn it down, make the ruins explode and dance on the dust. THAT would be nice!
Hell yeah!
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Old August 10th, 2011, 06:45 PM   #2420
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You think reconstructions are wrong in the first place? Oy vey.

I won't continue to argue with you then, don't see any sort of sense in this kind of talk here.
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