Indianapolis Development News 2

[moochie]

Originally Posted by Indyman

Wow yeah htat would be awesome for the city. The thing that stuck out to me was 30 plus stories. lol

I've only heard 30+ stories in articles I've read in past years. This is something that's been put off for a long time now. It only makes sense that they'll build tall there... CCB is about half what is needed as is.. If theyr'e forward thinking, they'll build 40-60 stories.

[moochie]

Originally Posted by NaptownBoy

The architect of this building must have been higher than the heavens smokin some of that "potent noir" because it is the ugliest building in the city. [/IMG]

I read an interview with the architect years ago. Apparently he was trying to do a sort of upside down counter point to the tapering levels of the war memorial. It originally was supposed to be 13 stories, in which case, it may have been more attractive.

[cwilson758]

Upscale care's cost
Clarian's posh, new hospital in Carmel is the latest entry in a race for suburban dollars that is raising concern about inner-city options

At first glance, the new Clarian North Medical Center in Carmel seems like a hospital hidden within a grand hotel.
Patients entering the 120-foot atrium pass by an espresso bar on their way to the examination room. A day spa is coming soon, where pampered patients can get a footbath and tea. And for those staying overnight, room service can be ordered through bedside touch-screen computers.

It's a far cry from the institutional feel that permeates many older hospitals, which have lower ceilings, narrower halls, older tiles -- and perhaps most important to patients, double-occupancy rooms.
But it also underscores a growing reality of health care in the Indianapolis area: If you live in a wealthier neighborhood, you're likely to be close to a hospital with five-star atmosphere.
If you don't, you'll likely receive care in more modest surroundings.
Indianapolis' four big hospital systems -- Clarian Health Partners, St. Vincent Heath, Community Health Network and St. Francis Hospital and Health Centers -- are following the money into the suburbs, contributing to a building binge estimated at more than $1 billion.
And it is improving care in some areas, while raising concerns about rising health-care costs and a possible migration of doctors and health-care services from less affluent areas.
Perhaps surprisingly, the inner city may actually benefit from the build-up as Clarian reinvests suburban profits into its older hospitals. The expansion, though, raises the stakes for hospitals large and small in the suburbs and outlying areas. These hospitals are being forced into a spending race to keep and attract the well-insured patients and offer the profitable procedures that support the health-care system.
From the hospitals' standpoint, changing demographics are forcing them to shift much of their expansion from their urban roots to faster-growing, affluent suburbs.
The reason is simple. It all boils down to something hospitals call the "payer mix."
Hospitals make a premium on the well-insured patients and certain profitable procedures. But they lose a bundle on treating their share of the estimated 45 million Americans without health coverage. They also can lose on treating patients with limited insurance and those covered by Medicare and Medicaid, as well as certain high-cost services, such as staffing emergency rooms
As a result, hospitals increasingly are looking to affluent areas with well-insured residents.
Millions in expansions

Just look around the Indianapolis area. The $284 million Clarian North, which opened Thursday, is just the latest and biggest example of new or revamped health facilities.
There are plenty of other examples on the Northside and north suburbs of Indianapolis:
• St. Vincent this year completed a $19 million renovation and expansion of its women's hospital, which includes remodeled private maternity rooms and the state's largest neonatal intensive care unit.
• Community Health Network is in the midst of a $170 million renovation and expansion on the city's northeastern edge that adds more than 850,000 square feet and includes 282 private patient suites.
• Riverview Hospital, based in Noblesville and facing encroachment of Indianapolis-based hospitals, opened a $20 million Women's Pavilion in 2003 that includes maternity services, mammograms and bone-density testing.
Some local residents, of course, are glad to have updated surroundings when they are in the hospital. Rebecca Holloway, Zionsville, chose St. Vincent Women's Hospital to deliver her daughter, now 19 months old, because she heard about that hospital's planned expansion.
"The decor is not something I think about, but when I was pregnant with my daughter, it was important to me to be somewhere where I had a private room," said Holloway, 28.
At St. Vincent, she got a private room and other comforts. There was plenty of room for her husband to spend the night and for visits from relatives. "It wasn't like your typical idea of a hospital stay."
It was a much different experience from when she delivered her son 11 years ago at an older, Northern Indiana hospital. Holloway said she was whisked from room to room from the time she was admitted to her recovery, where she shared quarters with another mom. "It wasn't comforting whatsoever."
Other hospitals struggling

Much of the region's hospital construction boom is focused on the area's pockets of high growth and affluence. Some in the industry, however, fear that hospitals in areas without those demographics will have a harder time staying financially healthy.
"I think what you're seeing is this gold rush to the Northside," said Tony Lennen, president and chief executive of Major Hospital in Shelbyville, southeast of Indianapolis. "You've got the rest of the state sucking wind."
He said that his hospital, which made a profit of about $5 million in 2004, is headed for its first annual loss since 1989. "Our profitability has just vanished, just vanished overnight," he said.
Almost all of the hospital's 12 percent increase in patient volume this year was from recipients of Medicare and Medicaid, government programs that typically don't reimburse hospitals at a high level. Additionally, Lennen worries that some in Shelby County without good health benefits may be delaying care because they can't afford to pay for treatment.
Despite those challenges, Lennen said he knows he must invest to keep improving the hospital, or many of his patients will drive to Indianapolis for care. Major Hospital has expanded, with a $10 million cancer-treatment center.
Many hospitals worry about rivals coming in and skimming off the most profitable procedures, such as minor surgeries.
In Morgan County, government officials felt so threatened by the big urban hospitals that they attempted to impose a moratorium on the construction of medical facilities in their county to safeguard the financial health of its county-run hospital, Morgan Hospital & Medical Center in Martinsville.
St. Francis won its court challenge, allowing it to continue with the $20.8 million Mooresville expansion that includes new cancer and surgery centers.
Luxury or comfort?

Clarian's Carmel expansion, with its posh fireplace lounges and cherry wood bassinets for newborns, dwarfs any hospital going up in Mooresville.
But Daniel Evans Jr., president and chief executive of Clarian Health Partners, defends the luxurious surroundings at Clarian North, saying the hospital is giving patients what they want. He said amenities are just a small fraction of the hospital's cost, with most of the expense going toward technology and private rooms.
"It's a competitive disadvantage not to provide a level of comfort," Evans said, "and we cannot afford to forego that competitive advantage."
Evans said Clarian is expanding into the suburbs for growth, but its base is firmly Downtown at its three core hospitals: Riley Hospital for Children, and Methodist and Indiana University hospitals.
Those three hospitals still are vital for complex procedures such as performing organ transplants, treating major brain injuries and treating rare diseases in children.
As the suburbs grow, the demand for the specialized services Downtown will grow, as well. "Very specialized patients will stay here," Evans said.
Downtown is seeing its own hospital boom. A new IU Cancer Center worth $150 million is under way. Riley Hospital also is planning a $200 million building project. Methodist Hospital is beginning plans to expand facilities for critical-care patients.
Evans said profits from Clarian North, and its sister, Clarian West Medical Center in Avon, will help fund operations Downtown.
Clarian isn't the only hospital system carefully planning its growth. Like a restaurant chain staking out new locations, local hospital systems are targeting specific slices of territory.
Community Health Network is focusing on growth to the northeast of Indianapolis. "We said we want to own the I-69 corridor," said William Corley, Community's president and CEO.
Community's locations run from its original East hospital in Indianapolis to its Anderson hospital. Community also owns an 85 percent stake in the Indiana Heart Hospital, a for-profit operation next to rapidly expanding Community North.
St. Francis, with its original hospital in Beech Grove, is keeping its focus on the southern half of Indianapolis and its suburbs, said Dr. Worthe Holt, the hospital's chief operating officer.
The hospital recently added a $70 million Cardiac and Vascular Care Center to its Indianapolis hospital. St. Francis is in the middle of a $20.8 million expansion at its Mooresville location.
Elsewhere, St. Vincent collects the bulk of its revenue from its main campus on Indianapolis' Northside and its Carmel hospital. The newly revamped St. Vincent Women's Hospital expects to have about 5,000 births a year, with an additional 2,000 expected in Carmel.
The new Clarian North, however, sits right between those two St. Vincent locations. In fact, Clarian North is catering to many of the same patients that St. Vincent is, specifically women and children.
Already, Clarian has scored a win against St. Vincent. An obstetrics and gynecology group, Women's Health Alliance, has decided to move most of its deliveries from St. Vincent to Clarian North, which is expecting about 2,500 births a year.
St. Vincent Health CEO Vincent Caponi said it "will definitely have an effect on our organization," but he said his organization could handle the competition.
Pros and cons

Experts say the hospital construction around Indianapolis brings many potential benefits, such as improved comfort and upgraded technology.
But there are also risks. One is the potential for overall health-care costs to rise if all the construction turns out to be too much, although it's too early to know for sure.
"There's no way to know at this point and time if there's adequate demand," said Hoangmai Pham, a researcher at the Center for Studying Health System Change who has analyzed the Indianapolis health-care market.
Pham and others are concerned whether enough physicians and their practices will remain Downtown to care for the poor and make sure that emergency rooms are fully staffed.
"There's a declining number of people who are willing to provide care to those less fortunate among us," Dr. D. Craig Brater, dean of Indiana University School of Medicine.
Residents like Janet Cridlin, who lives on the Eastside, are just trying to figure out what this all means for them. Cridlin, 45, doesn't like the mess and traffic hassle when she visits Community North, which is undergoing an expansion to more than double its size. But she said she would welcome a high-tech hospital with cutting-edge care.
It's not just Community North. All around her, hospitals seem to be vying for her health-care needs.
"They're competing against each other, saying, 'We have better facilities that you do.'



LouisvilleJake and I were just talking about all of the new hospitals opening in the Indy suburbs yesterday while he gave me a tour of Louisville.

[eweezerinc]

Originally Posted by Naptown

Here's the pic he was trying to post:



Very depressing, such a beautiful building torn down to make way for a plaza that sees little use.

Oh man!
That building alone would have added a lot to Indy and everyone's perception of it not having enough historical architecture.
What a lost gem.
Passing through and thought I'd give my sympathies.

[gych]

Originally Posted by cwilson758

Upscale care's cost
Clarian's posh, new hospital in Carmel is the latest entry in a race for suburban dollars that is raising concern about inner-city options

At first glance, the new Clarian North Medical Center in Carmel seems like a hospital hidden within a grand hotel.
Patients entering the 120-foot atrium pass by an espresso bar on their way to the examination room. A day spa is coming soon, where pampered patients can get a footbath and tea. And for those staying overnight, room service can be ordered through bedside touch-screen computers.

It's a far cry from the institutional feel that permeates many older hospitals, which have lower ceilings, narrower halls, older tiles -- and perhaps most important to patients, double-occupancy rooms.
But it also underscores a growing reality of health care in the Indianapolis area: If you live in a wealthier neighborhood, you're likely to be close to a hospital with five-star atmosphere.
If you don't, you'll likely receive care in more modest surroundings.
Indianapolis' four big hospital systems -- Clarian Health Partners, St. Vincent Heath, Community Health Network and St. Francis Hospital and Health Centers -- are following the money into the suburbs, contributing to a building binge estimated at more than $1 billion.
And it is improving care in some areas, while raising concerns about rising health-care costs and a possible migration of doctors and health-care services from less affluent areas.
Perhaps surprisingly, the inner city may actually benefit from the build-up as Clarian reinvests suburban profits into its older hospitals. The expansion, though, raises the stakes for hospitals large and small in the suburbs and outlying areas. These hospitals are being forced into a spending race to keep and attract the well-insured patients and offer the profitable procedures that support the health-care system.
From the hospitals' standpoint, changing demographics are forcing them to shift much of their expansion from their urban roots to faster-growing, affluent suburbs.
The reason is simple. It all boils down to something hospitals call the "payer mix."
Hospitals make a premium on the well-insured patients and certain profitable procedures. But they lose a bundle on treating their share of the estimated 45 million Americans without health coverage. They also can lose on treating patients with limited insurance and those covered by Medicare and Medicaid, as well as certain high-cost services, such as staffing emergency rooms
As a result, hospitals increasingly are looking to affluent areas with well-insured residents.
Millions in expansions

Just look around the Indianapolis area. The $284 million Clarian North, which opened Thursday, is just the latest and biggest example of new or revamped health facilities.
There are plenty of other examples on the Northside and north suburbs of Indianapolis:
• St. Vincent this year completed a $19 million renovation and expansion of its women's hospital, which includes remodeled private maternity rooms and the state's largest neonatal intensive care unit.
• Community Health Network is in the midst of a $170 million renovation and expansion on the city's northeastern edge that adds more than 850,000 square feet and includes 282 private patient suites.
• Riverview Hospital, based in Noblesville and facing encroachment of Indianapolis-based hospitals, opened a $20 million Women's Pavilion in 2003 that includes maternity services, mammograms and bone-density testing.
Some local residents, of course, are glad to have updated surroundings when they are in the hospital. Rebecca Holloway, Zionsville, chose St. Vincent Women's Hospital to deliver her daughter, now 19 months old, because she heard about that hospital's planned expansion.
"The decor is not something I think about, but when I was pregnant with my daughter, it was important to me to be somewhere where I had a private room," said Holloway, 28.
At St. Vincent, she got a private room and other comforts. There was plenty of room for her husband to spend the night and for visits from relatives. "It wasn't like your typical idea of a hospital stay."
It was a much different experience from when she delivered her son 11 years ago at an older, Northern Indiana hospital. Holloway said she was whisked from room to room from the time she was admitted to her recovery, where she shared quarters with another mom. "It wasn't comforting whatsoever."
Other hospitals struggling

Much of the region's hospital construction boom is focused on the area's pockets of high growth and affluence. Some in the industry, however, fear that hospitals in areas without those demographics will have a harder time staying financially healthy.
"I think what you're seeing is this gold rush to the Northside," said Tony Lennen, president and chief executive of Major Hospital in Shelbyville, southeast of Indianapolis. "You've got the rest of the state sucking wind."
He said that his hospital, which made a profit of about $5 million in 2004, is headed for its first annual loss since 1989. "Our profitability has just vanished, just vanished overnight," he said.
Almost all of the hospital's 12 percent increase in patient volume this year was from recipients of Medicare and Medicaid, government programs that typically don't reimburse hospitals at a high level. Additionally, Lennen worries that some in Shelby County without good health benefits may be delaying care because they can't afford to pay for treatment.
Despite those challenges, Lennen said he knows he must invest to keep improving the hospital, or many of his patients will drive to Indianapolis for care. Major Hospital has expanded, with a $10 million cancer-treatment center.
Many hospitals worry about rivals coming in and skimming off the most profitable procedures, such as minor surgeries.
In Morgan County, government officials felt so threatened by the big urban hospitals that they attempted to impose a moratorium on the construction of medical facilities in their county to safeguard the financial health of its county-run hospital, Morgan Hospital & Medical Center in Martinsville.
St. Francis won its court challenge, allowing it to continue with the $20.8 million Mooresville expansion that includes new cancer and surgery centers.
Luxury or comfort?

Clarian's Carmel expansion, with its posh fireplace lounges and cherry wood bassinets for newborns, dwarfs any hospital going up in Mooresville.
But Daniel Evans Jr., president and chief executive of Clarian Health Partners, defends the luxurious surroundings at Clarian North, saying the hospital is giving patients what they want. He said amenities are just a small fraction of the hospital's cost, with most of the expense going toward technology and private rooms.
"It's a competitive disadvantage not to provide a level of comfort," Evans said, "and we cannot afford to forego that competitive advantage."
Evans said Clarian is expanding into the suburbs for growth, but its base is firmly Downtown at its three core hospitals: Riley Hospital for Children, and Methodist and Indiana University hospitals.
Those three hospitals still are vital for complex procedures such as performing organ transplants, treating major brain injuries and treating rare diseases in children.
As the suburbs grow, the demand for the specialized services Downtown will grow, as well. "Very specialized patients will stay here," Evans said.
Downtown is seeing its own hospital boom. A new IU Cancer Center worth $150 million is under way. Riley Hospital also is planning a $200 million building project. Methodist Hospital is beginning plans to expand facilities for critical-care patients.
Evans said profits from Clarian North, and its sister, Clarian West Medical Center in Avon, will help fund operations Downtown.
Clarian isn't the only hospital system carefully planning its growth. Like a restaurant chain staking out new locations, local hospital systems are targeting specific slices of territory.
Community Health Network is focusing on growth to the northeast of Indianapolis. "We said we want to own the I-69 corridor," said William Corley, Community's president and CEO.
Community's locations run from its original East hospital in Indianapolis to its Anderson hospital. Community also owns an 85 percent stake in the Indiana Heart Hospital, a for-profit operation next to rapidly expanding Community North.
St. Francis, with its original hospital in Beech Grove, is keeping its focus on the southern half of Indianapolis and its suburbs, said Dr. Worthe Holt, the hospital's chief operating officer.
The hospital recently added a $70 million Cardiac and Vascular Care Center to its Indianapolis hospital. St. Francis is in the middle of a $20.8 million expansion at its Mooresville location.
Elsewhere, St. Vincent collects the bulk of its revenue from its main campus on Indianapolis' Northside and its Carmel hospital. The newly revamped St. Vincent Women's Hospital expects to have about 5,000 births a year, with an additional 2,000 expected in Carmel.
The new Clarian North, however, sits right between those two St. Vincent locations. In fact, Clarian North is catering to many of the same patients that St. Vincent is, specifically women and children.
Already, Clarian has scored a win against St. Vincent. An obstetrics and gynecology group, Women's Health Alliance, has decided to move most of its deliveries from St. Vincent to Clarian North, which is expecting about 2,500 births a year.
St. Vincent Health CEO Vincent Caponi said it "will definitely have an effect on our organization," but he said his organization could handle the competition.
Pros and cons

Experts say the hospital construction around Indianapolis brings many potential benefits, such as improved comfort and upgraded technology.
But there are also risks. One is the potential for overall health-care costs to rise if all the construction turns out to be too much, although it's too early to know for sure.
"There's no way to know at this point and time if there's adequate demand," said Hoangmai Pham, a researcher at the Center for Studying Health System Change who has analyzed the Indianapolis health-care market.
Pham and others are concerned whether enough physicians and their practices will remain Downtown to care for the poor and make sure that emergency rooms are fully staffed.
"There's a declining number of people who are willing to provide care to those less fortunate among us," Dr. D. Craig Brater, dean of Indiana University School of Medicine.
Residents like Janet Cridlin, who lives on the Eastside, are just trying to figure out what this all means for them. Cridlin, 45, doesn't like the mess and traffic hassle when she visits Community North, which is undergoing an expansion to more than double its size. But she said she would welcome a high-tech hospital with cutting-edge care.
It's not just Community North. All around her, hospitals seem to be vying for her health-care needs.
"They're competing against each other, saying, 'We have better facilities that you do.'



LouisvilleJake and I were just talking about all of the new hospitals opening in the Indy suburbs yesterday while he gave me a tour of Louisville.

Hopefully Jake clued you in a bit so you can quit making snide remarks.

[cwilson758]

Originally Posted by gych

Hopefully Jake clued you in a bit so you can quit making snide remarks.

Unfortunately, you are still around here, so that won't happen!

[gych]

Lol, you are pathetic Cwilson. What will your next flaming remark be?

Carry on people....

[colts0315]

What is with the negativity in these forums? This is where people exchange ideas and talk about the positive things we can do to improve our cities, whether it be Louisville, Indianapolis, or New York. Cwilson has provided some very good ideas and inside info. From the posts i've read of yours, Louisville Jake, it sounds like you've contributed nothing and are just looking to make jabs at people. So, I'm asking you, on behalf of the many decent people of these forums, to never post again. Thank you. By the way, I think Louisville is a very nice city...love the Humana building.

[colts0315]

Sorry LouisvilleJake, I meant gych...

[cwilson758]

I will admit that I like to get under Gych's skin. It is very simple to do and thus, enjoyable for me. I do find it humorous how easily offended he gets and therefore it appears as if I take it out on the City, rather than the poster. Other than a few snide comments meant to gat at Gych, you will not find me bad-mouthing the city or saying that it "sucks." I actually think that the City is a diamond in the rough and its best days are still yet not realized. I comment on Louisville because outside of Chicago, it is the nearest city I have visited the most.

That being said, Gych is of a different breed...a much different breed. His obsession with Indianapolis and Nashville are at best, weird. Just about every other thread, he makes reference to one of these 2 cities when trying to elevate his own. I have said it since day one, he should focus on what makes Louisville great and distinct and make that a priority instead of trying to make Louisville better by bashing its nearest neighbors.

[gych]

Whatever, man. You are the one obsessed. Always meddling in our Louisville forum and trying to make backhanded slaps. No Indy forumer would let me take cheap shots at Indy, and I wouldnt, unless enticed by cwilson. So I respond knocking Indy.

Corey, if you offered constructive advice and something intelligent to our forum like you do for Indy, it would be fine. However, in the Louisville forum, you post nonsense or rigged and inflammatory statements--most of them completely out of the blue. You wholeheartedly admit this. So, I respond with nonsense and backhanded jabs as well--its only fair.

And to the guy who told me not to post...nice try. I will post all I want. I apologize to any Indy forumers who dont come in our Lville thread and make backhanded jabs (all of you but Cwilson). But if Corey would just calm out and post normal stuff, I would never mention Indy again. Honestly, I don't care what happens in Indy, however I do enjoy seeing the entire KY/Indiana region prosper.

Personally, Indy left a distaste in my mouth. Its a fine city with a lot going for it, but it wasn't my cup of tea. It had a different "culture" than what I was looking for. That is why I chose to live where I do, even though I am a native Hoosier and still follow state news and news back home as well.

So, lets just leave it at that, unless of course, Corey decides he still wants to make jabs.

[MilwaukeeMark]

Wow. This forum's got drama!

[thehoss257]

Can anyone give me any additional information on the progress of the regional transit tax that was discussed earlier in this forum? There is a Regional Transit System Summit on Wednesday and I would like to know more about this issue before attending.

Here is the info on the Summit:

Regional Transportation Summit
Public Open House
Wednesday, December 7, 2005
5:30pm – 7:30pm
[Come anytime during the Open House hours]
Old National Bank Grand Hall
Indiana State Fairgrounds
38th Street & Fall Creek Parkway
Sponsored by the Indianapolis Metropolitan Planning
Organization (MPO)

[indyfiend]

Gych- What exactly did you mean by "different culture"? I'm not trying to pick a fight, I'm just curious. Are there big cultural differences between Indy and Louisville?

[gych]

^I won't go there. Its just different. You would have to live in both cities; the cities give off different vibes. Not a bad thing for either, they are just very different, despite the fact that they are similar, if that makes any sense?

[cwilson758]

I am going to an IRT Council Meeting tomorrow, but I doubt I attend the open house...actually, I know I wont. Our Historic District has its hearing at the same time.

[indyfiend]

Fair enough. I just didn't know if there was anything specific that made a difference. I think a lot of it has to do with Louisville being a river town. Even some of the smaller river towns in southern Indiana have a distinct feel to them.

[colts0315]

I think the Artsgarden is a unique example of architecture. Is there anything else like it in another city? Many cities have landmarks or structure that they are know for. I always thought that the artsgarden would become something like that. Also, does OneAmerica (former AUL) still own the city block to the north of their building? I think I remember talk of them building another high-rise on that parcel. Any news on developing that block? It would be nice to see a surface parking lot replace with a new tall building.

[KM1410]

Originally Posted by colts0315

I think the Artsgarden is a unique example of architecture. Is there anything else like it in another city? Many cities have landmarks or structure that they are know for. I always thought that the artsgarden would become something like that. Also, does OneAmerica (former AUL) still own the city block to the north of their building? I think I remember talk of them building another high-rise on that parcel. Any news on developing that block? It would be nice to see a surface parking lot replace with a new tall building.

I like the Artsgarden, but its not an original design. It looks like a copy of Pelli's Wintergarden in NYC.

As for the empty lot OneAmerica owns, I havent heard of any talk of the rumored second tower in years.

[KM1410]

Originally Posted by thehoss257

Can anyone give me any additional information on the progress of the regional transit tax that was discussed earlier in this forum? There is a Regional Transit System Summit on Wednesday and I would like to know more about this issue before attending.

Here is the info on the Summit:

Regional Transportation Summit
Public Open House
Wednesday, December 7, 2005
5:30pm – 7:30pm
[Come anytime during the Open House hours]
Old National Bank Grand Hall
Indiana State Fairgrounds
38th Street & Fall Creek Parkway
Sponsored by the Indianapolis Metropolitan Planning
Organization (MPO)

Unfortunately I wont be able to make it, but if you end up going, let us know how it goes.